Game Thread: Week 11: Hawks vs 49ers "Must Play Better" Thread

[WizardHawk]

Yah they started to get back to it. I kind of meant it got abandoned really early, but then they started getting back to it. I get my comment was not clear, apologies. Either way I hope they stick with that more. They had the nice snaps under center working with playaction and everything. It was nice to see instead of shotgun 24/7 which has been the season theme. I think it was prob. to help Olu. Seattle prior to this game had the 4th highest shotgun rate in the league... when Williams was playing a full season for Miami, they were around the league average.

Grubb is a heavy shotgun coach, he was in UW as well. I'm not saying you have to snap under center, but it's nice to see. I mean take Creed Humphrey, that guy can't snap a ball to save his life, but his blocking is elite... Course he doesn't have a couple scrubs playing at guard, either... and an elite QB/Offensive coach.

As for your comment on throwing to runningbacks... yah it didn't work this game... K9 ranks 14th amongst all runningbacks for yards, and Charbs is 19. So combine them and it's not too horrible. What's a little more concerning though is K9/Charbs are ranked 21 and 22 respectively for yards per reception (and that's with RBs with over 20 receptions). So there's a good chunk of teams involving their RBs that are getting way more per reception than we are. And I know we can dig into stats all day, I didn't do a major in depth analysis on this (like looking at longs/outliers) but it does seem we're not getting much out of our RBs in receiving in terms of efficiency.

Now that all said, the stats I mentioned above are consistent with your comment. 7 yards on 4 plays... my question, is that on Geno (taking too long trying to huck it downfield and the checkdown gets spotted), is that play design from Grubb? I don't know... Other teams I've watched for a while seem to have no problem passing to a RB on a designed play and gashing us for 3rd and 15 conversions. lol, why can't we do that? The talent is there... at least at the RB spot.

You keep blaming Grubb for everything wrong with the offense.

Geno is in shotgun often not because that's all Grubb knows from college, but because it gives Geno an extra second to see the rush. Remember when Geno got stepped on while under center a couple of games ago? Remember any of the times under center where he panicked at a blitz or free rusher?

That line is not good man. Stop claiming a better OC would fix things.

There are FOR SURE plays that don't look right to us and some of those are FOR SURE on the OC. News flash: That can be said about 100% of the offenses in pro football. Period.

Remember when we had people up here bitching about Bevell during both of their SB seasons? Fans in SF are calling for their OC's head right now. People in KC bitching about lower offensive production. It SUCKS to be OC in this league with fans everywhere blaming them for things beyond their direct control. It's a fact of pro football.

The line is sub-par and Geno often makes less than ideal decisions within the plays called. That doesn't mean Grubb doesn't also pick some wrong plays or otherwise isn't to blame on any given play, but DC's are a thing man.

There is no way I would fire any of the staff this year even if/when they miss the playoffs. To me the person most on thin ice is JS. Need to see him win on personnel decisions in the offseason or it is time to move on to a new GM. He also needs to find answers at QB moving forward and that's a tall task.

Fix both lines or it's going to look similar next year no matter who is calling plays.

 

[flyerhawk]

You keep blaming Grubb for everything wrong with the offense.

Geno is in shotgun often not because that's all Grubb knows from college, but because it gives Geno an extra second to see the rush. Remember when Geno got stepped on while under center a couple of games ago? Remember any of the times under center where he panicked at a blitz or free rusher?

That line is not good man. Stop claiming a better OC would fix things.

There are FOR SURE plays that don't look right to us and some of those are FOR SURE on the OC. News flash: That can be said about 100% of the offenses in pro football. Period.

Remember when we had people up here bitching about Bevell during both of their SB seasons? Fans in SF are calling for their OC's head right now. People in KC bitching about lower offensive production. It SUCKS to be OC in this league with fans everywhere blaming them for things beyond their direct control. It's a fact of pro football.

The line is sub-par and Geno often makes less than ideal decisions within the plays called. That doesn't mean Grubb doesn't also pick some wrong plays or otherwise isn't to blame on any given play, but DC's are a thing man.

There is no way I would fire any of the staff this year even if/when they miss the playoffs. To me the person most on thin ice is JS. Need to see him win on personnel decisions in the offseason or it is time to move on to a new GM. He also needs to find answers at QB moving forward and that's a tall task.

Fix both lines or it's going to look similar next year no matter who is calling plays.

Blaming the OC is literally the easiest thing for a fan to do. Because fans ALWAYS have hindsight to rely on. They have no track record to compare against. When an OC makes a successful call it was the "obvious" call that anyone would have made. When an OC makes an unsuccesful call they should have done the opposite.

