Falcons vs Seahawks score predictions

[DHoey]

For what?

To make Seattle run an actual play or punt. There was something like 6 seconds left

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Fine. But if you grant a coach a red flag for a penalty, then the opposing coach should be allowed to throw a red flag to take a look at what every player on the opposing side did on the play in case there's an offsetting penalty.

And in this case, there would have been one.

No just like any challenge you have to determine what you're challenging. You can't just say I'm reviewing everything.

 

[SonnyCID]

No just like any challenge you have to determine what you're challenging. You can't just say I'm reviewing everything.

Ok. So, just ask your players, "who got away with one" and 90% of the time you'll come up with something.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

I think inside 2 mins...the ability to challenge PI call or non call would be okay, but I wouldn't expect many reversals.

The intent of the NFL is to get calls non-calls correct. Not holding on the line, or someone wearing the wrong colored cleats.
These plays are game deciding calls/non calls. They should be reviewed. There is incidental contact which shouldn't be reversed. But PI like last nights would likely get overturned and rightly so. Not because it was against the Hawks, but because it's the right thing to do.

 

[SonnyCID]

If Jones makes the catch, are you guys calling for a rule change due to Jones missed hands to face flag?

Somehow, I doubt it.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Ok. So, just ask your players, "who got away with one" and 90% of the time you'll come up with something.

Ok you're taking this to the umpteenth degree. What it, what if... It's a slippery slope. NFL do the right thing.

 

[WizardHawk]

Man, so much crying over this.

Yes, it was PI and should have been called if seen. That's a fact as PI is described by the rules. There is no debate on that. It was by rule PI. And you don't not call it because of hand checking or hands to the face prior, you call both if they existed. Be consistent. That's all anyone wants out of the refs.

It is also true that there were missed calls the other way that game including the one that should have been called on whoever was covering Kearse earlier. Guess what guys, missed calls are a part of the game. This happens.

The Falcons can look at turning the ball over twice on the road as a reason they lost. They allowed Seattle to score to take the lead so put some on the defense in the 4th. You can't do that and win in the NFL. They didn't get jobbed any more than every other team that cries over bad calls or no calls at the end of games.

You play to get enough lead to remove the chance for the other team to come back or allow bad calls to make you lose the game. That's the NFL.

 

[SonnyCID]

Ok you're taking this to the umpteenth degree. What it, what if... It's a slippery slope. NFL do the right thing.

I'm just saying what will happen. You think BB is going take a retroactive flag laying down? Hell no, he's going to find out who got away with one, and challenge that.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

If Jones makes the catch, are you guys calling for a rule change due to Jones missed hands to face flag?

Somehow, I doubt it.

Please that's contact at the line, Sherm gets away with it more than opposing players getting the best of him. Sherm was beat off the line by a powerful receiver. Most WRs can't throw him out of the way like JJ did. I saw someone posted the hands to the face penalty. If that was the case stiff arms would be illegal.

 

[SonnyCID]

Please that's contact at the line, Sherm gets away with it more than opposing players getting the best of him. Sherm was beat off the line by a powerful receiver. Most WRs can't throw him out of the way like JJ did. I saw someone posted the hands to the face penalty. If that was the case stiff arms would be illegal.

Hands to the face is not the same as hand checking at the line. And it's a penalty whether you agree or not.

And rules are different for ball carriers, stiff arms are one of them.

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

Please that's contact at the line, Sherm gets away with it more than opposing players getting the best of him. Sherm was beat off the line by a powerful receiver. Most WRs can't throw him out of the way like JJ did. I saw someone posted the hands to the face penalty. If that was the case stiff arms would be illegal.

Stiff arms to the face by a player with the ball in his possession is allowed as long as you don't grab the face mask. Hands to the face to a player without the ball, is not.

And regardless of your newfound Atlanta homerism NWPATS, where was the PI on Kearse in the end zone (just as blatant) that would've resulted in a a) likely TD and b) not a missed field goal?

I dunno what it is with Seattle in the final minutes, but I love how everyone turns a blind eye to all the BS calls that Seattle got hosed with earlier in the game. Same thing with the stupid fail mary. Nice PI call on Kam which resulted in GBs ONLY TD that would've resulted in a punt on 4th and 3.

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

Please that's contact at the line, Sherm gets away with it more than opposing players getting the best of him. Sherm was beat off the line by a powerful receiver. Most WRs can't throw him out of the way like JJ did. I saw someone posted the hands to the face penalty. If that was the case stiff arms would be illegal.

Contact in the 1st 5 yards is fine, smacking a guy upside the head to the face mask starting a play I don't think is legal ... Also with a stiff arm you already have possession of the ball so your not smacking a coverage guy out of position ...

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Man, so much crying over this.

Yes, it was PI and should have been called if seen. That's a fact as PI is described by the rules. There is no debate on that. It was by rule PI. And you don't not call it because of hand checking or hands to the face prior, you call both if they existed. Be consistent. That's all anyone wants out of the refs.

It is also true that there were missed calls the other way that game including the one that should have been called on whoever was covering Kearse earlier. Guess what guys, missed calls are a part of the game. This happens.

The Falcons can look at turning the ball over twice on the road as a reason they lost. They allowed Seattle to score to take the lead so put some on the defense in the 4th. You can't do that and win in the NFL. They didn't get jobbed any more than every other team that cries over bad calls or no calls at the end of games.

You play to get enough lead to remove the chance for the other team to come back or allow bad calls to make you lose the game. That's the NFL.

