WVU starts a new losing streak

[Slaton10]

Don't fool yourselves..that game set basketball back 40 years..

 

[Mac_Bridger]

Back to your basketball debate.

Take this scenario. We get sags and beetle back and win the B12 and go to the dance. We knock off a #2 seed and get an easy path to the elite 8 where the run ends. We end up ranked at #13.

BBW would you call this a successful season? Dad? MAC.

If we were to win the Big 12 and make the elite 8 it would be a success. Overcoming adversity is the most difficult challenge. I would probably remember that kind of feat as the greatest turnaround in WVU hoops history.

 

[bbwvfan]

Back to your basketball debate.

Take this scenario. We get sags and beetle back and win the B12 and go to the dance. We knock off a #2 seed and get an easy path to the elite 8 where the run ends. We end up ranked at #13.

BBW would you call this a successful season? Dad? MAC.

No... the season wouldn’t be a success. We sucked ass for 7/8 of it...

Once again, I don’t believe NCAA tournament runs indicate anything but a tournament run. We’ve seen a bunch of Cinderellas through the years... some make the Final 4. Getting hot and having mojo in a tournament is nice and fun stuff. But, just like the year SU made the Final 4... 2016?... that team sucked for most of the year.

 

[Anotherwvufan]

Respectfully I disagree.

No matter the sport, every team either gets better or worse during the season. In basketball, every team has a chance to be the next Cinderella. It keeps things interesting as a fan knowing that your team could still make the dance and even take it all. Compare that with football where once your team loses 2 games, they are eliminated from realistic playoff contention.
To be the champion, you have to make it through the dance. If you have the best players who have an off day, there goes Cinderella. Other than the NHL playoffs, the Dance gives a gauntlet that all teams have to negotiate. Being good in the regular season, gives you a big advantage by getting an easier trip through the Dance, but you still have to win.
Syracuse absolutely deserved to be in the Dance in 2016 and they proved it by winning and making the final 4.
The team you end with never the same you started with. Freshman learn, players get injured and the best team at the start of the season is often not the best at the end. (see Duke lose without Dion).
In a game where a team can lose by 31 points and beat the same team two weeks later, it does not hurt to give everyone a shot and let them decide it on the court.
Much different that football where you can take #1 and #2 at the start of the season and pencil them into the NCS game.

 

[WVUDAD]

Back to your basketball debate.

Take this scenario. We get sags and beetle back and win the B12 and go to the dance. We knock off a #2 seed and get an easy path to the elite 8 where the run ends. We end up ranked at #13.

BBW would you call this a successful season? Dad? MAC.

With the way the season has gone so far, I would say that would be a HUGE success for next years outlook, the team would have improved greatly, the players grown up, and Huggins earned his salary. I would not however call it a successful season as a whole. Unlike football, everything in the basketball tournament is EARNED, what matters is your performance on the court, NOT your name or what league you play in, but the play of the team. The way a football "champion" is crowned is ridiculous, half the teams are out of the hunt before the season begins, based solely on the league they play in, not the game they play.

 

[bbwvfan]

Not surprised to see a differing opinion.

SU finished the regular season unranked the year they made the Final 4. They finished the regular season with a 9-9 conference record... with 13 losses.

This SU team that deserved to be in the dance, they lost their last 3 games of the regular season. Lost 5 of their last 6. Due to upsets in their bracket, they played against a 15 seed and an 11 seed to advance to the Elite 8. They were lucky to get UofV... a team that always chokes in the tournament. The first 1 seed to lose to a 16 last year. What a joke!

The gauntlet for the NCAA tournament is a fair one... each team is seeded based on their regular season resume. But, it does not identify the best team... just the team that wins it all.

Most of the serious sports fans I know enjoy the dance like I do. But, all of us know... a 1 game all or nothing stake game... does not identify the best of anything. In playoffs, NHL... MLB... College Baseball... the NBA... teams advance after winning a series. Anything can happen in a 1 gm scenario.

