MLB trade deadline 2012

[SFGRTB]

That is possible, but then we have to deal w/ Whitey through the stretch...


I think I would rather see if Jackson is anything more than a AAA success story.

Whiteside's fault

 

[gp956]

That is possible, but then we have to deal w/ Whitey through the stretch...

Maybe not. Posey can still catch when Chez3 needs a day.

 

[MarcoPolo]

That would be my hope. Maybe not until the stadium is paid off though. Still a ways away.

Who knows how long or when the stadium debt will be paid off (if it's not already) ...

I have the recollection that at the time, the Giants were talking about a 20-year debt. And (depending on when they got the debt) they probably had a rate between 6.5 and 8 %. Back in the first bubble-pop (2000), rates fell for a while (mid-2002) down into the mid-to-high 5% range. Current home mortgages are around (some even below) 3.5%. Rates have been below 4.5% for quite a while. They would be insane to have NOT refinanced the stadium debt (at least once) before today.

So, they could have refinanced, but kept the payments the same and be pretty close to done by now (it's been 12 years since the stadium opened). Or, they could have recently refinanced with a NEW 15 or 20 year note, at 3.5% and drastically lowered their debt payment.

My guess (pulled out of my ass) is that the stadium debt isn't the big issue/concern that it was in 2002.

 

[msgkings322]

I assumed Posey would move to 1B full time, with Chez3 behind the plate.

This could be your preference, and maybe even in some ways the right call...but do you honestly think there's a chance in hell that happens? That Posey doesn't catch more than once a week this year?

He said over and over during his rehab, he's a catcher. He's a/the team leader, he will catch if he wants to.

That said, because he does still need to play 1B some, we don't have a true 'hole' there.

 

[gp956]

Who knows how long or when the stadium debt will be paid off (if it's not already) ...

I have the recollection that at the time, the Giants were talking about a 20-year debt. And (depending on when they got the debt) they probably had a rate between 6.5 and 8 %. Back in the first bubble-pop (2000), rates fell for a while (mid-2002) down into the mid-to-high 5% range. Current home mortgages are around (some even below) 3.5%. Rates have been below 4.5% for quite a while. They would be insane to have NOT refinanced the stadium debt (at least once) before today.

So, they could have refinanced, but kept the payments the same and be pretty close to done by now (it's been 12 years since the stadium opened). Or, they could have recently refinanced with a NEW 15 or 20 year note, at 3.5% and drastically lowered their debt payment.

My guess (pulled out of my ass) is that the stadium debt isn't the big issue/concern that it was in 2002.

It never was an issue. At the time, taking on debt reduced the amount of money the Giants sent to the league in revenue sharing. It's been a while since I looked into it, but I believe the amount of the debt was based on an estimate of the likely amount the Giants would lose to revenue sharing, i.e trying to reduce that to zero.

When you are as wealthy as the Giants, debt is not a necessity, it''s a tool.

 

[gp956]

This could be your preference, and maybe even in some ways the right call...but do you honestly think there's a chance in hell that happens? That Posey doesn't catch more than once a week this year?

He said over and over during his rehab, he's a catcher. He's a/the team leader, he will catch if he wants to.

That said, because he does still need to play 1B some, we don't have a true 'hole' there.

Well, since we're way out on the hypothetical limb with these deals, what's wrong with going out a little farther?

 

[msgkings322]

Well, since we're way out on the hypothetical limb with these deals, what's wrong with going out a little farther?

Point taken. Keep it going: could we somehow get Pence and Choo and Perez and Dempster and...

 

[gp956]

Point taken. Keep it going: could we somehow get Pence and Choo and Perez and Dempster and...

Now...let's not get crazy......

 

[calsnowskier]

To be fair, there have not been any "Nate for Trout, one-up" proposals in this thread. Let's not lump this convo in those troll offers...

 

[calsnowskier]

WHAT????


Kevin Kelly on KNBR just stated the the rumor is League for Belt.

That would be INSANE!!!! I would be SUPER pissed if there is any truth to that rumor...

 

[msgkings322]

WHAT????


Kevin Kelly on KNBR just stated the the rumor is League for Belt.

That would be INSANE!!!! I would be SUPER pissed if there is any truth to that rumor...

That would be a hard to figure move, but maybe ameliorated if they get another bat (Choo, Pence) in another deal

 

[gp956]

WHAT????


Kevin Kelly on KNBR just stated the the rumor is League for Belt.

