Michael Jordan is a hypocrite

[shopson67]

LeBron is more efficient because he doesn't force. He is able to create easier shots for himself because he is bigger and stronger. He is the better teammate again, because he doesn't force shots. He makes the correct basketball play every time.

...and the flip-side of that is that James will defer the pressure of the game-deciding shot to someone else, whereas the Lakers are relying on Kobe to take/make that shot, especially in the post-Shaq era. Passing out from the paint (where Lebron is a very high-percentage scorer) to one of his perimeter shooters behind the arc when trying to survive in last year's finals is a solid example.

Kobe did suffer from poor shot selection, but a good portion of that was forced on him by his teammates with late-in-the-clock bailout passes in the post-Shaq era.

 

[tlance]

The fact we're discussing this for the 6000th time means this race is a lot closer than you think.

Who else is arguing your side? @DorianRo?

Good luck to any who agree with that guy.

 

[tlance]

...and the flip-side of that is that James will defer the pressure of the game-deciding shot to someone else, whereas the Lakers are relying on Kobe to take/make that shot, especially in the post-Shaq era. Passing out from the paint (where Lebron is a very high-percentage scorer) to one of his perimeter shooters behind the arc when trying to survive in last year's finals is a solid example.

Kobe did suffer from poor shot selection, but a good portion of that was forced on him by his teammates with late-in-the-clock bailout passes in the post-Shaq era.

This may be semantics, but saying LeBron defers those shots is unfair. He doesn't.

He will take the shot if it is the right play. He has taken those shots many times. If a teammate has a better look though, he passes every time. That isn't deferring. It isn't being an unselfish player.

I got news for you, it is much harder to defend a willing passer like LeBron in that situation than it is to defend somebody you know is shooting 98% of the time.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

People are using Kobe's last few injury ridden years against him. In his last 3 to 4 seasons he was getting older and more injury prone. Due to that his stats dropped tremendously, and with that, team wins. You guys are pretty much comparing 2015 Kobe against 2015 Lebron. Of course lebron stands out by a country mile.

When father time eventually catches up with lebron, his numbers plummet, his mistakes become more frequent, and his team doesn't even sniff the playoffs, do you want to have this discussion again?

 

[tlance]

This may be semantics, but saying LeBron defers those shots is unfair. He doesn't.

He will take the shot if it is the right play. He has taken those shots many times. If a teammate has a better look though, he passes every time. That isn't deferring. It isn't being an unselfish player.

I got news for you, it is much harder to defend a willing passer like LeBron in that situation than it is to defend somebody you know is shooting 98% of the time.

Damn auto correct.

That IS being an unselfish player.

Why would autocorrect change IS to ISN'T. Dumbest thing ever.

 

[Vyle203]

...and the flip-side of that is that James will defer the pressure of the game-deciding shot to someone else, whereas the Lakers are relying on Kobe to take/make that shot, especially in the post-Shaq era. Passing out from the paint (where Lebron is a very high-percentage scorer) to one of his perimeter shooters behind the arc when trying to survive in last year's finals is a solid example.

Kobe did suffer from poor shot selection, but a good portion of that was forced on him by his teammates with late-in-the-clock bailout passes in the post-Shaq era.

Kobe definitely had the killer instinct, I will always respect that about him.

When you said "drive" in your earlier post, were you talking about driving to the basket or drive to compete?

 

[tlance]

People are using Kobe's last few injury ridden years against him. In his last 3 to 4 seasons he was getting older and more injury prone. Due to that his stats dropped tremendously, and with that, team wins. You guys are pretty much comparing 2015 Kobe against 2015 Lebron. Of course lebron stands out by a country mile.

When father time eventually catches up with lebron, his numbers plummet, his mistakes become more frequent, and his team doesn't even sniff the playoffs, do you want to have this discussion again?

Who is doing that?

Kobe after the Achilles injury wasn't Kobe. I have not seen a single person even mention those years. How do you explain 2005 though? Again, prime LeBron takes that roster to the second round of the playoffs.

 

[tlance]

People are using Kobe's last few injury ridden years against him. In his last 3 to 4 seasons he was getting older and more injury prone. Due to that his stats dropped tremendously, and with that, team wins. You guys are pretty much comparing 2015 Kobe against 2015 Lebron. Of course lebron stands out by a country mile.

When father time eventually catches up with lebron, his numbers plummet, his mistakes become more frequent, and his team doesn't even sniff the playoffs, do you want to have this discussion again?

