Perk to Cleveland

[trojanfan12]

just asking

so if the Cavs make the Finals against the:

Spurs

Grizzlies

Warriors

Thunder

who do you think the Cavs are favored against?

I think the Cavs would be favored against the Thunder...and MAYBE against Memphis- but i think Golden State would be favored and I think the Spurs would probably be favored....

Doesn't matter. Bottom line, Lebron/Cavs have put themselves in a position to where anything less than a title is a failure.

Pretty funny how in post #99, you tell us all about how much more talented the Cavs are than the Heat were and then later in the same post and in post 100, you still try to set it up as if the Cavs not winning a title is still successful.

Embrace the fact that no title = failure or stfu about it because no one is buying what you're selling.

 

[trojanfan12]

just out of curiousity- does anyone have an example of a team with a coach that has never coached in the NBA- or even a rookie NBA head coach, and a team that had over 50% turnover winning a title? or making it to the Finals? or even making it to the conference finals?

id be interested to know.....

I present to you the 1979-80 Los Angeles Lakers.

The 1978-79 Lakers were coached by Jerry West, finished 47-35 and were eliminated in the Western Conference Semi-Finals.

6 players from the '78-'79 team were not on the '79-'80 Lakers. An additional 4 players were traded during the '79-'80 season. 2 (Ron Boone and Kenny Carr) were traded 6 games into the season, 1 (Ollie Mack) was traded 27 games into the season and 1 (Don Ford) was traded 52 games into the season.

Additionally, head coach Jack McKinney suffered a near fatal head injury 19 games into the season and was replaced by Paul Westhead whose NBA experience was as an assistant coach to Jack McKinney for those 19 games before his injury. They won the championship defeating the favored Philadelphia 76ers 4 games to 2.

So yes, it's been done.

Another Cavs excuse shot all to hell.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Doesn't matter. Bottom line, Lebron/Cavs have put themselves in a position to where anything less than a title is a failure.

Pretty funny how in post #99, you tell us all about how much more talented the Cavs are than the Heat were and then later in the same post and in post 100, you still try to set it up as if the Cavs not winning a title is still successful.

Embrace the fact that no title = failure or stfu about it because no one is buying what you're selling.

You beat me to it..
He says the Cavs are BETTER then the 2 time/4 straight Finals Heat, but also says they could lose before reaching the Finals...
At this point, I'm beginning to wonder if the time spent debating with him is simply wasted time?

I'll simplify it Wiggy.
YES, of course the Cavs can lose, and in a few cases it might not be considered an 'upset', but if they do lose, the Cavs season is a bust because of all the for mentioned things we have pointed out.

 

[Black Adam]

Perkins is garbage... but dude has the best luck of any player I have ever seen. First he gets on Boston during the Big 3 years and gets a title. The he goes to OKC and gets to be on an elite team competing for titles. Now he finds himself in Cleveland on an elite level team. Seriously... if the Pelicans somehow claim the #1 seed next season him and Norris Cole need to start their own team..they'd be great by default.

lmao you beat me to this, Flauge. but i was thinking the same damn thing...

 

[Black Adam]

You beat me to it..
He says the Cavs are BETTER then the 2 time/4 straight Finals Heat, but also says they could lose before reaching the Finals...
At this point, I'm beginning to wonder if the time spent debating with him is simply wasted time?

I'll simplify it Wiggy.
YES, of course the Cavs can lose, and in a few cases it might not be considered an 'upset', but if they do lose, the Cavs season is a bust because of all the for mentioned things we have pointed out.

pretty simple stuff imo...and i'm guessing most folks get it...

 

[WiggyRuss]

This is just humorous coming from the guys who were all in a huff and discounted the Cavs because of the lack of playoff experience that Love and Kyrie have.

At least I am consistent in saying that if the Cavs lose to a loaded West team I do not consider it a failure. One week you guys rip on the Cavs as little as a month ago, and rip on their lack of playoff experience- and then the next week say that its championship or bust.

Hey if you guys are saying that the Cavs are the most talented team and that playoff experience is not a major problem for Kyrie and Love I dont disagree with you. Keep on preaching to the choir.

