2016 Rosterbation

[calsnowskier]

Pretty much what Best said.

Heston may have been a rookie, but he was not a kid. For him to have hit the wall to that extent at his age is rather alarming. Even worse, if that was not a wall, but just a return to the mean, or a league adjustment to him, then he is done.

I have no prob with him being the #6. But to enter the season with him as an expected contributor is just playing with fire.

 

[tzill]

I totally agree that we need to lock down the rotation.

My pause with Heston goes further than what he showed on the mound. Yes, he was the second best pitcher on the staff from April-July (which doesn't say much, but he was good). Yes, he threw a no-hitter. Yes, he's a groundball machine and with our defense that is definitely a plus. My concern with his was his second half struggles, his overall command issues, and the fact that he didn't really show what he was doing from April-July at any level in his career. Maybe he was just hot and unknown, but the league adjusted to him. There's also the main factor that Cain's $20M salary isn't going anywhere, Peavy's $15M salary probably isn't going anywhere and Heston can be sent to the minor leagues. Peavy was wonderful down the stretch and Cain always had his stuff but just didn't look right, there's some hope that with a full offseason back to regular training, he can become a decent back end guy.

I personally don't trust Heston to be more than a 6th man rotation guy, and would be worried if we went into 2016 with Bum-Leake-Peavy-Cain-Heston. There just aren't enough innings in that rotation. You have Bum, but then Leake who only pitched over 200 innings once, Peavy who can't get past the 6th generally, Cain who is a complete wild card, and Heston who faded down the stretch. In my opinion, the Giants need to add 2 guys who can eat up some innings to offset the probable lack of innings from Peavy/Cain, which leaves Heston outside, looking in.

Well, to be fair, Leake has been incredibly durable his entire career. He may not go extremely deep into games, but he takes the ball 30+ times. I'm not advocating a Bum/Leake/Peavy/Cain/Hesto rotation either, but my quibble is the implication that Leake is either injury prone or a liability in the rotation innings-wise. I mean, he has pitched 190+ innings the last four years in a row...

 

[tzill]

That makes perfect sense in terms of your feelings towards Heston. I would counter with something you probably already thought of and/or know, which is that he pitched more innings then he ever had in his career so him fading towards the end of the season seemed more fatigue based then anything else...although there IS the risk that the league just flat out figured him out.

The Cain contract is interesting to me because as much as I love him, I have this feeling deep in my gut that Cain ain't gonna be the Cain we know any longer.

We def need a guy or two with an elastic arm that can regularly go 200 innings through the life of his contract.

Sure, but what team DOESN'T need that guy? Those guys are rare, and as FAs typically cost a bundle.

 

[dredinis21]

Sure, but what team DOESN'T need that guy? Those guys are rare, and as FAs typically cost a bundle.

True dat but the coin is worth it IF that pitcher holds up his part of this, especially given the fact that we don't have guys outside of MadBum (and often Leake) that consistently get you into 7th/8th.

 

[calsnowskier]

True dat but the coin is worth it IF that pitcher holds up his part of this, especially given the fact that we don't have guys outside of MadBum (and often Leake) that consistently get you into 7th/8th.

Again, as tz said, these guys are SUPER rare in today's game. Especially when you have an elite bully, as the Giants have.

 

[SFGRTB]

Both Aoki's and Byrd's options have been declined.

Aoki has passed all his concussion tests and has been deemed healthy, but Bobby Evans said he wants to keep his options open this early in the offseason.

 

[calsnowskier]

Both Aoki's and Byrd's options have been declined.

Aoki has passed all his concussion tests and has been deemed healthy, but Bobby Evans said he wants to keep his options open this early in the offseason.

We all expected the Byrd decline. But I am very surprised about Aoki. He was a flat-out stud in the first half last year.

So now the OF looks like this...

Pence
Pagan
Blanco
Parker/Williamson/Tomlinson

I can only assume this means they REALLY like what they saw from Parker and/or KT, or they are going to make a play on Cespedes, Upton or Hayward.

For the record, I have yet to see the wisdom in this move.

 

[dredinis21]

Again, as tz said, these guys are SUPER rare in today's game. Especially when you have an elite bully, as the Giants have.

Again, as tz said, these guys are SUPER rare in today's game. Especially when you have an elite bully, as the Giants have.

We all expected the Byrd decline. But I am very surprised about Aoki. He was a flat-out stud in the first half last year.

So now the OF looks like this...

Pence
Pagan
Blanco
Parker/Williamson/Tomlinson

I can only assume this means they REALLY like what they saw from Parker and/or KT, or they are going to make a play on Cespedes, Upton or Hayward.

For the record, I have yet to see the wisdom in this move.

