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2024 Rosterbation

calsnowskier

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I doubt we get Montgomery. I haven't heard us linked to him. Though there were no rumors around rodon or cueto either
 

sf1giantfan

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I believe Borass is the agent to Chapman, Bellinger and Snell, so we would pay top dollar for any of them.

I think the front office will get someone just to appease some Giants fans even if it isn’t a great fit.
 

calsnowskier

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I believe Borass is the agent to Chapman, Bellinger and Snell, so we would pay top dollar for any of them.

I think the front office will get someone just to appease some Giants fans even if it isn’t a great fit.
That’s the spot they put themselves in by telling everyone that they would be leading off the off season with a grand slam.
 

tzill

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That is pretty extreme. Giants' fans have shown that they come out when a winning team is built. Putting mediocre teams, like the last few seasons, hasn't helped attendance. Why continue to build mediocre teams? That lengthens out the time to an inevitable rebuild and still loses fans.
It is extreme; so is a tear down or passing on all FAs.

that was my point
 

LHG

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It is extreme; so is a tear down or passing on all FAs.

that was my point
IMHO, losing a generation of fans over a 3 to 5 year rebuild seems much more extreme than passing on all FAs and a tear down. I think that the Field of Dreams mantra fits here - "If you build it, they will come". Sure, it may be a couple of lean years in attendance but if the fans are that fickle, they'll come back when the team starts winning again.
 

calsnowskier

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IMHO, losing a generation of fans over a 3 to 5 year rebuild seems much more extreme than passing on all FAs and a tear down. I think that the Field of Dreams mantra fits here - "If you build it, they will come". Sure, it may be a couple of lean years in attendance but if the fans are that fickle, they'll come back when the team starts winning again.
I spelled out my plan during Bum’s final season. And if THAT plan were followed, we would be IN the “next era” of Giants baseball already instead of floundering in sub-mediocrity AGAIN. But ownership wanted to milk Bums final few starts for the extra 5k asses in seats per instead of making the smart baseball move and smarter investment move by trading him. Remember, Bum was sour towards the org at that time. He hinted to it at his DBack presser and was going to talk about it further before the world shut down. The Giants had to know his tenure in SF was over. All the fans knew it.
 

filosofy29

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I spelled out my plan during Bum’s final season. And if THAT plan were followed, we would be IN the “next era” of Giants baseball already instead of floundering in sub-mediocrity AGAIN. But ownership wanted to milk Bums final few starts for the extra 5k asses in seats per instead of making the smart baseball move and smarter investment move by trading him. Remember, Bum was sour towards the org at that time. He hinted to it at his DBack presser and was going to talk about it further before the world shut down. The Giants had to know his tenure in SF was over. All the fans knew it.
My memory is fuzzy, (so take this with a boulder like grain of salt), but I thought it was more that Zaidi was trying to do both…satisfy the fans and do Bochy a solid in his final year and try and get some lottery tickets too. I’m sure $ factored in a ton, but I think if Gabe Lackeekler was already under the helm they’d have done the full sell. Plus, again, iirc, I don’t think selling Bum would have netted that much at the time to make it compelling. But alas, I don’t always trust my memory much anymore. :heh:
 

calsnowskier

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My memory is fuzzy, (so take this with a boulder like grain of salt), but I thought it was more that Zaidi was trying to do both…satisfy the fans and do Bochy a solid in his final year and try and get some lottery tickets too. I’m sure $ factored in a ton, but I think if Gabe Lackeekler was already under the helm they’d have done the full sell. Plus, again, iirc, I don’t think selling Bum would have netted that much at the time to make it compelling. But alas, I don’t always trust my memory much anymore. :heh:
I don’t tend to agree with this take, because they sat on Rodon as well, when he made it abundantly clear he hated Gabe and wasn’t coming back.
 

LHG

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I don’t tend to agree with this take, because they sat on Rodon as well, when he made it abundantly clear he hated Gabe and wasn’t coming back.
The standard line I've seen on situations like this were that the team looked into it but the return wasn't great because guys in their walk years wouldn't get a good return. Plus, the team always seemed to play its best around the trade deadline, which made the PR aspect more difficult to ship off a player like that. FZ, as filo mentioned, seemed to try the wire walk of staying "competitive" while also reloading. The results are, not surprising, mediocre.
 

