2024 Rosterbation

[LHG]

OK roster gurus….. when I look at our lad’s roster I ask myself how does this roster compare against MLB division leaders

Outside of Webb and Doval is there any Giant who’d land a starting position on any of the division leaders? On any of the Wild Card contenders?

I dont think Kap makes up for the lack of talent and until we have a few position players on par with the best we’ll continue to aspire to a WC slot. IMO we’ve been behind on the talent curve since around ‘16. High productive free agent aren’t coming here for a variety of reasons.

is there realistic hope in the minors or snagging elite internationals?

Or is the plan just to hope we get a B talent team to have a career year?

Looking at this offseason's free agent class, I don't see how much talent is going to be acquired that way for significant offensive contributions. It will need to happen either through trades or the farm. I think we have some guys that are good complementary pieces but not superstars (Ramos and Luciano once looked like those guys but I'm not sure either will get the chance or perform to that level). We have a fairly good bullpen. Does Ohtani make enough of a difference? Do we even have a realistic chance at signing him? I don't have much hope that this offseason will be better than last.

 

[stanford the manford]

Looking at this offseason's free agent class, I don't see how much talent is going to be acquired that way for significant offensive contributions. It will need to happen either through trades or the farm. I think we have some guys that are good complementary pieces but not superstars (Ramos and Luciano once looked like those guys but I'm not sure either will get the chance or perform to that level). We have a fairly good bullpen. Does Ohtani make enough of a difference? Do we even have a realistic chance at signing him? I don't have much hope that this offseason will be better than last.

Obviously I’m clueless, but until the FO can figure out how to land 3 or 4 position players that could start on any of the division leaders starting lineup, it‘s hard to see how we‘ll be a serious competitor

 

[tzill]

But are they making positive impacts?

Bailey is for sure a positive, but how much of an impact can a glove-only catcher really be?

Walker has been nice, but he is just a bully arm. Maybe a nice 8th inning guy eventually, sure, but still just a bully arm.

Matos looks like he may be nice someday, but he has not REALLY been a contributor THIS year. Same goes for Schmitt and Harry.

Its far from clear that Bales is glove only
Harry, Schmitt, Walker, Matos, Lucy, Fitz, Whisenhunt, Birdsong, Meckler, Sabol...all these guys have potential to be really good.

The org is stronger than it's ever been.

 

[tzill]

Looking at this offseason's free agent class, I don't see how much talent is going to be acquired that way for significant offensive contributions. It will need to happen either through trades or the farm. I think we have some guys that are good complementary pieces but not superstars (Ramos and Luciano once looked like those guys but I'm not sure either will get the chance or perform to that level). We have a fairly good bullpen. Does Ohtani make enough of a difference? Do we even have a realistic chance at signing him? I don't have much hope that this offseason will be better than last.

For it to happen through trades or the farm....

The farm has to be deep and good. We're getting there.

FWIW, Ohtani cleared out his locker yesterday in Anaheim.

 

[tzill]

Obviously I’m clueless, but until the FO can figure out how to land 3 or 4 position players that could start on any of the division leaders starting lineup, it‘s hard to see how we‘ll be a serious competitor

3 or 4 is a tall ask.

How about 2 from the farm and 2 by trade? I could see Lucy, Schmitt, Ramos, Sabol, Meckler, Fitz becoming 2.0 WAR players or better.

 

[calsnowskier]

Its far from clear that Bales is glove only
Harry, Schmitt, Walker, Matos, Lucy, Fitz, Whisenhunt, Birdsong, Meckler, Sabol...all these guys have potential to be really good.

The org is stronger than it's ever been.

Harry, Schmitt, Matos and Lucy have potential to be starter + level. But so far, only Harry has shown that glimpse in SF. Schmitt, Matos and Lucy have struggled in SF (not trying to be negative about them, I still like all 3…. A LOT, but let’s be honest, we haven’t seen production from them yet). Walker MAY be in that class, but mid relievers are do volatile that it is hard to get too excited. Remember when Crick was the next great bully arm? Law? Ossich? Etc etc etc. They others you mentioned are nothing but potential, and varying levels of prospect-ness. Sabol, in particular, to me, is nothing more than a nice piece. His defense is questionable at best, and is really only saved by his youth and ability to correct on the fly. Give him a few years, and he will be a DH-level bat only player, with a 1.5WAR bat. That has “journeyman” written all over it.

Dont get me wrong. I like all the players you mentioned. I agree that the org is deeper now than it was 5 years ago. But that is 5 years of generic growth. We still have next to no presence in Latin America (this past year we FINALLY landed some highish-profile kids, but we have done that in the past to literally tragic results). In 5 years, FZ has added only ONE true blue chip prospect to the farm. ONE!! Lucy and Matos are both holdovers from the previous regime. I just have not seen ENOUGH growth and improvement in 5 years years to judge FZ as successful.

I hope I am wrong. I hope Arias develops into Acuna. I hope Schmitt takes steps in the off-season to become the next Crawford-level player (only at 3B instead of SS). I hope Harry becomes a legit #3 in ‘24 with his eyes set on displacing Webb as the staff Ace by ‘25. I hope Whisenhunt is able to become a consistent #3+ SP by ‘25/‘26. I hope Walker continues his impressive showing and becomes part of the greatest backend bully tandem in baseball with Doval. I hope Bailey continues to improve defensively and that his bat becomes at least close to league average.

And all that COULD happen. But that is a lot of ifs still out there after 5 years without any real in-the-bank HRs outside of the most flukey, non-repeatable season in the history of the game (moreso than Brady Anderson).