All very good points. But I'd add to the consistency piece. There are calls or no calls on the linemen and the LOS. There are calls or no calls on taunting. There are calls or no calls on PI. All are different. Sometimes a crew will call lots of holding. That doesn't equate to PI. So IMHO by all means keep it consistent.

 

[dkmightyhammer]

The intent of the NFL is to get calls non-calls correct. Not holding on the line, or someone wearing the wrong colored cleats.
These plays are game deciding calls/non calls. They should be reviewed. There is incidental contact which shouldn't be reversed. But PI like last nights would likely get overturned and rightly so. Not because it was against the Hawks, but because it's the right thing to do.

They've been allowing coaches to challenge PI in the CFL for a couple seasons now. I think it's been ok. Some calls/non-call have been overturned. I've always thought you should be able to review absolutely anything if you want. You still only get two challenges and if you want to waste them on something stupid or hard to challenge then so be it. I'm not 100% sure the ref would have overturned the Sherman play, maybe 50/50 chance it gets overturned.

 

[WizardHawk]

All very good points. But I'd add to the consistency piece. There are calls or no calls on the linemen and the LOS. There are calls or no calls on taunting. There are calls or no calls on PI. All are different. Sometimes a crew will call lots of holding. That doesn't equate to PI. So IMHO by all means keep it consistent.

There is a difference particularly late in games on calls that aren't material to the outcome of the play. That is an O lineman lining up 6 inches too deep or the motion man moving a half yard forward in motion and wasn't involved in the play. Call those in the first quarter, but hold that flag in the last 2 minutes. But call EVERYTHING that has some actual impact on that play. That's really what people want. The teams want that. The fans want that. We don't want the refs making judgement calls like that 'batted ball' thing against the Lions last year.

Follow the letter of the rules and do it every time. Make sure that the small stuff you call actually had some impact on that play late in the game. These two things shouldn't be that hard and yet the league has never gotten them right. At least not consistently.

 

[WizardHawk]

They've been allowing coaches to challenge PI in the CFL for a couple seasons now. I think it's been ok. Some calls/non-call have been overturned. I've always thought you should be able to review absolutely anything if you want. You still only get two challenges and if you want to waste them on something stupid or hard to challenge then so be it. I'm not 100% sure the ref would have overturned the Sherman play, maybe 50/50 chance it gets overturned.

No, if they reviewed that last play it's 100% they would call/enforce a PI. Sherman hooked his off hand pulling down on him and preventing him from being able to complete a catchable ball. Jones touched the ball with his other hand. That was PI all day, every day. BUT Sherman did it in such a way as to sort of hide it. With the other DB running in and Sherman having his other hand up high it wasn't easy for anyone in real time many yards away to see it. It was a brilliant PI, but it was in fact a PI. And I don't get how anyone can argue otherwise.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Contact in the 1st 5 yards is fine, smacking a guy upside the head to the face mask starting a play I don't think is legal ... Also with a stiff arm you already have possession of the ball so your not smacking a coverage guy out of position ...

Ok for all the overly dramatic Hawk fans. I've heard it called a punch. I've heard it called smacked upside the head...I've watched that play over and over again from the one angle I have. JJ jukes Sherman inside which gets Sherman off balance. Shermans body lowers as he tries to regain, Sherman throws an arm out to slow JJ. JJ pushes Sherman away. I can't see if JJ actually made contact with the head? It's certainly not blatant and not in line with the intent of the rule. So amazing most Hawk fans can see a punch (maybe they have other angles). But so many say the LJ running down the sideline with Dan Quinn couldn't see JJs arm being held. Or many Hawk fans originally saying it wasn't PI. Good to see some have changed their mind or were willing to admit it was PI from the start.

Again this call non-call shouldn't be the deciding factor in a game.

 

[WizardHawk]

If Jones makes the catch, are you guys calling for a rule change due to Jones missed hands to face flag?

Somehow, I doubt it.

This is another thing the league misses a lot. We all talk about the end of pass plays and defensive PI/Holding, but IMO they miss a LOT more offensive pushing off/hands to the face/etc. Particularly by the league stars. I've seen that so much I just take it for granted. The rules say you can't do that and yet they really do little to enforce it.

 

[SonnyCID]

This is another thing the league misses a lot. We all talk about the end of pass plays and defensive PI/Holding, but IMO they miss a LOT more offensive pushing off/hands to the face/etc. Particularly by the league stars. I've seen that so much I just take it for granted. The rules say you can't do that and yet they really do little to enforce it.

Fantasy stats = $


The refs even position themselves so they can focus on defenders rather than offensive players.

 

[dkmightyhammer]

No, if they reviewed that last play it's 100% they would call/enforce a PI. Sherman hooked his off hand pulling down on him and preventing him from being able to complete a catchable ball. Jones touched the ball with his other hand. That was PI all day, every day. BUT Sherman did it in such a way as to sort of hide it. With the other DB running in and Sherman having his other hand up high it wasn't easy for anyone in real time many yards away to see it. It was a brilliant PI, but it was in fact a PI. And I don't get how anyone can argue otherwise.

I don't disagree that it was penalty. I've said so in this thread. But I've been wrong so many times about what I thought the refs would do when they reviewed something that I'm not willing to say I'm 100% sure what they'd do in that situation. For all I know the ref might consider that hand fighting since they were both in a position to make a play for the ball. I doubt it but who knows? And on a subjective type of call like that I think refs don't like to go away from the call of the other refs on the field. In this case they probably would have, but with the weirdness of officiating in the past 2 or 3 years would anyone bet their life on it?