The NCAA field is littered with teams like SU's '16 squad that got hot for a dance competition. Look at all of the low major conferences... 1 bid leagues they call them. The team in the NCAA tournament is the team that wins their respective conference tournament. The best team... the team that won the regular season... is often not the team that advances to the NCAA. They got upset at the wrong time.

Pitt beat WVU 13-9 in '07. The best team did not win. WVU did not get to play for a NC.

We ended up with Billy Stewart. Enough said...

 

[Slaton10]

With the way the season has gone so far, I would say that would be a HUGE success for next years outlook, the team would have improved greatly, the players grown up, and Huggins earned his salary. I would not however call it a successful season as a whole. Unlike football, everything in the basketball tournament is EARNED, what matters is your performance on the court, NOT your name or what league you play in, but the play of the team. The way a football "champion" is crowned is ridiculous, half the teams are out of the hunt before the season begins, based solely on the league they play in, not the game they play.

Really....You think a Cinderella team that gets hot from the 3 point line like a Florida GulF Coast...that upsets a top seed EARNED something...throw UMBC in there...they got lucky..

 

[bbwvfan]

Really....You think a Cinderella team that gets hot from the 3 point line like a Florida GulF Coast...that upsets a top seed EARNED something...throw UMBC in there...they got lucky..

How the hell does that make any fucking sense?

 

[Anotherwvufan]

If you want the best team, you can usually find them in the preseason polls. I'll take Duke (with Zion) in the best of 7 against anybody.

The tourney or a real playoff does not choose the best team, it chooses a champion. We see Super bowl champs come from the wild card round. The fact that a team like Syracuse can make a run to the final four from a high seed makes the sport more interesting and fun for me to watch.

 

[bbwvfan]

If you want the best team, you can usually find them in the preseason polls. I'll take Duke (with Zion) in the best of 7 against anybody.

The tourney or a real playoff does not choose the best team, it chooses a champion. We see Super bowl champs come from the wild card round. The fact that a team like Syracuse can make a run to the final four from a high seed makes the sport more interesting and fun for me to watch.

The NCAA tournament is fun to watch! It does produce a champion! It does all of that... as well as make the NCAA a shit load of money.

But, let’s stop talking about NCAA finishes like they distinguish coaching excellence. The opposite is also true... correct? Coaches can be outstanding while their team struggles in the dance.

IMO, the UofV coach... Bennet... is one of the best in the profession. I’m not going to change my opinion of him simply because he had the first #1 seed loss in the history of the tournament.

 

[Anotherwvufan]

"But, let’s stop talking about NCAA finishes like they distinguish coaching excellence. The opposite is also true... correct? Coaches can be outstanding while their team struggles in the dance."

Reality check Who was it on this board who liked to hound Huggs for a WVU loss to Stephen V. Austin in the NCAA first round?

 

[WVUDAD]

SU finished the regular season unranked the year they made the Final 4.

Then why play ANY games in any sport? Since some folks are so caught up with rankings, which are based as much or more on name than the level of play, let's just look at the preseason rankings, and pass out the trophy. How great would that be, the best team would win the title every year, no one would be injured by actually playing, every cent brought in would be profit, we wouldn't need stadiums and field houses, no assistant coaches, players, or equipment!!!

 

[bbwvfan]

"But, let’s stop talking about NCAA finishes like they distinguish coaching excellence. The opposite is also true... correct? Coaches can be outstanding while their team struggles in the dance."

Reality check Who was it on this board who liked to hound Huggs for a WVU loss to Stephen V. Austin in the NCAA first round?

That's exactly the point he's been trying to make though. Some WVU fans lost their fucking minds because WVU got whipped by ISU this year. A significant portion of our fanbase are thrilled today that Dana is no longer our HC.

This same group screaming for a HC to be fired... a HC who had us ranked in the top 20 the past 2 out of 3 years... could have been 3/3 had Will not broken his finger... give Huggy a pass with every failure.

Think about that. Every fucking failure... Huggy gets a pass.

When asked for reasons why. You get Huggy's record of Sweet 16 appearances.

IMO... it truly shows the level of deep understanding of the two sports is pathetic amongst our fans.

