2025 Rosterbation

[tzill]

Some chatter that the Giants are considering non tendering Yaz.

This seems ridiculous.

 

[calsnowskier]

Some chatter that the Giants are considering DFAing Yaz.

This seems ridiculous.

DFA = nontender.

while a bit surprising, not shocking. This was always a possibility we here considered.

 

[tzill]

DFA = nontender.

while a bit surprising, not shocking. This was always a possibility we here considered.

I fixed it.

 

[sf1giantfan]

Trading him isn’t an option so we get something before he is nontendered?

 

[calsnowskier]

Trading him isn’t an option so we get something before he is nontendered?

Pretty much no. He is expected to get upwards of 10M in arbitration, and that is generally considered an overpay for him.

 

[sf1giantfan]

Pretty much no. He is expected to get upwards of 10M in arbitration, and that is generally considered an overpay for him.

How sad. I’ll miss him
But that might mean they are looking for a powerhouse outfielder.

 

[calsnowskier]

How sad. I’ll miss him
But that might mean they are looking for a powerhouse outfielder.

Nothing written in stone. It is possible they non-tender him, but still sign him.

 

[sf1giantfan]

Nothing written in stone. It is possible they non-tender him, but still sign him.

Ahh yes that is a possibility. Or Boston trades for him

 

[calsnowskier]

Ahh yes that is a possibility. Or Boston trades for him

At this point, why would they? It is pretty widely acknowledged that he is not worth whatever he will get in Arb. If they trade for him and want to keep him, they would need to offer him arb and then overpay him. In that scenario, what would they be willing to give up ON TOP of all that to get him? They might as well just wait for the Giants to non-tender him, then outbid everyone else for him.

 

[tzill]

Pretty much no. He is expected to get upwards of 10M in arbitration, and that is generally considered an overpay for him.

I don't think it's an overpay; we've just been so used to him being underpaid that it seems that way. I think 9-10M is fair value

 

[calsnowskier]

I don't think it's an overpay; we've just been so used to him being underpaid that it seems that way. I think 9-10M is fair value

He is a clubhouse presence and a ++ defensive OF. But his bat is just + and very streaky, and he is going into his age 34 season.

I would not be against tendering him. But I see the argument for nontendering him and trying to sign him back anyway. There is no way he should accept an under-arb offer from the Giants though. He might as well become a FA and get himself market value, wherever that may be.

 

[LHG]

He is a clubhouse presence and a ++ defensive OF. But his bat is just + and very streaky, and he is going into his age 34 season.

I would not be against tendering him. But I see the argument for nontendering him and trying to sign him back anyway. There is no way he should accept an under-arb offer from the Giants though. He might as well become a FA and get himself market value, wherever that may be.

If they nontender him, I doubt he comes back to the Giants unless they put a multi year offer out to him. And while I think nontendering him is a dumb idea, I'm not so sure about signing him past 2025 is a good idea either. He hasn't lost a step yet in the outfield but I cannot picture a 35 year old being a plus defender in right field at Oracle. I think the best course of action is keep him for 2025 and see how he does with the glove. If he still looks good through 2024, then maybe consider resigning him for 2026. Otherwise, let 2025 be his swan song for the Giants.

And going back to his 2025 projected salary, what is the point in getting worked up about it on the team's part? They want to cut salary from 2024 numbers but are currently well under 2023 numbers. Do they want more money to sign bigger name free agents? Because if they let Yaz go, they'll need to sign a really good outfield bat or an elite defender for right field. Otherwise, it seems like a net negative on replacing him.

 

[calsnowskier]

If they nontender him, I doubt he comes back to the Giants unless they put a multi year offer out to him. And while I think nontendering him is a dumb idea, I'm not so sure about signing him past 2025 is a good idea either. He hasn't lost a step yet in the outfield but I cannot picture a 35 year old being a plus defender in right field at Oracle. I think the best course of action is keep him for 2025 and see how he does with the glove. If he still looks good through 2024, then maybe consider resigning him for 2026. Otherwise, let 2025 be his swan song for the Giants.

And going back to his 2025 projected salary, what is the point in getting worked up about it on the team's part? They want to cut salary from 2024 numbers but are currently well under 2023 numbers. Do they want more money to sign bigger name free agents? Because if they let Yaz go, they'll need to sign a really good outfield bat or an elite defender for right field. Otherwise, it seems like a net negative on replacing him.

I don’t care about the money. But the FO does care. Therefore, if we are going to attempt to understand/predict what Posey et al will do, we have to factor in the $$.