My only concern is running into a West team that is nearly as talented but has been together for years. If the Cavs lose a hotly contested series to the Spurs, Griz, Thunder or Warriors I cant say I would consider the season a failure- especially because the Cavs will only come back next year even more loaded than this year.

This is just the beginnng guys. You gotta come to terms with that. This year- while the guys get to know eachother- while Love and Kyrie adjust to not being #1's and Blatt adjusts to coaches and players he has mostly never gone against- this is the best opportunity for another team to get a title for the next handful of years.

So please, at least get your stories straight- during the losing streak a month ago everyone ran away from the Cavs like they had ebola. Now, after winning 16 of 18 and doing so with a top 5 defense its "championship or bust".....smh.....



a side note about Perk. Obviously he matches up pretty well against the Wiz (even though we wont need him to beat that bunch of imposters), and Memphis he should help- but i also think he should help against the Bulls- and in particular Gasol. Last time they played right befoe the break Gasol hurt the CAvs in the first quarter when Mozgov got in foul trouble and there was no Kevin Love to put pressure on their bigs defensively....I like Perk coming in in case of some Mozgov foul trouble and beating up Pau- especially because Pau doe not move so well anymore.

I will say I was giving the Bulls like a 33% chance to beat the Cavs- but after watching how the Cavs have played since the trades and LeBron resting- and getting that little bit of depth in Perk (which is admittedly a much smaller component)- I would put the Bulls chances at 20%.....Thus- with just a 1/5 shot, in my mind, of beating the Cavs- i do have to say- its FINALS or bust for the Cavs....

but to say the Cavs HAVE to beat a loaded WEstern team that has been together for years....ya....I cant say that


-Was that West's first coaching job in the NBA? Ill have to do a little research....was over 50% of the team new? (75% of the Cavs are new- but ill just put it at 50% for simplicity sake)...ill do a little research on that...

 

[WiggyRuss]

Wait a

I present to you the 1979-80 Los Angeles Lakers.

The 1978-79 Lakers were coached by Jerry West, finished 47-35 and were eliminated in the Western Conference Semi-Finals.

6 players from the '78-'79 team were not on the '79-'80 Lakers. An additional 4 players were traded during the '79-'80 season. 2 (Ron Boone and Kenny Carr) were traded 6 games into the season, 1 (Ollie Mack) was traded 27 games into the season and 1 (Don Ford) was traded 52 games into the season.

Additionally, head coach Jack McKinney suffered a near fatal head injury 19 games into the season and was replaced by Paul Westhead whose NBA experience was as an assistant coach to Jack McKinney for those 19 games before his injury. They won the championship defeating the favored Philadelphia 76ers 4 games to 2.

So yes, it's been done.

Another Cavs excuse shot all to hell.

Wait a minute wait a minute- your comparing that to team that MISSED THE PLAYOFFS last year- and has a coach that has never coached in the NBA?

wait wait....jus to get this straight- one hand- 30 some win team with a coach that never coached in the league- and only has 3 returning players------- to a team that won 47 games AND a playoff series?!

Compared to a team that won 47 games and won a playoff series?!!! REALLY???? REALLY?

BAHHAHAHAAHA....cmon man.....thats a bigger reach than thinking Wade would be healthy for a whole NBA season at this point in his career

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Wait a


Wait a minute wait a minute- your comparing that to team that MISSED THE PLAYOFFS last year- and has a coach that has never coached in the NBA?

wait wait....jus to get this straight- one hand- 30 some win team with a coach that never coached in the league- and only has 3 returning players------- to a team that won 47 games AND a playoff series?!

Compared to a team that won 47 games and won a playoff series?!!! REALLY???? REALLY?

BAHHAHAHAAHA....cmon man.....thats a bigger reach than thinking Wade would be healthy for a whole NBA season at this point in his career

Unbelievable once again.
WHO CARES how many wins last year Cavs had when this is a completely different roster?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Celtics had the WORST record in the league the season previous to Garnett/Allen joining Pierce.

Bottom line, Blatt doesn't play and James calls the shots, so don't mention coaching again as an excuse.