 

[LHG]

The Giants just need to suck it up and go young in 2024. However, I cannot see FZ wanting to do that in a contract year. Won't be surprised if he tries to pull all his hyper transaction antics this offseason.

 

[calsnowskier]

The Giants just need to suck it up and go young in 2024. However, I cannot see FZ wanting to do that in a contract year. Won't be surprised if he tries to pull all his hyper transaction antics this offseason.

This strategy needed to happen during Bum’s final year here. Doing it now is pointless, and really just wastes Webb. Besides, draft position is somewhat worthless in baseball, so “tanking” does nothing but turn off the fanbase while adding Joey Bart to the farm.

 

[LHG]

This strategy needed to happen during Bum’s final year here. Doing it now is pointless, and really just wastes Webb. Besides, draft position is somewhat worthless in baseball, so “tanking” does nothing but turn off the fanbase while adding Joey Bart to the farm.

I'm not talking about this for the sake of tanking. I'm referring to the idea of playing the youngsters to see what you've got. Give Ramos a chance. Give Villar a final chance. Give Bart a final chance. Give Fitzgerald a chance. Give Luciano a chance. See what we have and build off of that. Instead, I see more mediocrity next year. Its already driving the fans away. Why not give the rookies and sophomores the chance to see what they can do and weather the bumps along the way.

 

[calsnowskier]

I'm not talking about this for the sake of tanking. I'm referring to the idea of playing the youngsters to see what you've got. Give Ramos a chance. Give Villar a final chance. Give Bart a final chance. Give Fitzgerald a chance. Give Luciano a chance. See what we have and build off of that. Instead, I see more mediocrity next year. Its already driving the fans away. Why not give the rookies and sophomores the chance to see what they can do and weather the bumps along the way.

I believe all that will happen anyway. Bart and Ramos are out of options. They are either Giants or exposed to waivers (or traded, of course).

 

[stanford the manford]

This strategy needed to happen during Bum’s final year here. Doing it now is pointless, and really just wastes Webb. Besides, draft position is somewhat worthless in baseball, so “tanking” does nothing but turn off the fanbase while adding Joey Bart to the farm.

on this I agree, we've been treading water for far too long

 

[stanford the manford]

Coming out of Colorado, WC is in the rear view mirror. Please bring up all the questionables for the remainder of the season and confirm if they are legit prospects or cut bait. Let's not go into '24 still feeling out the AAA churn'ers

 

[msgkings322]

Coming out of Colorado, WC is in the rear view mirror. Please bring up all the questionables for the remainder of the season and confirm if they are legit prospects or cut bait. Let's not go into '24 still feeling out the AAA churn'ers

They won't do that until they are 4-5 back, and to be honest even though we know they won't get there I don't want to root for a team that stops trying 2-3 games back with 12-13 to play.

 

[calsnowskier]

Coming out of Colorado, WC is in the rear view mirror. Please bring up all the questionables for the remainder of the season and confirm if they are legit prospects or cut bait. Let's not go into '24 still feeling out the AAA churn'ers

Any game without Heliot in the OF the rest of the way is a lost, worthless game.

 

[calsnowskier]

They won't do that until they are 4-5 back, and to be honest even though we know they won't get there I don't want to root for a team that stops trying 2-3 games back with 12-13 to play.

“I jumped out of the plane without a parachute, but hey, the plane isn’t THAT far away. If I flap my arms hard enough, I just might catch it!”

 

[msgkings322]

“I jumped out of the plane without a parachute, but hey, the plane isn’t THAT far away. If I flap my arms hard enough, I just might catch it!”

In sports how you play is as much a part of it as results. I can greatly enjoy a season where they don't win a title. Most of them end that way.

 

[LHG]

In sports how you play is as much a part of it as results. I can greatly enjoy a season where they don't win a title. Most of them end that way.

How does DeJong on the roster versus Fitzgerald on the roster make it look like this team is trying to win? I know that is just one example but its the gist of what stan the man is suggesting.

 

[LHG]

Gee, I wonder why he loves the way they run the organization so much? Pederson is quoted as saying “I really like it here. It’s a great group of guys. I love the way they run the organization.” He wants to come back. I hope he finds a new home that he likes even more.

Giants’ Joc Pederson fires back at notion his weight is affecting his play

Joc Pederson acknowledges he has put on some pounds this season. But the San Francisco Giants’ highest-paid player says that’s not why he’s struggling.

www.sfchronicle.com

 

[Stokes1931]

Gee, I wonder why he loves the way they run the organization so much? Pederson is quoted as saying “I really like it here. It’s a great group of guys. I love the way they run the organization.” He wants to come back. I hope he finds a new home that he likes even more.

Giants’ Joc Pederson fires back at notion his weight is affecting his play

Joc Pederson acknowledges he has put on some pounds this season. But the San Francisco Giants’ highest-paid player says that’s not why he’s struggling.

www.sfchronicle.com

I couldn't care less about his weight. What I care about is that he can HIT. And hit with POWER. He has shown very little ability to do either this season, so yeah, buh-bye!

 

[msgkings322]

How does DeJong on the roster versus Fitzgerald on the roster make it look like this team is trying to win? I know that is just one example but its the gist of what stan the man is suggesting.

Fair point but I find it hard to care. I'm checking out now. Had a blast the first half, watching Doval and Webb and Cobb cook and rookies all over the place, Bailey with his cannon, etc. But times up.