 

[bbwvfan]

Then why play ANY games in any sport? Since some folks are so caught up with rankings, which are based as much or more on name than the level of play, let's just look at the preseason rankings, and pass out the trophy. How great would that be, the best team would win the title every year, no one would be injured by actually playing, every cent brought in would be profit, we wouldn't need stadiums and field houses, no assistant coaches, players, or equipment!!!

This is such a lazy... bullshit response. Congrats!!

Your penis envy is strong.

Bluebloods get highly ranked when they win. They don't get highly ranked if they lose.

There is nothing wrong with the NCAA tournament if you enjoy it. Why should it matter if it doesn't identify the best team in the sport like other collegiate sports do? It provides millions of Americans a great ride for a few weeks every single year.

But let me ask you a question, why do you think it's alright to throw away nearly 4 months of the season? Why doesn't the regular season matter to you? College basketball plays 30 regular season games. In WVU's case, they play 18 conference games every year. H/H with every single conference opponent. None of that matters to you.

I honestly don't understand how anyone could look at it that way...

 

[Anotherwvufan]

That's exactly the point he's been trying to make though. Some WVU fans lost their fucking minds because WVU got whipped by ISU this year. A significant portion of our fanbase are thrilled today that Dana is no longer our HC.

This same group screaming for a HC to be fired... a HC who had us ranked in the top 20 the past 2 out of 3 years... could have been 3/3 had Will not broken his finger... give Huggy a pass with every failure.

Think about that. Every fucking failure... Huggy gets a pass.

When asked for reasons why. You get Huggy's record of Sweet 16 appearances.

IMO... it truly shows the level of deep understanding of the two sports is pathetic amongst our fans.

Nehlen would have also got a pass. Most of the fan base is happy to have huggs here. Holgerson never really had that type of love. He came in under controversy and was never a accepted by a large portion of the fanbase.
The loss to ISU last year kept us out of the CCG. Losses to KU and ISU in earlier years was embarrassing. Dad may overemphasize one game, but the pattern was there and it looked like a ceiling had been reached
Maybe he can beat Oklahoma while at Houston.

 

[bbwvfan]

Nehlen would have also got a pass. Most of the fan base is happy to have huggs here. Holgerson never really had that type of love. He came in under controversy and was never a accepted by a large portion of the fanbase.
The loss to ISU last year kept us out of the CCG. Losses to KU and ISU in earlier years was embarrassing. Dad may overemphasize one game, but the pattern was there and it looked like a ceiling had been reached
Maybe he can beat Oklahoma while at Houston.

I don't know... there were a lot of Nehlen haters. He wasn't going to get fired though. Fast Eddie would never have fired Nehlen. It simply wasn't the way Pastilong worked. Idk... did he fire a single coach during his time as AD? Honestly, I just can't remember one unless they committed some huge violation like the soccer coach. My memory is hazy there.

But, the last few years of Nehlen's tenure brought planes and banners. For a fan to spend money to do so... especially at that time... is noteworthy.

My boy Slaton feels Huggs is overrated as a HC. I understand his argument, but don't agree completely with it. Huggs has accomplished a lot with little talent. There is something to be said for that.

But, he came to WVU believing he could bring talent to Morgantown. And, he didn't. IMO, he won't. Unless he's willing to admit his system won't be attractive to elite ballers, we're stuck being who we are under him.

Talk about a ceiling...

 

[WVUDAD]

This is such a lazy... bullshit response. Congrats!!

Your penis envy is strong.

Bluebloods get highly ranked when they win. They don't get highly ranked if they lose.

There is nothing wrong with the NCAA tournament if you enjoy it. Why should it matter if it doesn't identify the best team in the sport like other collegiate sports do? It provides millions of Americans a great ride for a few weeks every single year.

But let me ask you a question, why do you think it's alright to throw away nearly 4 months of the season? Why doesn't the regular season matter to you? College basketball plays 30 regular season games. In WVU's case, they play 18 conference games every year. H/H with every single conference opponent. None of that matters to you.

I honestly don't understand how anyone could look at it that way...

