Game Thread: Chicago Bears @ Seattle Seahawks

[Anointed One]

This is what I see a lot of from many of you. The best players on a bad team do not mean they are cornerstone players. Many of those players you listed have looked bad against good talent and great against bad talent. SO are they good or just the best we got? I think it's more in the middle but these are not cornerstone type players.

In your List Diggs had his strongest season for us but lets not forget how he played for the first 6 or so games. Huge turn around and he is flying all over the place. He seems quicker and faster and looks the part of a franchise player but none of those other guys on the list have proven anything yet other than they can be average to a little above against inferior opponents and disappear for the most part against top quality opponents.

4 of the 7 are still in rookie contracts which plays into the equation as well...

Diggs took some time to get use to the team, culture, change of environment, etc... I'd say he's made himself a home with his plays since then... And he wasn't horrible his first 6 games... He had a couple misses, whiffs but I'd say he's put those behind him for the most part... His play even has elevated since Adams has been hurt...

 

[Screamin12th]

Diggs turns 29 in less than a month and his game isn't going to continue to sky rocket. His understanding of the defense has improved and has helped him a lot but he is at a point in his career where things will start going down hill soon. He was rated at 61 the first 6 games that's borderline starter and now he sits at 71 but he has been better than that as this is just his rating average including his first 6 games. Wags is 2 years older and some of you want to cut bait on him. 2 years from now Diggs most likely is in the same place. Cant build around a 2 year player, hopefully Blair kicks the injury bug because i think he would make a fine Free Safety with his speed and size and he wont be smashing faces with 300 pound lineman any more for the most part.

When most of your best players are older player that doesn't help either. We need some HUGE jumps by many of these young guys next season if we want to be better than .500.

 

[Screamin12th]

You have one season to judge Darrell Taylor and one and a half seasons to judge Jordyn Brooks.

I do think we need a new defensive system which we may not get.

I don't think we need or said we needed a new system, and I like Brooks I was not one of the early season haters.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

It has been done I believe but usual very near the date and likely needs the league blessing, but not really sure.

If it's near the date then teams needing QBs will already have them through the draft.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

we are a 5 win team RIGHT NOW, statistically among the worst teams in the league with carroll, schneider, and wilson. its time to move on from all of them, its whats best for the team and for wilson. he isnt winning shit with us he might have a chance on another team.

we have no cap space we have no draft picks, its going to be essentially the same team with the same people running it. I have no reason to think otherwise.

multiple losing seasons are here whether you like it or not.

We had an owner that intentionally drove the team into the ground so that he could move it, the idea that the only thing standing between us and a rerun of that is russell wilson is ridiculous sensationalism.

The only way we should keep him is if he takes a 50% pay cut and agrees to be a game manager and stops trying to be the hero and chucking the ball away. thats not his personality though so it likely will not be acceptable to him.

The FO will be top 10 in cap money with the spike and more with cuts. At this point we have no idea who will be running the show. I feel changes will be made.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

Oh no doubt, coaches can make a difference, I’m just a little worried about Russ’s particular skill set not aging really well combined with his height throwing from the pocket… If we want something for him it’s now or never … Certain teams in league are gonna see Russ as making them a Super Bowl contender instantly …

That's why I feel and new staff with fresh eyes will be able to use RW the right way. All the draft picks in the world doesn't mean we land the next RW in the draft. 6 draft picks can start rebuilding the foundation of the team if done correctly.

 

[MrS]

The FO will be top 10 in cap money with the spike and more with cuts. At this point we have no idea who will be running the show. I feel changes will be made.

We may have what looks like a lot of space on paper, but we will have so many holes to fill it wont be enough.

regardless, a down year will be good for the team overall, its just a shame they mortgaged the future so many times in the past.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

That's why I feel and new staff with fresh eyes will be able to use RW the right way. All the draft picks in the world doesn't mean we land the next RW in the draft. 6 draft picks can start rebuilding the foundation of the team if done correctly.