That would be INSANE!!!! I would be SUPER pissed if there is any truth to that rumor...

I had heard last night that Seattle had pushed for League and Smoak for Belt, and they were rejected.

 

[calsnowskier]

That would be a hard to figure move, but maybe ameliorated if they get another bat (Choo, Pence) in another deal

I can not imagine this being a good deal in ANY case. I am just not excited about League, regardless. A 3.5+ ERA pitcher who completely bombed out as a closer for a struggling YOUNG, high-upside 1B?

Now that is a deal I would expect to see on a Mariners message board.

 

[msgkings322]

I can not imagine this being a good deal in ANY case. I am just not excited about League, regardless. A 3.5+ ERA pitcher who completely bombed out as a closer for a struggling YOUNG, high-upside 1B?

Now that is a deal I would expect to see on a Mariners message board.

Yeah, while a BP arm would be nice I don't see that as our major issue to worry about. Offense, offense, offense. And also offense.

 

[SFGRTB]

WHAT????


Kevin Kelly on KNBR just stated the the rumor is League for Belt.

That would be INSANE!!!! I would be SUPER pissed if there is any truth to that rumor...

Mariners are looking for controllable hitters and Belt's name came up, so thats probably where the rumor came up. But there can be no way Sabean would do that.

 

[calsnowskier]

WHAT????


Kevin Kelly on KNBR just stated the the rumor is League for Belt.

That would be INSANE!!!! I would be SUPER pissed if there is any truth to that rumor...

It looks like the M's are really after Belt.

Would an Ackley/Belt deal make sense? Would they be willing? Ackley has struggled, so maybe the change of scenery helps him out as well.

Worst case scenario, we can put him at 1B since he was drafted as a 1B...

 

[TheSaboteur]

What kind of return would you like to see for Belt?

 

[mistgl]

It looks like the M's are really after Belt.

Would an Ackley/Belt deal make sense? Would they be willing? Ackley has struggled, so maybe the change of scenery helps him out as well.

Worst case scenario, we can put him at 1B since he was drafted as a 1B...

I swap Ackley for Belt in a heart beat, and I don't think twice about it. Ackley plays a 2B, a far more valuable position, and one we happen to have no one close at. With our staff, you have to value plus defense and above average offense up the middle.

When you can get guy like Carlos Pena, Berkman, and LaRoach on 1 to 2 year deals, that trade is a no brainier.

 

[calsnowskier]

I swap Ackley for Belt in a heart beat, and I don't think twice about it. Ackley plays a 2B, a far more valuable position, and one we happen to have no one close at. With our staff, you have to value plus defense and above average offense up the middle.

When you can get guy like Carlos Pena, Berkman, and LaRoach on 1 to 2 year deals, that trade is a no brainier.

I figured the Gs would do it, but I have a couple ??s...

1) You mention he has +D. I have never heard anything about his D. He was drafted as a 1B, so I just assumed his D would be passable at best.

2) What is his image in Seattle? With Smoak smouldering at 1B and Ackley hacking at 2B, do they still covet both/either of them (I have seen multiple reports that Smoak is basically done), or are they suicidal at this point?

3) What else, if anything, would the Gs need to include to make this happen?

 

[mistgl]

I figured the Gs would do it, but I have a couple ??s...

1) You mention he has +D. I have never heard anything about his D. He was drafted as a 1B, so I just assumed his D would be passable at best.

2) What is his image in Seattle? With Smoak smouldering at 1B and Ackley hacking at 2B, do they still covet both/either of them (I have seen multiple reports that Smoak is basically done), or are they suicidal at this point?

3) What else, if anything, would the Gs need to include to make this happen?

1.) He was actually recruited as a short stop, moved to outfield, somehow messed up his arm, and then settled at 1B to 'limit' the wear and tear on his bum arm during his Freshmen season. Then had the injury fixed in the college OS. I think they kept him at first because if it wasn't broken why fix it? Once he got into the Mariners system their infield instructors said EFFF that, this kid's D will be wasted there and switched him to 2B. He's already posted 1.2 dWAR this year.

2. I'm not going not pretend to know much about Seattle, but I do know they don't crucify their struggling rookies like SF tends to. That team sucks, and the media and fans cling to the hope that they will all click together eventually. Tearing them down serves no purpose, cause whether or not they do struggle, the team is so bad that they will still lose.

3. Dunno. Maybe Hector, possibly Hembree. But that's for League and Ackley.