THE REGULAR SEASON DOES MATTER. How do you get the high seeds? How do you get to the tourney? EVERY college sport at EVERY level HAS a playoff and crowns a champion ON THE FIELD OF PLAY, EXCEPT one. To say ANY other sport selects a champion like football does is just stupid.......when the champion is SELECTED, by a vote, not by playing on the field, it is BS. Did you hear what Urban Meyer said a few years ago? The year TCU and Baylor shared the B12 football crown, he said he was glad it was TCU and Baylor and not Texas and Oklahoma atop the B12 or his team would not have been there......THAT, my friend says it all.

 

[bbwvfan]

THE REGULAR SEASON DOES MATTER. How do you get the high seeds? How do you get to the tourney? EVERY college sport at EVERY level HAS a playoff and crowns a champion ON THE FIELD OF PLAY, EXCEPT one. To say ANY other sport selects a champion like football does is just stupid.......when the champion is SELECTED, by a vote, not by playing on the field, it is BS. Did you hear what Urban Meyer said a few years ago? The year TCU and Baylor shared the B12 football crown, he said he was glad it was TCU and Baylor and not Texas and Oklahoma atop the B12 or his team would not have been there......THAT, my friend says it all.

How does the regular season matter to the MAC, MEAC, MAAC, SWAC, Sun Belt, MVC, American East, Atlantic Sun, Big Sky, Big South, Big West, Colonial Athletic, Horizon, Northeast, Ohio Valley, Patriot League, Southern, Southland, Summit, WAC and West Coast?

It doesn’t. They place their tournament champion in the dance. You think beating one of these teams is a reason to celebrate.

the Ohio State earned the right to play in the first CFP because they earned more wins over top 25 opponents than either TCU or BU. BU was hurt because they played a weak ass OOC. TCU was hurt because OU lost to Okie St the last weekend of the regular season.

That, my friend.... is reality of college football. Not a poll based champion... hasn’t been for almost 30 years.

 

[WVUDAD]

How does the regular season matter to the MAC, MEAC, MAAC, SWAC, Sun Belt, MVC, American East, Atlantic Sun, Big Sky, Big South, Big West, Colonial Athletic, Horizon, Northeast, Ohio Valley, Patriot League, Southern, Southland, Summit, WAC and West Coast?

It doesn’t. They place their tournament champion in the dance. You think beating one of these teams is a reason to celebrate.

the Ohio State earned the right to play in the first CFP because they earned more wins over top 25 opponents than either TCU or BU. BU was hurt because they played a weak ass OOC. TCU was hurt because OU lost to Okie St the last weekend of the regular season.

That, my friend.... is reality of college football. Not a poll based champion... hasn’t been for almost 30 years.

Pure bs, funny that urban had the opinion that had TCU been Oklahoma that OSU would have been left out. Guess you know more about it than one of the best coaches the game has ever seen......unreal. so all those leagues teams dont care who their champions are....Holgorsen is gone, get over it. Every one else in the world except three luck lovers has the opinion that a sweet 16 appearance is a good season......get a clue

 

[bbwvfan]

Pure bs, funny that urban had the opinion that had TCU been Oklahoma that OSU would have been left out. Guess you know more about it than one of the best coaches the game has ever seen......unreal. so all those leagues teams dont care who their champions are....Holgorsen is gone, get over it. Every one else in the world except three luck lovers has the opinion that a sweet 16 appearance is a good season......get a clue

Urban is one of the greatest college football coaches of modern times.

He is too busy to know how the CFP Committee determines its rankings. I’ll stick to my understanding everyday of the week.

Whether you want to admit it, you are once again talking out of both sides. You hate polls... but, you’re good with the NCAA tournament. They have a committee that puts the field in a seeding based tournament. That’s basically ranking the teams #1-#68. That’s OK for you because they determine their champion on the court.

College football now has a committee ranking teams #1-25. WVU has been ranked in it the past 2 out of 3 years.

There isn’t a serious... knowledgeable... expert sports fan... who values the NCAA tournament the way you do. I must have a clue. My thoughts on the subject match the experts.