I get the fear of being without a good QB and understand that it is so hard to find one. An example would be the Saints post Brees trying several novel approaches to filling the gap and watching someone named Ian Book start for them was a reminder of what could await the Seahawks post RW. Scary I know. However Big Ben is an example of a team holding on for dear life to a QB at the end of his career and his backups are so bad they don't want to use them. It's kind of sad to see him struggle to finish the season. Another example would be Matt Ryan another old QB that has his team just spinning their wheels, his cap hit in 2022 $48 million and all but $8 million is sunk cost that can't be unloaded onto another team ( 43 cap hit 2023). A result of kicking the can down the road to keep him in Atlanta while also loosening some cap space for a team in need of cap space a situation very similar to where the Seahawks are at.
As for a new staff.....well I don't share your optimism . Arthur Smith hasn't done much for Ryan, Dan Campbell hasn't done much for Goff, Urban Meyers hasn't done much for Trey Lawrence . Second year coaches like Matt Rhule (Panthers), Joe Judge (Giants) are not inspiring either.

 

[flyerhawk]

I get the fear of being without a good QB and understand that it is so hard to find one. An example would be the Saints post Brees trying several novel approaches to filling the gap and watching someone named Ian Book start for them was a reminder of what could await the Seahawks post RW. Scary I know. However Big Ben is an example of a team holding on for dear life to a QB at the end of his career and his backups are so bad they don't want to use them. It's kind of sad to see him struggle to finish the season. Another example would be Matt Ryan another old QB that has his team just spinning their wheels, his cap hit in 2022 $48 million and all but $8 million is sunk cost that can't be unloaded onto another team ( 43 cap hit 2023). A result of kicking the can down the road to keep him in Atlanta while also loosening some cap space for a team in need of cap space a situation very similar to where the Seahawks are at.
As for a new staff.....well I don't share your optimism . Arthur Smith hasn't done much for Ryan, Dan Campbell hasn't done much for Goff, Urban Meyers hasn't done much for Trey Lawrence . Second year coaches like Matt Rhule (Panthers), Joe Judge (Giants) are not inspiring either.

There is no question that moving on from Pete introduces any number of problems and a significant risk that his replacement could be worse than Pete is. He is the 2nd oldest non-interim coach in NFL history. He's shown almost ZERO innovation in the last 5 years.

I don't know why you keep comparing Russ to players significantly older than he is. If he was 38 right now this would be a very different conversation.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

I don't know why you keep comparing Russ to players significantly older than he is. If he was 38 right now this would be a very different conversation.

His play the last year half has been bad. He's always relied on his legs to make plays ( it's what made him special) and his legs are gone, his speed is gone, his quickness is gone and he has not honed his skills within the pocket which is where he's going to have to play from going forward for the most part. He'll be 34 next season and for a mobile QB 34 is like 39 for QBs that haven't relied on breaking the pocket and played from the pocket and honed that skill over their career IMO.

 

[blstoker]

His play the last year half has been bad. He's always relied on his legs to make plays ( it's what made him special) and his legs are gone, his speed is gone, his quickness is gone and he has not honed his skills within the pocket which is where he's going to have to play from going forward for the most part. He'll be 34 next season and for a mobile QB 34 is like 39 for QBs that haven't relied on breaking the pocket and played from the pocket and honed that skill over their career IMO.

Agreed. Russell is at a crossroads in his career. A lot that is Russ' fault in his performance has been mental. He's gonna have to spend some time getting right again, and making adjustments to his play.

All that said, there's still massive issues with our play design, calling and scheme that also need to be addressed if we want any qb to succeed, not just Russ.

 

[flyerhawk]

His play the last year half has been bad. He's always relied on his legs to make plays ( it's what made him special) and his legs are gone, his speed is gone, his quickness is gone and he has not honed his skills within the pocket which is where he's going to have to play from going forward for the most part. He'll be 34 next season and for a mobile QB 34 is like 39 for QBs that haven't relied on breaking the pocket and played from the pocket and honed that skill over their career IMO.

Or maybe he's telling the truth when he says he tweaked a leg muscle which is why he's been so reluctant to scramble?

Was he showing his decline before his injury when he had a 120+ passer rating?

There is no question that his accuracy is off right now. Whenever he has to put a little extra zip on the ball he seems to be losing the ball a bit. I don't think that has anything to do with his scrambling ability.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Agreed. Russell is at a crossroads in his career. A lot that is Russ' fault in his performance has been mental. He's gonna have to spend some time getting right again, and making adjustments to his play.

