2024 Rosterbation

[LHG]

There's literally no other potential impact bats available though. Because we're not getting Ohtani.

So, roll out that same 'offense' next year? Might as well go full rebuild then. They need some dudes and they don't have really any. Is Flores a reliable 'dude'?

Flores is more reliable in the sense that his career floor isn't nearly the same as Bellinger's. What caused Bellinger to hit so poorly for almost 3 seasons? Was it his back? If so, that is going to flair up again. Will that happen next year? 2 years? 5 years?
Considering the free agent hitters, full rebuild seems better than trying to tread .500 for the next few years. If Bellinger craters in year 1 of his deal, the Giants are no better off than if they hadn't signed him (if he hits like he did in 2021 then they are arguably worse off). Of course if Bellinger hits like he did in 2020 then there is marginal improvement over, say, Conforto. It would be wonderful if we got 2023, 2017 or 2019 Bellinger, and maybe we do. Its just a huge gamble to sign the guy to 5 years and expect production in line with what he will require in dollars.

 

[msgkings322]

Flores is more reliable in the sense that his career floor isn't nearly the same as Bellinger's. What caused Bellinger to hit so poorly for almost 3 seasons? Was it his back? If so, that is going to flair up again. Will that happen next year? 2 years? 5 years?
Considering the free agent hitters, full rebuild seems better than trying to tread .500 for the next few years. If Bellinger craters in year 1 of his deal, the Giants are no better off than if they hadn't signed him (if he hits like he did in 2021 then they are arguably worse off). Of course if Bellinger hits like he did in 2020 then there is marginal improvement over, say, Conforto. It would be wonderful if we got 2023, 2017 or 2019 Bellinger, and maybe we do. Its just a huge gamble to sign the guy to 5 years and expect production in line with what he will require in dollars.

OK then, full rebuild.

But they don't do that. So we'll roll the same shitty bats out there again next year, hoping Matos or Luciano turn into dudes.

One wild card is in addition to Yamamoto, FZ is supposedly looking at some guy who's the best hitter in the Korean league. So

 

[calsnowskier]

There's literally no other potential impact bats available though. Because we're not getting Ohtani.

So, roll out that same 'offense' next year? Might as well go full rebuild then. They need some dudes and they don't have really any. Is Flores a reliable 'dude'?

That’s why I brought up the concept of signing big pitchers and trading our internal pitchers for bats.

You don’t want to part with Webb? I get it. In a vacuum, I agree. But you gotta think outside the box sometimes. And if you want to get, you gotta give.

 

[LHG]

OK then, full rebuild.

But they don't do that. So we'll roll the same shitty bats out there again next year, hoping Matos or Luciano turn into dudes.

One wild card is in addition to Yamamoto, FZ is supposedly looking at some guy who's the best hitter in the Korean league. So

They obviously are not as smart as I so I don't expect them to not pursue Bellinger (if he can be had on a 2 year deal, I'd be much more comfortable with that signing, even at a higher amount per year than a 5 year deal).
Korean hitters typically don't hit nearly to the same production at the MLB level. Even Ha-Seong Kim has an OPS nearly 200 points lower than his Korean production.

 

[calsnowskier]

And I want to stress that I have never even heard a theory as to why Belly sucked in LA. Was it mechanical? Was it physical? Was it mental? Stumping for signing him without first determining what happened in LA is just ignorant fandom ranting.

 

[msgkings322]

They obviously are not as smart as I so I don't expect them to not pursue Bellinger (if he can be had on a 2 year deal, I'd be much more comfortable with that signing, even at a higher amount per year than a 5 year deal).
Korean hitters typically don't hit nearly to the same production at the MLB level. Even Ha-Seong Kim has an OPS nearly 200 points lower than his Korean production.

I guess we'll continue to be mediocre then

 

[LHG]

I guess we'll continue to be mediocre then

Unless FZ pulls off something amazing and we have 2021 again.

 

[msgkings322]

Unless FZ pulls off something amazing and we have 2021 again.

What did he do that was 'amazing' then? Posey, Belt, and even Crawford all had career years and the platooning all worked out. They tried that same thing this year and last and it didn't work.

Our lineup the second half was hitting at one of the worst paces in history. Only way to fix that is add impact bats and there aren't any we can get.

Point being it's going to be a few years before we have a legit good team again, probably under a new GM. Only other chance is the rookies almost all turn into legit hitters...good luck with that

 

[LHG]

What did he do that was 'amazing' then? Posey, Belt, and even Crawford all had career years and the platooning all worked out. They tried that same thing this year and last and it didn't work.