I also really liked Aoki as our leadoff hitter moreso then anyone in recent memory,

 

[SFGRTB]

We all expected the Byrd decline. But I am very surprised about Aoki. He was a flat-out stud in the first half last year.

So now the OF looks like this...

Pence
Pagan
Blanco
Parker/Williamson/Tomlinson

I can only assume this means they REALLY like what they saw from Parker and/or KT, or they are going to make a play on Cespedes, Upton or Hayward.

For the record, I have yet to see the wisdom in this move.

Maybe they just don't want to limit their options before exploring them. FWIW, sounds like Aoki is still open to a return. They declined Vogey's option and brought him back after they explored other options last offseason (as a beat writer pointed out).

 

[calsnowskier]

Maybe they just don't want to limit their options before exploring them. FWIW, sounds like Aoki is still open to a return. They declined Vogey's option and brought him back after they explored other options last offseason (as a beat writer pointed out).

If they were to resign him, they would need to sign him to a 1/4.8 to break even on the transaction. I would think he could get better than that elsewhere, and not have to pay California income tax on 65% of his paycheck.

 

[Mays-Fan]

Both Aoki's and Byrd's options have been declined.

Aoki has passed all his concussion tests and has been deemed healthy, but Bobby Evans said he wants to keep his options open this early in the offseason.

Which is a wise stance to take. He does not want to tip his hand that he is only going after FAs who are SPs. If that is even the case.

Also, a GM needs to invest the team's $$$ in the player who will provide the greatest marginal improvement for the money. I'm not convinced, Evans probably isn't, and neither should anyone else be, that currently the only way to do that is by going after SP's.

 

[tzill]

Also, a GM needs to invest the team's $$$ in the player who will provide the greatest marginal improvement for the money. I'm not convinced, Evans probably isn't, and neither should anyone else be, that currently the only way to do that is by going after SP's.

This....so much this.

 

[LHG]

There you guys go, talking baseball without me. How dare you.

Going back to Heston, I didn't know this until just know, he led the league in hit by pitches. Yeah, he needs to work on his control a bit. Looking at his monthly breakdown, I think we've all forgotten how great he did in April before hitting the skids briefly in May. From May 6th to June 2nd, he made 6 starts and allowed at least 5 runs in 4 of them. His no-hitter on June 9th turned his season around. I think we do know what we have Heston, a streaky pitcher who's body of work will make him a solid 4th or 5th starter. However, I acknowledge that I could be very wrong on this and he turns out to be another Ryan Jensen.

I am in favor of the Giants declining the option on Aoki. I believe Mays called it correctly in that it gives Evans more flexibility in negotiating with agents of starting pitchers as well as look into other options for the outfield. It will be interesting to see if Aoki comes back and, if so, is it on a multi year deal?

 

[Mays-Fan]

Also, a GM needs to invest the team's $$$ in the player who will provide the greatest marginal improvement for the money. I'm not convinced, Evans probably isn't, and neither should anyone else be, that currently the only way to do that is by going after SP's.

This....so much this.[/QUOTE]


"Ya gotta keep an open mind about these things."

 

[dredinis21]

My thing with Aoki is that he seemed to be a great lead off guy for us when he wasn't concussed.

 

[dredinis21]

My thing with Aoki is that he seemed to be a great lead off guy for us when he wasn't concussed.

shit, already said that, now I'm repeating myself....I AM getting old.

 

[Mays-Fan]

shit, already said that, now I'm repeating myself....I AM getting old.

Naaah. It's like playing your favorite song over.

 

[Stokes1931]

Why did Mike Leake get bad?

 

[LHG]

Why did Mike Leake get bad?

I don't know, you tell me!

Okay, I read the article and I got out of it is, essentially, the Giants tweaked his pitch selection to his detriment. I know, I know, its more complicated than that but its sounds like, in order to make him better, they made him worse. If he comes back, I wonder how they will move forward with that?

 

[SFGRTB]

My concern is age/injuries. Aoki will be 34 next year. Pagan is a roll of the dice health-wise. Blanco and Pence aren't getting any younger either. Parker was amazing in a SSS, but most of that was in less meaningful games. He could easily be a Brandon Hicks of the OF, too.

I think there is room and need for a proven, quality OF, preferably one that can play CF. I can't speak for the clubhouse aspect, but Rasmus looks like a decent choice. He can play all OF positions, as he did last year with the Astros. I could see giving him a 1/9 or a 2/16:

Colby Rasmus Statistics and History | Baseball-Reference.com

And I am leery of spending big $$$ to pay an above-market price for a long-term contract on a pitcher. The odds on longevity there are not good. Leake is as far as I would go.

Well, Aoki is gone for now, and Rasmus has been offered a qualifying offer worth $15.8M. So, it's gonna cost us quite a bit more.