Series Thread: ALDS - M's at Houston

[wazzu31]

Who would’ve honestly said that Marco should’ve been on the roster over the reigning Cy Young winner. Shit the M’s could use Flexen on the roster so they could use him over using Brash in the weird stop the bleeding situations. Analytics says they got 3 closers yet none of the 3 are allowed to close the game.

 

[WizardHawk]

Then again, in the long run, this team has ALWAYS been about false hope. String us along, then betray.

You can try to shelve the memes, retire the analogies from sources past, but somehow, they find a way to revive them.

It seems that disillusion is all they know. Just so happens that "Disillusion" is a perfect selection for this team:

Damn man, I don't think any of us are thrilled with this, but I'm not THAT bent lol.

They exceeded my minimum bar for calling this a step forward season. I had said they couldn't win less than last year, and they won the same. I also wasn't willing to accept the brand-new 6th seed and they took the already existing 5th. A few of us also said we wouldn't accept not winning at least one round and they did that.

They exactly met the minimum for calling it a step forward.

This, and on a what? 90m payroll or so?

They have some solid pieces to build around, and then a few Joes and a few that have no business being on a major contender roster.

Having Jrod, Castillo, Gilbert, Kirby, Even Cal (still need at least another solid catcher to go with him). Suarez? Maybe? JP started the season well and fell off badly the whole second half. France also did nothing the second half. Haniger's health is in question and also dropped way off. Munoz is a flat out stud and needs to be groomed as a true closer. Couple of others worth keeping in the pen.

They have way too many holes and really nothing to back them up. You can't keep parading 1/3 of your lineup sub .210 all year long. You can't have guys on the bench you don't think can pinch hit or step in for injuries and keep the lineup going.

They could still make more minor changes and maybe get to be one of those lucky Cinderella stories you get in baseball now and then, but they need to spend a fuckton more if they want to actually compete.

6 of the 8 teams left are in the top 9 of payroll. The guardians are well below Seattle even, but both are a fraction of the top teams.

Spend or find more simple gains are about all you should expect moving forward.

I should say also they need to spend wisely, not the bloated payrolls of bad teams past.

 

[wazzu31]

After this abomination. Question is, if somehow the Mariners can win 3, is Ray even on the LCS series roster. Ray at his best is better than Marco at his best but Marco at his worst is much better than Ray at his worst.

 

[AceKeptic]

After this abomination. Question is, if somehow the Mariners can win 3, is Ray even on the LCS series roster. Ray at his best is better than Marco at his best but Marco at his worst is much better than Ray at his worst.

I wouldn't have him there. He did his damage putting us in that hole in Toronto as well as finishing that choke job today.

No, we can't have him doing any more to us if we want to prove we're worthy of moving forward.

 

[ulmax]

somebody better apologize to Ray and tell him...

He's just not worth the contract he signed. At all.

That is not true..he is worth every bit of it
But you have to pitch Robbie rigjht..
And not against the Astros on c rittical
Count..thats the way it is..live and learn

Ever pitcher is deferent..you just pitch
Them at what they are good at..
Next year.
Robbie will be off the charts...like last year..
A team ..is always changing..
Ups and downs..the mariners have came far..this year..and sometimes
the improvment.....is astounding..
Other times..we get let down

Anyone see kelenic get 2 hits off of verlander...are you kidding me ..or
what
.

.

 

[ulmax]

While Robbie is a good pitcher..
They should have use Boyd right there
But we will never know..

like..
What if the Seahawks had run beast mode instead.. of interception in the super bowl..
We don't know...

So forget it...and move on....

Win or lose...i have seen growth from this team this year...

Have you...not....and kelenic got 2 hits off of verlander...that ..is good..

 

[ulmax]

This is the best team Seattle has had
In 20 years...do they have weaknesses
Sure..
But it was one hell of a ballgame.
..and a good show..of who...the mariners.
Are..

That ballgame was top entertainment...
For anyone....

 

[Mariners_44]

You could argue the continued failed attempts by both Sewald & Ray, but I would never question their efforts in each of their recent appearances. these guys deserve a ton of credit for getting us here in the first place, but the bottom line is they are beyond burnt at the moment. This falls squarely on the skipper and his getting too cute with his game planning. Herm Edwards once said as clear as day, "you play to win the game!". Servais played the game with tomorrow in mind rather than playing to win the game today. Why he is holding Swanson and Boyd on ice makes little to no sense considering what the other two have recently been through. Anything other than putting your reliever with a low 1.0 era in the game was fully insane, we blew a major opportunity for no reason. No excuses, skip failed miserably.

 

[seattlefan75]

If we are being honest here the Astros really do have a better roster than we do. We are working off of momentum going into the playoffs which is important but we are still a team led by a 21 year old rookie going against a veteran team that has massive playoff experience.

 

[SeattleCoug]

Man that was as big of a gut punch as I think I've ever gotten as a sports fan.

Imo there is no use of debating about what do when Alvarez was up. The guy is a Top 3 hitter in the game right now and there is not a single pitcher on your roster that is gonna match up well with him period.

The problem was allowing the game to continue long enough for him to get the chance to beat you, and that is where Munoz and Sewald didnt do their jobs. Even after giving up the HR in the 8th Munoz gave up a 2 out hit to Gurriel which made it so you definitely had to face Altuve in the 9th and that Alvarez could get a chance. Sewald was definately not my first choice to pitch the 9th but he had his good stuff. It just really sucked that he hung a 1-2 slider to pena because the guy looked dead at 0-2.

