AFCN Hate Guide

[cincygrad]

Is Dax Hill good at football? Gonna be thinking about that for months. Because he's in the fire now.

There is no reason to believe he isn't.... He was terrific at Michigan. His athletic measureables are better than most safeties in the league. He looked terrific during the preseason (for what that is worth). Making any judgements on his abilities from his experience last season is premature - He often played out of position and he was often brought in during less than ideal parts of games or at difficult times of the season.

I'm not saying he's Bates..... But he was a higher draft pick than Bates, is a tremendous athlete, and has the potential to be a top-end starter.

 

[Ickey Shuffle]

There is no reason to believe he isn't.... He was terrific at Michigan. His athletic measureables are better than most safeties in the league. He looked terrific during the preseason (for what that is worth). Making any judgements on his abilities from his experience last season is premature - He often played out of position and he was often brought in during less than ideal parts of games or at difficult times of the season.

I'm not saying he's Bates..... But he was a higher draft pick than Bates, is a tremendous athlete, and has the potential to be a top-end starter.

The Bengals haven't exactly been lucky with high draft picks in the secondary working out in recent memory. But I'll give him a chance before making any judgments.

 

[cincygrad]

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Even as a Browns fan that seems very questionable

 

[Ickey Shuffle]

If I remember, Cody Ford lost his starting job to Bobby Hart years ago. Oh Lord lol. He better end up being deep in the depth chart.

 

[cincygrad]

Even as a Browns fan that seems very questionable

To be fair, the overall deal is a good one. I think they are getting a good player at a reasonable price. When they were mentioned in the Jessie Bates chatter, I thought it would be a bad move because I think Bates is getting too much money as a safety that doesn't make many game-changing plays. Thornhill is about half the price of Bates and he's a solid player.

 

[Cincyfan78]

If I remember, Cody Ford lost his starting job to Bobby Hart years ago. Oh Lord lol. He better end up being deep in the depth chart.

You remember incorrectly, I am going to assume based on this...

The only year they overlapped was in 2021 in Buff and Ford played in 15 games and Hart played in 1.

 

[Ickey Shuffle]

You remember incorrectly, I am going to assume based on this...

The only year they overlapped was in 2021 in Buff and Ford played in 15 games and Hart played in 1.

Wasn't that around Ford got traded and Hart got on the roster?

Well in any case, Ford won't be starting. So it's a wash. But knowing their luck, at least 2 of our lineup will be injured by November.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

To be fair, the overall deal is a good one. I think they are getting a good player at a reasonable price. When they were mentioned in the Jessie Bates chatter, I thought it would be a bad move because I think Bates is getting too much money as a safety that doesn't make many game-changing plays. Thornhill is about half the price of Bates and he's a solid player.

Its structured is more my issue. Feels very much like cap evasion.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

I'd think the browns are about done except for WR

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

4 voided years for a 3yr $21m contract...

 

[Shanemansj13]

I'd think the browns are about done except for WR

Yeah other than depth moves.
They still need a backup QB unless they roll with Mond.
Backup RB
Speed WR
Backup TE
Hopefully they bring Walker back.
Maybe another edge

A couple of these needs in the draft especially TE. The draft is loaded with TE's

Who do you prefer at WR? I think Chark is too expensive. I am all for Hardman, not at his market value though.

 

[Shanemansj13]

4 voided years for a 3yr $21m contract...

These teams have analytical teams now to work their way around the cap...it's crazy

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Yeah other than depth moves.
They still need a backup QB unless they roll with Mond.
Backup RB
Speed WR
Backup TE
Hopefully they bring Walker back.
Maybe another edge

A couple of these needs in the draft especially TE. The draft is loaded with TE's

Who do you prefer at WR? I think Chark is too expensive. I am all for Hardman, not at his market value though.

Hardman if he can come in cheaper

 

[Cincyfan78]

Wasn't that around Ford got traded and Hart got on the roster?

Well in any case, Ford won't be starting. So it's a wash. But knowing their luck, at least 2 of our lineup will be injured by November.

Not really - that would have been off-season, but the bigger thing was Ford felt like he was a RT, and the Bills only saw him as an IOL. Thus, the trade. Hart is a RT fully (though you could argue he's not much of anything..lol) - but really the Bills viewed Hart and Ford as two different positional players. Bills thought they could draft him, move him to OG and he would work out...didn't work out.

One of the reasons he chose CIN was they were willing to give him a shot at RT. In the end, it's a depth signing with a potential lottery ticket. If he works out - Bengals are better at RT. If he doesn't, he's depth along the line - and no worse than Scharping was last year...but hopefully, the Bengals still focus on grabbing a few OL in the draft or 1 more in F/A.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

These teams have analytical teams now to work their way around the cap...it's crazy

Just more evidence to support the fact that the salary cap is an imaginary boogeyman.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

ooOoOooo interesting


@Cincyfan78 @cincygrad @CrashDavisSports @Ickey Shuffle

 

[cincygrad]

These teams have analytical teams now to work their way around the cap...it's crazy

The most simple way to do this would be to push all that money to a year where you no longer expect to employ the QB that eats up the cap room. You can clear a lot of old cap space by having a QB on a rookie deal..... But, teams are being much more aggressive with this strategy right now and there are I think the jury is still out on the idea you can just magically manipulate it to mean nothing.

 

[cincygrad]

ooOoOooo interesting


@Cincyfan78 @cincygrad @CrashDavisSports @Ickey Shuffle

I posted this on the Bengals thread, but I'll repeat here..... Good place to be for the Bengals. If someone wants to offer a third rounder for Williams, you can take the pick and add 12 million dollars of space back to your available cap. There are still a few options out there for RT and there are a couple of options in the building as well.

You could also tell Williams that you aren't moving him. His only option would be to sit out and forgo 12 million dollars....And the last season of available tape on the guy would include two dislocated knee caps and poor play. Not sure his market would be that great.

To me, if the guy has any capability of playing on the right side, he should play for the Bengals. If he has even an average year, he'd be due a huge payday given his position versatility (left of right), age, and pedigree.

 

[Shanemansj13]

The most simple way to do this would be to push all that money to a year where you no longer expect to employ the QB that eats up the cap room. You can clear a lot of old cap space by having a QB on a rookie deal..... But, teams are being much more aggressive with this strategy right now and there are I think the jury is still out on the idea you can just magically manipulate it to mean nothing.

It's why the Browns aren't restructuring too many contracts. They had the ability to restructure totally around $90M. They have only done Watson right now. Some of these teams got crazy especially the Saints the last couple years and now they signed a QB at almost $40M/year. That's why most think it's imaginary. Not the right way and eventually it will hurt you but if you draft well then you have a shot