No criminal charges for Deshaun Watson

[wilwhite]

OK, how much cap space did the Rams have for year 1 of that contract, and didvthey protect Stafford from losing money due to suspension?

Hard to find another team with cap space that signed an established QB lately.

Derek Carr? No small base salaries in his new contract, so you have a point. And it’s only this year that Watson has the $45M signing bonus.

 

[wilwhite]

Carrs 3 year extension, check that.

Ha - you posted while I was looking.

Yes, it looks like Watson got the Browns to pay him his money this year no matter what. I wonder if that’s how they got back in the conversation.

Could be a debilitating decision.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Hard to find another team with cap space that signed an established QB lately.

Derek Carr? No small base salaries in his new contract, so you have a point. And it’s only this year that Watson has the $45M signing bonus.

Also Watson situation is a different one as he's the only one facing what could be a major suspension while working out a contract, a contract that has a clause protecting his bonuses and guarantees in event of a suspension.

 

[wilwhite]

Also Watson situation is a different one as he's the only one facing what could be a major suspension while working out a contract, a contract that has a clause protecting his bonuses and guarantees in event of a suspension.

I hope he was polite about it and didn’t just whip the contract and rub it on them.

 

[Schmoopy1000]

Ha - you posted while I was looking.

Yes, it looks like Watson got the Browns to pay him his money this year no matter what. I wonder if that’s how they got back in the conversation.

Could be a debilitating decision.

yes. The browns sold their souls.

 

[PDay8810]

yes. The browns sold their souls.

Yes they did and just crazy anyone spinning like Clutch Cargo has about other teams with zero understanding of the contract structure is pure attention seeking approaching RTK level

 

[Manster7588]

Hard to find another team with cap space that signed an established QB lately.

Derek Carr? No small base salaries in his new contract, so you have a point. And it’s only this year that Watson has the $45M signing bonus

The bonus is spread evenly over 5 years, $8,993,000 per.

He can't loose out on the signing unless he breaks the contract, so even if he's suspended for his massages, and the team tried to take some of the bonus back, I think Watson would win any judgements as the team knew full well that suspension was coming.

 

[jarntt]

I don't know much about @dtgold88's history on here, but it looks like he's correct on this.

The Rams extended Stafford this year, reworking the final year of the previous contract that they picked up from Detroit.

Stafford will make only $1.5 million in base salary this year, and also only $1.5 million the first year in his new contract, as you can see on spotrac: Matthew Stafford

Brady's base salary is $1.12 million this year, Rodgers' $1.15, etc.

It's helpful to Watson, but it's typical.

No one is denying it is done on almost every big contract because it benefits the team from a cap perspective in normal cases, because not doing so puts them over the cap and/or restricts their ability to sign other players. The key point being made is this is not a normal case because he is going to be suspended And because the Browns have $40M in cap space. So Contracts are normally structured this way to help the team Not the player. But, The Browns are actually hurt by this structure in this specific case and would be better off with a higher year one base salary.

in my examples that I used assume he is suspended for half the year:
Current salary of $1M: Browns save $500K
With a base salary of $30M: Browns save $15M

 

[dtgold88]

Yup, no matter how it's explained, he just goes back to repeating his same argument over and over again and when you explain why his argument doesn't hold water he just keeps repeating his argument over and over like a broken record.

oh, the irony

 

[dtgold88]

No one is denying it is done on almost every big contract because it benefits the team from a cap perspective in normal cases, because not doing so puts them over the cap and/or restricts their ability to sign other players. The key point being made is this is not a normal case because he is going to be suspended And because the Browns have $40M in cap space. So Contracts are normally structured this way to help the team Not the player. But, The Browns are actually hurt by this structure in this specific case and would be better off with a higher year one base salary.

in my examples that I used assume he is suspended for half the year:
Current salary of $1M: Browns save $500K
With a base salary of $30M: Browns save $15M

The problem here is a couple things...

First, they did the same this year for Garrett, ward and Njoku which takes the notion it doesn't make sense to do it because we have so much cap room (if not for helping Watson)

second, when asked if the browns would do this if watson was not facing suspension you (and the others who are not spooked by direct questions) said the deal would have the same $1.035 mil base.