Talent wins.
If the Cavs have all of this great talent other then James, as you proclaim on here every single day, then once again, anything less than 16 playoff wins is a failed season for James.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Unbelievable once again.
WHO CARES how many wins last year Cavs had when this is a completely different roster?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Celtics had the WORST record in the league the season previous to Garnett/Allen joining Pierce.

Bottom line, Blatt doesn't play and James calls the shots, so don't mention coaching again as an excuse.

Talent wins.
If the Cavs have all of this great talent other then James, as you proclaim on here every single day, then once again, anything less than 16 playoff wins is a failed season for James.

ok....so just so we are on the same page now- you are saying playoff experience should not matter for the CAvs? I have contended that all along but a lot of other people have said otherwise...

and like i said- a month and a half ago numerous people were ripping on the Cavs chances- a hot streak and now its championship or bust?

just so i can get it straight....

and i find it odd that you would say right now if the CAvs faced a number of teams i nthe Finals they would be an underdog- but its championship or bust...i dont understand how that works...can you enlighten me?

 

[bksballer89]

It always been championship or bust.

You're beyond delusional and makes no sense for none of us on this board to even speak to you if you really don't think that anything less than a title would be consider a successful year for this team.

 

[Black Adam]

It always been championship or bust.

You're beyond delusional and makes no sense for none of us on this board to even speak to you if you really don't think that anything less than a title would be consider a successful year for this team.

helluva lotta deflections, though. TF12 was right, this is one very entertaining cat...

 

[bksballer89]

The only way this maybe wouldn't have been title or bust for Cleveland was if they kept Wiggins & Bennett. Once they traded for Love it became title or bust.

 

[GNG]

The only way this maybe wouldn't have been title or bust for Cleveland was if they kept Wiggins & Bennett. Once they traded for Love it became title or bust.

Agreed.

 

[Black Adam]

The only way this maybe wouldn't have been title or bust for Cleveland was if they kept Wiggins & Bennett. Once they traded for Love it became title or bust.

no if's, and's, or maybe's...

no way to spin this...

 

[WiggyRuss]

hey...you guys are entitled to your own opinions.

My opinion is that since the Cavs are a totally new group with a new coach- and there are a lot of very good teams that have continuity out there in the West- teams that would be FAVORED against the Cavs in a Final- that if they make the Finals they did a damn good job their first year

The great thing is- that this Cavs team is only now BEGINNING- they are not going anywhere for a while- this is probably the least likely they will be to win a championship for the next handful of years.

the window is open- and that window is ONLY GETTING WIDER next year.

so...excuse me while i watch my team that "doesnt have enough playoff experience" to get it done- but now all of a sudden is championship or bust- play the best ball in the league right now.

on to Detroit.

 

[Black Adam]

hey...you guys are entitled to your own opinions.

My opinion is that since the Cavs are a totally new group with a new coach- and there are a lot of very good teams that have continuity out there in the West- teams that would be FAVORED against the Cavs in a Final- that if they make the Finals they did a damn good job their first year

The great thing is- that this Cavs team is only now BEGINNING- they are not going anywhere for a while- this is probably the least likely they will be to win a championship for the next handful of years.

the window is open- and that window is ONLY GETTING WIDER next year.

so...excuse me while i watch my team that "doesnt have enough playoff experience" to get it done- but now all of a sudden is championship or bust- play the best ball in the league right now.

on to Detroit.

funny...

well, as long as it's only your opinion...

 

[Flauge]

Wiggy-

So you want someone to name an NBA team.. that had a rookie coach. That also was bad the year before. That also has 50% roster turnover... oh an by the way win a title....WTF type of filtering is that? Why don't you also include a Jewish coach that is also a Gemini?