LHG

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I would rather just kick the tires on Snell.
It depends on the length of the deal. Yes, he has a high ceiling. He also has a low floor. I wouldn't want to be stuck with him for 5 or more seasons. He isn't consistent enough and he is getting older for a pitcher. He won't be good the entire time of the deal. But maybe, if he can just churn out one Cy Young season, it would possibly be worth a 3 or 4 year deal.
 

sf1giantfan

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It depends on the length of the deal. Yes, he has a high ceiling. He also has a low floor. I wouldn't want to be stuck with him for 5 or more seasons. He isn't consistent enough and he is getting older for a pitcher. He won't be good the entire time of the deal. But maybe, if he can just churn out one Cy Young season, it would possibly be worth a 3 or 4 year deal.
I think someone will offer him at least a 5 year (minimum deal) and borass will demand it. I’m just hoping the FO doesn’t go for that to make some fans happy.
 

LHG

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I think someone will offer him at least a 5 year (minimum deal) and borass will demand it. I’m just hoping the FO doesn’t go for that to make some fans happy.
Keep forgetting that he is represented by Boras. That means Snell is likely to last through to February and will get way overpaid or take a pillow contract. I'd be okay with a pillow contract.
 

LHG

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Wow, there is so much to unpack on this article.
First, it echoes my earlier statement that the market for Snell (as well as Montgomery) could last through February since both are Boras' clients.
Second, @calsnowskier , this does link the Giants to Montgomery. So there is at least some rumblings that they are looking at him.
Third, it outlines the reasons for my concerns regarding Snell and suggests that the market may not be as robust for him as for Montgomery. Montgomery's consistency (which I would value. Of course, I valued it when Melancon was a free agent and lauded the Giants for signing him. Little did I know . . . ) seems to be creating more value among teams than Snell.
Fourth, it suggests that Snell could possibly see a 3 year deal with a higher AAV and possibly multiple opt-outs. I'm okay with that kind of deal rather than the 5 to 7 year deal that some are suggesting. Of course, being a Boras' client means that deal may not come about until February, should he still be on the market at that point in time.
 

SF11704

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As a long time Giant fan (nearing 70 years now) I can honestly say that this is the most difficult upcoming season that I have ever seen or can imagine. As a youngster you were never really aware of all the ins and outs of trading players, the FA market and the actual strength of other teams.

When I look at our team I fondly remember the 3 WS wins! That is a very good memory. Too bad that all seemed to change drastically over the past seven years. During this stretch we have only played over 500 ball once. Just freaking once and that was our miracle year of 107 wins. We also had one year at 500. During this time our divisional rival has played the best ball in the MLB world. They have managed to win more than 100 games 5 times in the past 7 years. They have established themselves as a perennial Division leader. Hard to argue with 100 wins a season. They picked up both Ohtani and Yamamoto. Signed them both to long term contracts. We tried but came up empty.

I seriously don't see us challenging the Dodgers for the division title for quite a few years. Very hard to make up 20 games on a team that has the talent they do. But I think we need to set our sights on something much more realistic. I think a division title is out of reach but a playoff position isn't. Still not an easy task. I think we'll need around 90 wins for a playoff position. Even then we are 10-15 games below that mark.

I just don't see a one year turn around. To many holes to fill and too many player issues to cover a 10-15 game deficit in just one year. But I sure as hell hope they put some kind of a plan in place to get us close or at a playoff level in at least two years. What they do between now a the end of February will be telling. Did they actually have a plan 'B' after losing both Othani and Yamamoto. Not sure they do. Just don't believe that 'dumpster diving' is the answer to rebuilding for a playoff run. The one question I really can't answer is about their actual plan 'A' commitment. Did they really think that Judge, Othani and Yamamoto were real possibilities or were they just doing 'their jobs' by bidding on them. I'm just not sure.

Any good management team should have a plan B in place in case of an emergency ..... for me .... this qualifies as an emergency .... you are currently about 10-15 games behind a playoff position and your division winner just signed both Othani and Yamamoto ....
 

calsnowskier

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I don’t really think we are even in a position to seriously compete for a WC. We just don’t have the weapons.

However, some bright spots…

We SHOULD see improvement from at least some of out kids. Harrison performed OK last year, and will have had the off season to digest that improve going in the season as a major leaguer on opening day. Schmitt struggled, but he started hot and a track record in the minors and came in with pedigree. It is WAY too early to call him a bust. Lucy has a TON of pedigree, and showed signs of potential. His defense still worries me, but he is currently playing the 2nd most difficult position, and the Giants have yet to try to move him. That is a good sign. Matos showed that he has a future. I don’t think he is a star, but I think he can develop into a solid started/4th OF. That is valuable. The rest of the pitching kids may not have STAR potential, but we have a lot of solid contributor potential. I still fear Bailey may be a bit of a flash, and we are likely putting too much hope on him, he looks like he is AT WORST a Casali ++ type.

Outside of the kids, our Bully, and a few established MLBers (Webb, Estrada, Doval, … um…) our cupboard is bare, though…
 

Hangman

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I aint spending money on any of them. I would in fact trade away players and get prospects and try getting a good young core that would attract a star player.
 
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