Regardless most paths to us realistically winning this series involved splitting the first 2 games with Game 2 likely being the game you had the best chance. But if they dont somehow pull this series out, yesterday is going to sting for a long time.

 

[SeattleCoug]

If we are being honest here the Astros really do have a better roster than we do. We are working off of momentum going into the playoffs which is important but we are still a team led by a 21 year old rookie going against a veteran team that has massive playoff experience.

i am of this opinion too. If I had to make a prediction before this series I would have said Astros in 4. I maintain that whatever happens this series is gonna be a positive going forward because if they are ever gonna get to their ultimate goal, this is the team they need to get past. Not by trying to avoid them until the ALCS and hope someone else can upset them.
The talent gap between these rosters though is getting smaller and should continue to get that way, all that's left is matching them mentally. Specifically in games at that stupid stadium with the little league LF

 

[SeattleCoug]

After this abomination. Question is, if somehow the Mariners can win 3, is Ray even on the LCS series roster. Ray at his best is better than Marco at his best but Marco at his worst is much better than Ray at his worst.

I think if you are to get into a 7 game ALCS with the Yankees, Ray still needs to be a starter there. The Blue Jays and Astros just happen to be awful matchups for him. I do think you should fine a way to avoid him the rest of the series sans mop up duty.

 

[DHoey]

Man that was as big of a gut punch as I think I've ever gotten as a sports fan.

Imo there is no use of debating about what do when Alvarez was up. The guy is a Top 3 hitter in the game right now and there is not a single pitcher on your roster that is gonna match up well with him period.

The problem was allowing the game to continue long enough for him to get the chance to beat you, and that is where Munoz and Sewald didnt do their jobs. Even after giving up the HR in the 8th Munoz gave up a 2 out hit to Gurriel which made it so you definitely had to face Altuve in the 9th and that Alvarez could get a chance. Sewald was definately not my first choice to pitch the 9th but he had his good stuff. It just really sucked that he hung a 1-2 slider to pena because the guy looked dead at 0-2.

Regardless most paths to us realistically winning this series involved splitting the first 2 games with Game 2 likely being the game you had the best chance. But if they dont somehow pull this series out, yesterday is going to sting for a long time.

You don't throw a strike to Alvarez with the count 0-1. Period. End of discussion.

 

[ulmax]

It seems rays warm up as a starter is diff
I don't want him out of the bull pen
Unless the odds are good anyway
And maybe it was..but still Alvarez won that one....it happens...
I just want to forget it and move on..

The mariners still have 4 games
Or 3 or 2 to play..and a c rittical off season..coming..lets.go..

 

[cezero]

Of course you don't go after Alvarez in that situation.

I think implicit in SeattleCoug's post was that all pitchers can throw a mistake. Ray really only throws 2 pitches and is usually pretty consistent with control, so that amplifed the "gut punch" SeattleCoug was talking about. Much as that mistake sucked, and much as there's nothing wrong with questioning Servais' call there, I'm ready to move on.

 

[MarinersBestFan]

You don't throw a strike to Alvarez with the count 0-1. Period. End of discussion.

100% correct

That is the whole entire point about being AHEAD in the count as the pitcher. Make the batter hit YOUR pitch if he decides to take a hack at your 0-1 delivery.

I would rather have seen a down and away slider as it would have likely induced a swing and miss as he was clearly loaded up and sitting dead red fastball. A fast ball up and in would have been fine, he can swing as hard as he wants and fist one about 150 feet if he wants to rip at it.

Time to refocus and get after game#2.

it ain't over until it's over.

 

[SeattleCoug]

You don't throw a strike to Alvarez with the count 0-1. Period. End of discussion.

I am not at all defending the 0-1 pitch. It was awful, terrible, putrid whatever you want to call it. But if you are allowing Alvarez the chance to beat you, you are playing with fire. Outside of Judge, he's probably the best hitter in the game right now

 

[WizardHawk]

You can point to several bad decisions in that game. Chances you gave a dangerous team that you really shouldn't.

That wasn't the first game Acta fucked up and sent France. It was entirely inexcusable. You can't get thrown out on the bases.

There were others that they would have gotten away with had they got that last out.

I had little hope they could take this series before it started and now I've fully accepted they not only won't win the series, but likely won't win a game. Should they buck that, they for sure won't win two.

I'm more into what next? What does this front office do in the off season to keep going forward? How do they build back depth in the minors after all they spent on Castillo? How much will they spend on vets to fix some of the major holes?

 

[SeattleCoug]

I'm more into what next? What does this front office do in the off season to keep going forward? How do they build back depth in the minors after all they spent on Castillo? How much will they spend on vets to fix some of the major holes?

Yea i cant fully digest that until the season is over. I am not at all worried about what they spent on Castillo but the other questions are valid and hopefully can get answered.

 

[ulmax]

Msriners spent 120mil
League ave is..160 mil...
Conforto...easly...
Haniger easly..

Which is most of the free agents they will
Need..
Unless..ss anderson..or trey turner..
I don't expect that.

They could trade for a 2b..or resign frazier...is not a bad idea..
Then they are looking for a R/R ss/2B

Either Moore or toro..they have already
But neither are hitting
.all that well
I have to say ..really..its Moore or fraizer
But I really don't have a preferance..

Moore is under mariners control..
Hence

my..twinns trade for arraez..
It's do able if the twins would..
And I don't see why not..
He is not really the future for the twins
At 1b or 2b..so trading for a pitcher is prob as good as the twins could do

I fairly sure the new York Yankees will
jump on Frazier to help solve there infield
problems..and watch out for the yankees
Too
everyone's surprise..when they trade for
Ohtani..and trout..