Conclusion is you have nothing to base your contention this deal was done solely to help watson because of his suspension and this is based on facts of other players' deals AND your own answers.

 

[dtgold88]

Try this: "Name 2 or more players who have a 'Language exists that will not void future guarantees upon suspension' or similar note on their Spotrac contract page?"

why would you ask this as no one has ever disputed this language might be in Watson's contract (not sure it isn't typical but willing to assume it's not)?

 

[dtgold88]

Did those teams do that because they needed cap space? Browns had plenty of cap space already. It's been acknowledged that teams do this because they need current cap space.

Yet you ignore the Browns - with all their cap space - will pay the same to Ward, Njoku and Garrett in the 1st years of their new/restructured deals in 2022.

Are those 3 being aided because they may face a suspension in 2022?
a) yes
b) no

 

[dtgold88]

OK, how much cap space did the Rams have for year 1 of that contract, and didvthey protect Stafford from losing money due to suspension?

Does that matter since in the Browns' case you know that even with all that cap space they are still paying those incredibly low base salaries to Myles. Njoku and Ward in 2022?

 

[dtgold88]

I dunno. Name a QB in that circumstance and I can check.

No need to check as they are ignoring a simple factoid. They claim this is different as the Browns have a ton of cap space so why give him such a low base? It must be to help him if he is suspended they say. Problem is despite all this cap room the Browns are paying Garrett, Njoku and ward the same minimum level base in 2022.

 

[dtgold88]

No one is denying it is done on almost every big contract because it benefits the team from a cap perspective in normal cases, because not doing so puts them over the cap and/or restricts their ability to sign other players. The key point being made is this is not a normal case because he is going to be suspended And because the Browns have $40M in cap space. So Contracts are normally structured this way to help the team Not the player. But, The Browns are actually hurt by this structure in this specific case and would be better off with a higher year one base salary.

in my examples that I used assume he is suspended for half the year:
Current salary of $1M: Browns save $500K
With a base salary of $30M: Browns save $15M

Yet the Browns - with all that cap space - are also paying Ward, Njoku and Garrett minimum level base salaries in 2022. This is the one FACT (not opinion) you and the others cannot get around...yet choose to ignore.

 

[dtgold88]

Ha - you posted while I was looking.

Yes, it looks like Watson got the Browns to pay him his money this year no matter what. I wonder if that’s how they got back in the conversation.

Could be a debilitating decision.

I would have agreed with this and wondered myself....then I learned the Browns paid Garrett the exact same base for the 2022 season and did the same in year 1 for the players in other big deals - Hooper, Teller, for instance....then after did the same for Ward and Njoku.

 

[dtgold88]

Also Watson situation is a different one as he's the only one facing what could be a major suspension while working out a contract, a contract that has a clause protecting his bonuses and guarantees in event of a suspension.

yet those willing to answer said he'd have received the same deal year 1 with suspension looming or not. almost like it didn't matter the suspension was coming, eh?

 

[dtgold88]

yes. The browns sold their souls.

No disagreement a case can be made for that. Gave up a lot in assets and sure paid him a ton.

 

[dtgold88]

The bonus is spread evenly over 5 years, $8,993,000 per.

He can't loose out on the signing unless he breaks the contract, so even if he's suspended for his massages, and the team tried to take some of the bonus back, I think Watson would win any judgements as the team knew full well that suspension was coming.

No disagreement there, either....but has nothing to do with the notion low base in year one is solely to help him if suspended.

 

[wilwhite]

No need to check as they are ignoring a simple factoid. They claim this is different as the Browns have a ton of cap space so why give him such a low base? It must be to help him if he is suspended they say. Problem is despite all this cap room the Browns are paying Garrett, Njoku and ward the same minimum level base in 2022.

It doesn't look good when compared to Carr. However, it looks okay when compared to other Browns players.

As you mentioned, Garrett's salary is the same as Watson's this year - next year it's $17 million.

Looks like this may be how the Browns are willing to do things for their star players. (Even Brissett is $1.5 million salary and $3 million signing bonus, and it's a one-year contract.)