The infamous run call in the Patriots SB is a perfect example. If anyone of 4 different things happen differently and that is hailed as a brilliant call. Instead it is the worst call evah!

We literally have people here complaining that Geno isn't checking down enough. Hare some screenshots of the pocket when he was about to be sacked...



This is the pocket on the 2nd sack..



3rd sack...



These were all 3rd and long and in 2 of the 3 sacks the back was kept in to block. On the 3rd sack the back comes out but he is completely covered at the line.

This is why fans should focus on actual execution rather playcalling.

 

[WizardHawk]

Right, and when you see 6 blockers on 4 rushers like those pictures, you have double coverage on more than one receiver downfield and it limits the things a play caller has options for to get guys open.

They need to improve on the line or they aren't going to fix anything.

 

[flyerhawk]

Right, and when you see 6 blockers on 4 rushers like those pictures, you have double coverage on more than one receiver downfield and it limits the things a play caller has options for to get guys open.

They need to improve on the line or they aren't going to fix anything.

100% right. Even worse, it's a lot easier to play zone in those situations because you have 7 guys in coverage and only 4 router runners. This limits your ability to run screens as well.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

You keep blaming Grubb for everything wrong with the offense.

I was listening to Jeff Simmons the other day and was thinking I found Sharks alter ego because he was listing the same complaints about Grubb. He and the host went on to speculate which HC would be fired and would make a good OC here in Seattle. Good lord the Seahawks JUST hired the guy and half way into the season some are calling for him to get canned. That sort of knee jerk reaction when things get bumpy is why some teams are shit and always been crap. Got to give a new hire some time to install the offense and find the players that get the job done. The offense been rough but have had some good moments also, it's just comical in a sad way that the chorus of "off with his head" starts up so quickly (not even a full season).
Hoping for a win against the Cards next week because that will put a more optimistic mood with the fans.

 

[flyerhawk]

I was listening to Jeff Simmons the other day and was thinking I found Sharks alter ego because he was listing the same complaints about Grubb. He and the host went on to speculate which HC would be fired and would make a good OC here in Seattle. Good lord the Seahawks JUST hired the guy and half way into the season some are calling for him to get canned. That sort of knee jerk reaction when things get bumpy is why some teams are shit and always been crap. Got to give a new hire some time to install the offense and find the players that get the job done. The offense been rough but have had some good moments also, it's just comical in a sad way that the chorus of "off with his head" starts up so quickly (not even a full season).
Hoping for a win against the Cards next week because that will put a more optimistic mood with the fans.

What's funny to me is that we ALL knew that the biggest achilles' heel that was going to limit this team. The offensive line. And now that it has become clear that the offensive line is, in fact, our weakest component, some fans and talking heads want to blame the QB and/or the OC for our VERY uneven play on offense.

I do think that Grubb is going through growing pains which shouldn't be surprising since he made a pretty huge leap. But, IMO, I have been mostly happy with how he has run the offense. Unlike in previous regimes, this offense rarely gets called for false starts. They have been called for some illegal formation and illegal man downfield calls but that's been true across the league.

I like that we generally get the plays in quickly and aren't snapping it right at 0 as frequently.

I think our OL being so bad at run blocking is the biggest problem with the offense.

 

[Anointed One]

 

[flyerhawk]

One thing that has been true all season is that Riq and Spoon have been lock down on the outisde. Brown was a problem but Jobe has been remarkably better.

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

One thing that has been true all season is that Riq and Spoon have been lock down on the outisde. Brown was a problem but Jobe has been remarkably better.

I know with Brown, PFF had him graded as the highest press coverage DB in the NFL in 2023... but I don't know how often we are doing press this year.. and we only did it like 30% of the time last year. Also, Brown has big issues tackling just due to his size. By comparison Jobe is 2" taller, about a 1" longer wingspan, 2.2" longer arm length. In a game of inches, it can make a difference. Not saying shorter guys can't tackle, but I'm sure it's easier for guys with longer arms, etc. Witherspoon doesn't have as long of arms as Jobe but pretty much outdoes Brown in everything.

Now, Tariq has tackling issues as well, but his length and flat out speed makes him a better coverage DB. And the stats show it, allowing generally anywhere from 10-20 points less QB rating average compared to Tre Brown.

Neither are good tacklers, but you can prob. get away with having one DB really good at coverage but poor at tackling.. hell look at Deion Sanders, that guy couldn't tackle for beans, but QBs thought twice about throwing at him.

Anyway, unless there's some nagging injury with Brown, in the last 4 games Jobe has completely taken him out of getting snaps... and Jobe is playing well, so unless there's an injury I don't know if Brown sees the field the rest of the season.