Top 10 Poll: #2 Player Ever

[msgkings322]

“He could field”…

But he doesn’t!

You can only judge what you see on the field. M’s fans claim Edgar was a good fielding 3B/1B. But he WASNT. He didn’t even own a glove. He gets ZERO credit for any skills he did not demonstrate on the field.

I know I'm just talking baseball here. Ohtani is like a superhero LOL

Is Ohtani's pitching more valuable than Mays' fielding? Probably so.

 

[steveringo]

Honestly... After the #1 poll run-off, I thought we'd be debating #3 right now....

 

[calsnowskier]

Even the extra boxes. The military service and the fact he is a black man and played in the beginning of the blacks in baseball. With all the racism whether on players or more generally opposing fanbases.

He played professionally in the N-Leagues while he was still in HS, and legend says he was the best player on those teams.

 

[calsnowskier]

Can’t argue fax…

 

[Clayton]

Bonds has “the stink” on him,

And thats just the thing I can't get around. He had a HOF career, then he trailed off, then he had a streak of being one of the most dominant players of all time.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

“He could field”…

But he doesn’t!

You can only judge what you see on the field. M’s fans claim Edgar was a good fielding 3B/1B. But he WASNT. He didn’t even own a glove. He gets ZERO credit for any skills he did not demonstrate on the field.

M’s fans also always claimed that ichiro could have hit homers.

 

[calsnowskier]

I know I'm just talking baseball here. Ohtani is like a superhero LOL

Is Ohtani's pitching more valuable than Mays' fielding? Probably so.

Which is why I include him on the list while he is still so early in his active career. He is ALREADY a HOFer, even if he never plays another game ever again.

And he hasn’t been seen since ‘23, so it is possible we will never see him again…

 

[calsnowskier]

Honestly... After the #1 poll run-off, I thought we'd be debating #3 right now....

Nope

 

[calsnowskier]

And thats just the thing I can't get around. He had a HOF career, then he trailed off, then he had a streak of being one of the most dominant players of all time.

“He trailed off…”

Um…

When?

 

[calsnowskier]

M’s fans also always claimed that ichiro could have hit homers.

I have heard this claim from more than just M’s fans. But I just don’t see it. Dude was a stick.

I acknowledge he is one of the most over-rated players in the history of the game. But I still think he is rightfully a dominant 1st ballot HOFer.

 

[Clayton]

“He trailed off…”

Um…

When?

You could just look at his average WAR between 94-00 and compare it 01-04 and see a little jump. How many other players had their best season in year 16 and year 17?

Although I think what keeps him in the discussion is that at some point teams felt like it was just better to walk him. And so if he ends up at #2 I wont complain.

 

[msgkings322]

You could just look at his average WAR between 94-00 and compare it 01-04 and see a little jump. How many other players had their best season in year 16 and year 17?

I think his point is there was no 'trail off' just great performance that then jumped to otherworldly with PEDs

 

[Clayton]

I think his point is there was no 'trail off' just great performance that then jumped to otherworldly with PEDs

Honestly, thats how I see it, too.

I will admit I am just slightly upset that Griffey Jr broke down and Pujols broke down and got hurt badly against the shift IIRC. It just kinda leaves Bonds alone until someone in the modern era jumps in. Although weirdly the Cardinals benefited in this same period so if I'm being a homer then its all good

 

[steveringo]

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Honestly, thats how I see it, too.

I will admit I am just slightly upset that Griffey Jr broke down and Pujols broke down and got hurt badly against the shift IIRC. It just kinda leaves Bonds alone until someone in the modern era jumps in. Although weirdly the Cardinals benefited in this same period so if I'm being a homer then its all good

not that we are close to this debate yet... but i have pujols over Griffey Jr...

 

[Clayton]

not that we are close to this debate yet... but i have pujols over Griffey Jr...

I think I do, as well, but I'll be the first to admit I'm biased.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

View attachment 382155

steroids is a big reason for this, but lets not forget what father time does... its pretty normal once players lose speed to bulk up... he just bulked up with help...

 

[steveringo]

steroids is a big reason for this, but lets not forget what father time does... its pretty normal once players lose speed to bulk up... he just bulked up with help...

I am a actually a proponent of letting steroid users in the HOF... Just put an asterisk next to their name.... I also lean toward the Jose Canseco estimates for the players using some for of performance enhancing drug - about 85%?... Since everyone was doing it to some degree, just let them all in...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I think I do, as well, but I'll be the first to admit I'm biased.

you probably are... but you are for a good reason at least with Pujols...

not sure if he is a top 10 player of all time YET... but if he is not he is certainly close.... and i also think he is the best first baseman of all time... better than my boy Lou...

 

[calsnowskier]

Honestly, thats how I see it, too.

I will admit I am just slightly upset that Griffey Jr broke down and Pujols broke down and got hurt badly against the shift IIRC. It just kinda leaves Bonds alone until someone in the modern era jumps in. Although weirdly the Cardinals benefited in this same period so if I'm being a homer then its all good

Pujols was a beast. But he played a much less demanding position and had no running game at any point in his career.

He also played in the juice era, and I don’t believe any player was “clean” during that era, no matter how swell a guy he may have been. I am looking at you, Griffey, Thome, Pujols, Biggio…