But since you brought it up, I am willing to bet that LeBron does not ever decline as much as Kobe did. You don't know LeBron very well if you think he will ever miss the playoffs.

To be fair, he won't ever sign to play on a bad team either though.

 

[shopson67]

And yes, LeBron shoots better from 3, if you can use chucking from Kobe as an excuse, then I'll use shot selection as an explanation the way @tlance did.

That advantage is miniscule (one tenth of a shot attempt per game) and includes Kobe's last few years of decline, while Lebron's does not. Kobe though 2010 (age 32, like Lebron now) was .340 (vs .329 career), extremely close to Lebron's .342. As your legs age, your jumper fails.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

How do you explain 2005 though? Again, prime LeBron takes that roster to the second round of the playoffs.

You mean the season after the greatest coach of all time left the team? The season after the most dominant center of all time left the team and was replaced by Chris Mihm? The season where they had a coaching change halfway through the year due to an illness (3rd coach in less than a year)?

Yeah... I wonder what went wrong there

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

But since you brought it up, I am willing to bet that LeBron does not ever decline as much as Kobe did. You don't know LeBron very well if you think he will ever miss the playoffs.

To be fair, he won't ever sign to play on a bad team either though.

His body has more miles than anyone. He's not just going to decline - he's going to crash and burn.

But feel free to convince yourself otherwise.

 

[tlance]

His body has more miles than anyone. He's not just going to decline - he's going to crash and burn.

But feel free to convince yourself otherwise.

He is also arguably the best pure athlete to ever appear on a basketball court. You can't apply normal logic to guys like him. He has the size and strength to be effective long after the other physical attributes start to fade.

But go ahead and continue rooting against him. It will be really funny when he dons a laker uniform in 2 years.

 

[tlance]

You mean the season after the greatest coach of all time left the team? The season after the most dominant center of all time left the team and was replaced by Chris Mihm? The season where they had a coaching change halfway through the year due to an illness (3rd coach in less than a year)?

Yeah... I wonder what went wrong there

LeBron made it to the Finals with a weaker roster before he was even in his prime. No chance he not wins 34 games there.

 

[trojanfan12]

Threat definitely needs to be used loosely here. There is always going to be a second best in any scenario, right now the Spurs are it, but nothing about that roster screams threat to me.

For the Spurs, it's always about "the whole being better than the sum of it's parts." I can't think of any Spurs roster that screamed threat. Yet they are always in the mix for the title.

What makes the Warriors so tough and why I agree that the Spurs (or anyone else) beating them is highly unlikely is because they are also a "whole being better than the sum of it's parts" type of team and they have better parts than anyone else.

Basically, the Warriors are showing what can happen when you have a team with a bunch of stars and no agendas.

 

[Vyle203]

That advantage is miniscule (one tenth of a shot attempt per game) and includes Kobe's last few years of decline, while Lebron's does not. Kobe though 2010 (age 32, like Lebron now) was .340 (vs .329 career), extremely close to Lebron's .342. As your legs age, your jumper fails.

Yes, it's close.

You gave Kobe the edge as a shooter, I'm just saying the stats don't bear that out.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

LeBron made it to the Finals with a weaker roster before he was even in his prime. No chance he not wins 34 games there.

Another "what if" scenario.

 

[knowyourenemy]

Yes, it's close.

You gave Kobe the edge as a shooter, I'm just saying the stats don't bear that out.

He also gave Kobe the edge as a defender which goes to show that he's clearly biased.

 

[DorianRo]

LBJ's ability to get to the hoop is a skill, using one's body is a skill. LeBron was better at it. Doesn't matter if you use strength or quickness, so don't use the word bully like he's cheating or something.

And yes, LeBron shoots better from 3, if you can use chucking from Kobe as an excuse, then I'll use shot selection as an explanation the way @tlance did.

BullRushing/Committing offensive fouls and using off arms while being 50/60 pounds heavier than other players to get to the hoop is a "skill"? .... If you say so


Kobe has true offensive skill. Lebron just bullrushes and commits offensive fouls with shoulder lowering and using the off arm. There are libraries filled with LeOffensiveFouls.

 

[knowyourenemy]

BullRushing/Committing offensive fouls and using off arms while being 50/60 pounds heavier than other players to get to the hoop is a "skill"? .... If you say so

That's the route you're going to go? Weak argument.

 

[DorianRo]

That's the route you're going to go? Weak argument.

Its the truth. Can the argument be refuted?