All that said, there's still massive issues with our play design, calling and scheme that also need to be addressed if we want any qb to succeed, not just Russ.

Well when Geno was starting the play design and scheme was lots different. Obviously they made adjustments for Geno, but a lot of change happened because Geno just wanted to move the chains and wasn’t looking for a home run. RW looking long is because that’s what RW wants to throw. Does the play calling play into it. Sure it does, but the bottom line is the QB needs to throw to who ever is open and if looking long, have a second target to release to. RW instead of going to a second target breaks the pocket pretty much every time. That’s on him. That’s him never learning to go through progressions from the pocket. If he wants to succeed going forward he’s going to need to do that and at 34 that’s a old dog trying to learn a new trick.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Or maybe he's telling the truth when he says he tweaked a leg muscle which is why he's been so reluctant to scramble?

Was he showing his decline before his injury when he had a 120+ passer rating?

There is no question that his accuracy is off right now. Whenever he has to put a little extra zip on the ball he seems to be losing the ball a bit. I don't think that has anything to do with his scrambling ability.

I’m not worried about RW arm, it’s just fine. No doubt about the finger injury messing with his throws, it did/. does. The problem is RW needs to learn to play from the pocket and at 34 not sure he can do that. Breaking from the pocket is what he has done his whole career and that needs to change. Now he needs to hang tough in the pocket and deliver the ball to his secondary receiver ( or throw it away without getting grounding called). Means taking some nasty hits and RW hates those kind of hits.

 

[flyerhawk]

I’m not worried about RW arm, it’s just fine. No doubt about the finger injury messing with his throws, it did/. does. The problem is RW needs to learn to play from the pocket and at 34 not sure he can do that. Breaking from the pocket is what he has done his whole career and that needs to change. Now he needs to hang tough in the pocket and deliver the ball to his secondary receiver ( or throw it away without getting grounding called). Means taking some nasty hits and RW hates those kind of hits.

And this is where we start getting into a lot of speculation. How much of Russ' decision making is based on the routes that are being run? How much of it is game plan? How much is it Russ always wanting the home run ball? I really don't know.

But watching the game it is pretty clear that our OL is not helping the situation.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

And this is where we start getting into a lot of speculation. How much of Russ' decision making is based on the routes that are being run? How much of it is game plan? How much is it Russ always wanting the home run ball? I really don't know.

But watching the game it is pretty clear that our OL is not helping the situation.

I can agree with much of your post. It’s true the OL needs to improvement. Learning to improve footwork by RW in the pocket would also help a bunch. Which is part of being a pocket passer that he needs to master.

 

[MrS]

The problem is RW needs to learn to play from the pocket and at 34 not sure he can do that.

he cant, he isnt tall enough. his mobility covered that up for most of his career but now its exposed.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

he cant, he isnt tall enough. his mobility covered that up for most of his career but now its exposed.

If the Seahawks aren’t doing a full on rebuild then there is no point in trading RW. Can RW be a pocket passer? Think he could make some big improvement on it, but first he has to embrace the challenge and recognize the need and put in the work.
I was of the mind that a full rebuild was needed, but since that’s not happening I’m going to see how they retool rather then rebuild.

 

[MrS]

If the Seahawks aren’t doing a full on rebuild then there is no point in trading RW. Can RW be a pocket passer? Think he could make some big improvement on it, but first he has to embrace the challenge and recognize the need and put in the work.
I was of the mind that a full rebuild was needed, but since that’s not happening I’m going to see how they retool rather then rebuild.

I cant disagree, schneider has shown a complete inability to use first round picks wisely. trading wilson and potentially other players for high picks would almost assuredly be a waste.

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

That's why I feel and new staff with fresh eyes will be able to use RW the right way. All the draft picks in the world doesn't mean we land the next RW in the draft. 6 draft picks can start rebuilding the foundation of the team if done correctly.

That’s always an option, but keep in mind Russ isn’t getting any younger, will be 34 next season.. If we’re gonna make a move it’s now or never…It’s a tough decision, but if someone offers us 3 first round draft picks we would have to seriously consider it ..