Face it.. Cavs are title or bust. You didn't trade away the #1 pick for Love for a conference finals loss. Seriously, a lot of Heat fans were beyond obnoxious the last few years... but at least we didn't back away from us winning a title. Yea, it sucked hearing the Laker fans crap on us after the Dallas series. I got banned for 90 days last year because I bet CL the Heat would win. Accept it. The Cavs are a win now team. LeBron is 30, you don't exactly have 3-4 years to get this together. It's a great place to be. I wish the Heat were a title or bust team. Quit making excuses for your team. If Kyrie/Love/Lebron is better than Wade/Bosh/Lebron... you will win the East easily.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

just asking

so if the Cavs make the Finals against the:

Spurs

Grizzlies

Warriors

Thunder

who do you think the Cavs are favored against?

I think the Cavs would be favored against the Thunder...and MAYBE against Memphis- but i think Golden State would be favored and I think the Spurs would probably be favored....

When are you gonna shit or get off the pot with this years Cavs?

Are they a Championship Team or not?

You keep giving yourself an out.

I think the Bulls are the only Team capable of beating them in the East.

Sure, the Hawks are a great story and it would be great to see a bunch of " No name brand guys " defeat the over-hyped Cavs.

But, I don't believe that will happen.

I picked the Bulls to come out of the East and I think they can if Pau and Butler lead the way.

If Rose is the #1, they are doomed.

I think the Spurs or Griz will win the Chip.

But, the Cavs can beat everyone else in the West.

 

[Black Adam]

Wiggy-

So you want someone to name an NBA team.. that had a rookie coach. That also was bad the year before. That also has 50% roster turnover... of an by the way win a title....WTF type of filtering is that? Why don't you also include a Jewish coach that is also a Gemini?

Face it.. Cavs are title or bust. You didn't trade away the #1 pick for Love for a conference finals loss. Seriously, a lot of Heat fans were beyond obnoxious the last few years... but at least we didn't back away from us winning a title. Yea, it sucked hearing the Laker fans crap on us after the Dallas series. I got banned for 90 days last year because I bet CL the Heat would win. Accept it. The Cavs are a win now team. LeBron is 30, you don't exactly have 3-4 years to get this together. It's a great place to be. I wish the Heat were a title or bust team. Quit making excuses for your team. If Kyrie/Love/Lebron is better than Wade/Bosh/Lebron... you will win the East easily.

this cats' posts are a complete spin cycle. maybe he simply doesn't wanna get shamed/clowned if the Cavs don't win the title...

btw agree with the "win now" thing. if not now, when? it ain't like LeBron's gonna get any younger...or appreciably better...

 

[WiggyRuss]

When are you gonna shit or get off the pot with this years Cavs?

Are they a Championship Team or not?

You keep giving yourself an out.

I think the Bulls are the only Team capable of beating them in the East.

Sure, the Hawks are a great story and it would be great to see a bunch of " No name brand guys " defeat the over-hyped Cavs.

But, I don't believe that will happen.

I picked the Bulls to come out of the East and I think they can if Pau and Butler lead the way.

If Rose is the #1, they are doomed.

I think the Spurs or Griz will win the Chip.

But, the Cavs can beat everyone else in the West.

out of the 4 teamsi think have a legit shot to win itin the West- who do you think the Cavs would be favored against?

Memphis, San Antonio, Golden State, OKC........


If push came to shove- my prediction is the Cavs make the Finals and lose. I think continuity is too important in basketball- and that Kyrie, Love and LeBron need a year of playing together- its obvious Love is not totally comfortable yet-

having said that, CAN they beat anyone? Sure- the team is very talented. In addition to their big 3- they have 4 very solid role players in Mozgov, Shumpert, Thompson and Smith......Kyrie and LeBron have actually gelled very nicely with Kyrie. If it was just continuity maybe I could look past it-but with a coach that has never coached in the NBA before, and has never gone through a playoff, that is a lot.

Is it insurmountable? definitely not....is it likely? ehhh... i dunno....

sometimes its your year- and sometimes its not....to me it kind of FEELS like its Golden States year...they do have a new coach- but hes been in the NBA before (and hes been a GM even- which is a nice advantage) and their whole team is pretty much back from last year- Thompson, Curry, Bogut, Iggy, Barnes, Green etc........

Memphis is really good too....Conley has really raised his game- and their core- Randolph, Gasol, Conley, Allen- have played together for a longtime now....

we shall see....