Our lineup the second half was hitting at one of the worst paces in history. Only way to fix that is add impact bats and there aren't any we can get.

Point being it's going to be a few years before we have a legit good team again, probably under a new GM. Only other chance is the rookies almost all turn into legit hitters...good luck with that

Just trying to grasp at something for 2024 not be cruddy. Not saying you are wrong at all.

 

[msgkings322]

Just trying to grasp at something for 2024 not be cruddy. Not saying you are wrong at all.

I get it, as fans the idea is look for positives, but I think we're screwed for a bit.

 

[tzill]

There's literally no other potential impact bats available though. Because we're not getting Ohtani.

So, roll out that same 'offense' next year? Might as well go full rebuild then. They need some dudes and they don't have really any. Is Flores a reliable 'dude'?

FA isn't the only route to upgrading the roster. In fact, it might just be the least effective route.

 

[tzill]

They obviously are not as smart as I so I don't expect them to not pursue Bellinger (if he can be had on a 2 year deal, I'd be much more comfortable with that signing, even at a higher amount per year than a 5 year deal).
Korean hitters typically don't hit nearly to the same production at the MLB level. Even Ha-Seong Kim has an OPS nearly 200 points lower than his Korean production.

No phuking way.

Dude is getting AT LEAST 5 years.

 

[tzill]

What did he do that was 'amazing' then? Posey, Belt, and even Crawford all had career years and the platooning all worked out. They tried that same thing this year and last and it didn't work.

Our lineup the second half was hitting at one of the worst paces in history. Only way to fix that is add impact bats and there aren't any we can get.

Point being it's going to be a few years before we have a legit good team again, probably under a new GM. Only other chance is the rookies almost all turn into legit hitters...good luck with that

again, FA isn't the only path to upgrade the roster.

I refuse to be so pessimistic in phuking November.

 

[calsnowskier]

FA isn't the only route to upgrading the roster. In fact, it might just be the least effective route.

But if you are taking Webb/Harry or anyone else we actually like off the table, than FA is the only route.

 

[calsnowskier]

again, FA isn't the only path to upgrade the roster.

I refuse to be so pessimistic in phuking November.

Sign Yamamoto and Snell. That solidifies the rotation.

Then shoot for the stars on a trade for a bat, while putting EVERY asset we have on the table (including Webb, Harry, Luciano, Bailey, Estrada…. Whoever!!).

Theoretically, we have a market advantage in being able to sign FA pitchers. Let’s utilize that advantage and fill in bats through other means.

 

[msgkings322]

FA isn't the only route to upgrading the roster. In fact, it might just be the least effective route.

It's the most immediate and least painful, compared to trades (which hurt to give people up) and waiting for the farm to produce a bat (it's been a while)

All I'm saying is we're probably screwed as far as getting a legit lineup in the next couple of years.

 

[msgkings322]

again, FA isn't the only path to upgrade the roster.

I refuse to be so pessimistic in phuking November.

Not trying to bring you down, just giving my take. I think it's a long term problem, we all saw the issue last year and I don't see a realistic path to fixing it near term.

 

[msgkings322]

Sign Yamamoto and Snell. That solidifies the rotation.

Then shoot for the stars on a trade for a bat, while putting EVERY asset we have on the table (including Webb, Harry, Luciano, Bailey, Estrada…. Whoever!!).

Theoretically, we have a market advantage in being able to sign FA pitchers. Let’s utilize that advantage and fill in bats through other means.

Not a bad idea but we don't even have enough valuable trade pieces to make that work, do we?

 

[LHG]

Sign Yamamoto and Snell. That solidifies the rotation.

Then shoot for the stars on a trade for a bat, while putting EVERY asset we have on the table (including Webb, Harry, Luciano, Bailey, Estrada…. Whoever!!).

Theoretically, we have a market advantage in being able to sign FA pitchers. Let’s utilize that advantage and fill in bats through other means.

Out of curiosity, who do you see as possible "gets" on a trade?

 

[calsnowskier]

Not a bad idea but we don't even have enough valuable trade pieces to make that work, do we?

Who knows. But if we take advantage of our market strengths (signing fa pitchers), it allows us to more freely trade from our organizational strength (young pitching).

I don’t know other team’s farms. I know our farm by reputation only (I have never scouted a single Giants prospect myself). So my argument is in theory only.