The org as essentially already announced they are going into rebuild mode, so players like Adames, Snelk, Soto,
Alonso, Fried, Barnes, etc are not likely avail to us. But if they want to try to keep fans coming to the park, they will need to have some players fans want to see. Yaz MIGHT qualify for that.

 

[LHG]

I don’t care about the money. But the FO does care. Therefore, if we are going to attempt to understand/predict what Posey et al will do, we have to factor in the $$.

The org as essentially already announced they are going into rebuild mode, so players like Adames, Snelk, Soto,
Alonso, Fried, Barnes, etc are not likely avail to us. But if they want to try to keep fans coming to the park, they will need to have some players fans want to see. Yaz MIGHT qualify for that.

How much do they want to cut costs is my question. Pretty much all QOs are off the table. Probably next two tiers of free agents as well. So do they cut Yaz so they can sign players to make them look like they are trying to improve the ballclub? I really doubt they find a better all around right fielder than Yaz. Now they may have a spoken deal to let him go and quickly re-sign him to a lower amount but that really would only work, in my opinion, if it is of the multi year variety. Otherwise, what is in it for Yaz to agree to that?
And I really hope that they don't do the smoke and mirrors trick to make fans think they are working to improve the club while cutting costs. That is just frustrating.

 

[calsnowskier]

How much do they want to cut costs is my question. Pretty much all QOs are off the table. Probably next two tiers of free agents as well. So do they cut Yaz so they can sign players to make them look like they are trying to improve the ballclub? I really doubt they find a better all around right fielder than Yaz. Now they may have a spoken deal to let him go and quickly re-sign him to a lower amount but that really would only work, in my opinion, if it is of the multi year variety. Otherwise, what is in it for Yaz to agree to that?
And I really hope that they don't do the smoke and mirrors trick to make fans think they are working to improve the club while cutting costs. That is just frustrating.

If they have that kind of plan with him, they don’t have to release him. They can agree to a deal at anytime. I just don’t see the point of that from a Yaz POV.

i am OK with the smoke/mirror strategy, personally. Just as long as they don’t shoot themselves in the foot by “buying” instead of “selling” (or vice versa) when the clear move is to go the other direction. They need to keep up attendance. So doing the Astros or Cubs thing is not a possibility here. But moving forward with a plan should be done and they should stay true to the plan.

I just think back to Dodgers of 10 years ago when they took on salary to give fans old, aging players to watch while they built their system back. They tore their team down, but they still gave their fans something to watch in the meantime. The Giants have not built their system while at the same time given the fans no reason whatsoever to care about the MLB product. I HOPE Posey is capable of doing that, but if I am being honest, his hurting worries me. He has no experience in this role or any similar role.

 

[LHG]

If they have that kind of plan with him, they don’t have to release him. They can agree to a deal at anytime. I just don’t see the point of that from a Yaz POV.

i am OK with the smoke/mirror strategy, personally. Just as long as they don’t shoot themselves in the foot by “buying” instead of “selling” (or vice versa) when the clear move is to go the other direction. They need to keep up attendance. So doing the Astros or Cubs thing is not a possibility here. But moving forward with a plan should be done and they should stay true to the plan.

I just think back to Dodgers of 10 years ago when they took on salary to give fans old, aging players to watch while they built their system back. They tore their team down, but they still gave their fans something to watch in the meantime. The Giants have not built their system while at the same time given the fans no reason whatsoever to care about the MLB product. I HOPE Posey is capable of doing that, but if I am being honest, his hurting worries me. He has no experience in this role or any similar role.

I guess I need to come to the realization that I am a small minority as a fan who does not like smoke and mirrors roster building. Keeping the roster talent as is while shuffling names does not appeal to me but those who may not pay as much attention will get excited about new blood. Guess I better settle into another sad offseason.

And, yeah, you are right about Yaz. They could simply sign him to a multi year deal now and not go through the nontender dance. He is likely as good as gone if he gets nontendered.

 

[calsnowskier]

I guess I need to come to the realization that I am a small minority as a fan who does not like smoke and mirrors roster building. Keeping the roster talent as is while shuffling names does not appeal to me but those who may not pay as much attention will get excited about new blood. Guess I better settle into another sad offseason.

And, yeah, you are right about Yaz. They could simply sign him to a multi year deal now and not go through the nontender dance. He is likely as good as gone if he gets nontendered.

Take it back!!

Dont call me “normal” without expecting to get my wrath!

 

[LHG]

Take it back!!

Dont call me “normal” without expecting to get my wrath!

Oh, trust me, you are NOT normal.

 

[calsnowskier]

Oh, trust me, you are NOT normal.

 

[Stokes1931]

Oh, trust me, you are NOT normal.