Looks like Cutler will be staying..

[blh7068]

Different coaches, same problem
Different system, same problem
Different linemen, same problem
Different receivers, same problem

Here we go blaming everybody else for the problems again.

Hard to argue that the bears had the best one of the best receiver combinations in the NFL last year, he lived by dumping the ball to the running back.

Most completions, most pass attempts, most yards as a bear, 5-10 record. only constant is you will guarantee one interception per game.

Here we go again with you wanting to blame one person for just 5 wins when you know darn well there are other areas of the team that are severely deficient, like the defense. Allowed an average just shy of 4 TD's a game last year, and was at or near the bottom of just about every normalized stat. Thats not a huge problem?

How about the running game that had Forte 5th in the league in carries at a 3.9 ypc with just one run of 20+ yards? Team carries the Bears were ranked 30th. Thats one player doing the same thing over and over. Is the predictability that falls out of that run game mismanagement really a Cutler issue, too?

It doesnt matter who plays QB. The bottom line is they arent going to contend for anything until the defense stops allowing 4 td's per game to be scored. At that PA rate, The O would have to average ~34 ppg to produce the plus scoring differential commonly seen among winning teams. Thats hardly reasonable because year in and year out the best offensive clubs typically dont score that much. "More" offense isnt the answer.

 

[nebearsfan70]

 

[anotheridiot]

Here we go again with you wanting to blame one person for just 5 wins when you know darn well there are other areas of the team that are severely deficient, like the defense. Allowed an average just shy of 4 TD's a game last year, and was at or near the bottom of just about every normalized stat. Thats not a huge problem?

How about the running game that had Forte 5th in the league in carries at a 3.9 ypc with just one run of 20+ yards? Team carries the Bears were ranked 30th. Thats one player doing the same thing over and over. Is the predictability that falls out of that run game mismanagement really a Cutler issue, too?

It doesnt matter who plays QB. The bottom line is they arent going to contend for anything until the defense stops allowing 4 td's per game to be scored. At that PA rate, The O would have to average ~34 ppg to produce the plus scoring differential commonly seen among winning teams. Thats hardly reasonable because year in and year out the best offensive clubs typically dont score that much. "More" offense isnt the answer.

I am not wanting to blame one person, but if you are going to pass the blame around, all you have to do when you post is add Cutler to your list. It is really that simple.

Nobody knows if the lack of running the ball was because Tresty did not call runs or Jay audibled out of them. The only thing we know without a doubt is that it appeared Jay audibled alot and the bears did not run the football. Nobody else stood behind center to ask for the football. Run for forte since he was in the backfield 95% of the time was a dump to Forte. Again, I dont mind that call if it got Forte past the line, but if the 50-60 dumpoffs of his 102 receptions were runs, where would the rush ranking be with 50 more carries, about 20th? If they ran 10 more times a game you are looking at third in the league. Look in your crystal ball and tell me how many of those 50-60 might have broken for over 20 yards? Would the safeties have been kept honest just because the Bears were running 3 more times a game? Defensive ends knowing they dont have to respect their edge, just pin your ears back and rush means linemen are at a disadvantage.

Three and outs destroy a defense, turnovers destroy a defense. Having a revolving door at safety destroys a team. We all know the rest of the problems, just add the history of the quarterback to your equation.

 

[wood20ks]

Are you kidding me?

Him saying that was met with nothing but praise from most people. Martz LITERALLY, almost got Cutler murdered in the first half of that 2011 season before finally being told by Lovie to make an adjustment with Cutler in his drops.


Ring any bells? Jay was lucky not to lose a limb in this game

So for Jay to go tell someone to fuck theirselves for their inadequacy......Kinda like rest of the team(Brandon Marshall here with the locker room call out of Cutler) telling cutler to go fuck his self for his inadequacy....

But Marshall is labeled a locker room cancer for doing it.

Jay Cutler is a nobody...........He should not be talking to anybody the way he did/does.



So when someone wants to call out someone for their inadequate play calling,Jay had better be ready himself for his insufficient plays..........just saying.

in other words "calling the kettle black".

 

[blh7068]

I am not wanting to blame one person, but if you are going to pass the blame around, all you have to do when you post is add Cutler to your list. It is really that simple.

Nobody knows if the lack of running the ball was because Tresty did not call runs or Jay audibled out of them. The only thing we know without a doubt is that it appeared Jay audibled alot and the bears did not run the football. Nobody else stood behind center to ask for the football. Run for forte since he was in the backfield 95% of the time was a dump to Forte. Again, I dont mind that call if it got Forte past the line, but if the 50-60 dumpoffs of his 102 receptions were runs, where would the rush ranking be with 50 more carries, about 20th? If they ran 10 more times a game you are looking at third in the league. Look in your crystal ball and tell me how many of those 50-60 might have broken for over 20 yards? Would the safeties have been kept honest just because the Bears were running 3 more times a game? Defensive ends knowing they dont have to respect their edge, just pin your ears back and rush means linemen are at a disadvantage.

Three and outs destroy a defense, turnovers destroy a defense. Having a revolving door at safety destroys a team. We all know the rest of the problems, just add the history of the quarterback to your equation.

Who says I dont assess Cutler blame? I certainly do. He makes his fair share of mistakes. However, I cant make him a focal point for blame when the other side of the ball has been atypically bad the last two seasons.

You need to reread what I said about the running game. Your reply has very little to do with what I said about it. Forte was 5th in the league in carries with ~266. Nothing unusual about that from the featured back. The problem is they didnt really employ other personnel to run the football. It was Forte...and Forte...and Forte. Kadeem touched the ball just 36 times. Not carrying a FB also limited their options, IMO. Thats strictly personnel related, and the mismanagement of that is 100% on the coaching staff.



Doing the same thing with the same player over and over lends to predictability. That hurt Fortes rush production with a YPC that was under career averages, along with the rest of the offense. I dont believe for a second that the bulk of audibles jay 'may' have called were dump offs by design for Forte. IMO, he was the safety valve as the WRs struggled pretty much all season to stretch the field/get over the top of the defense. A lot of that resulted from the inefficient, predictable run game. If the defense knows whats coming, that does little to pull the safety out of position for support. Staying in place, or even playing deeper makes it harder for a WR to get over the top. Especially with the Bears receiving targets- they collectively lack speed and use their bodies to create separation. That element isnt as much of a factor when the secondary can keep a slow developing play in front of them.

IOW- Its not doing more with Forte- Its Forte plus doing more with the other backs on the roster. Accomplishing that will make for a more productive run game that will require a little more
guesswork on behalf of the defense. Everyone on offense will benefit from that.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

I don't think it helped that Forte ran so often and it got more predictable than would be desirable, but, no, I don't think this was the fundamental issue either. I say Cutler's numerous errors about where to throw the ball were a far bigger problem. Particularly on checkdown completions to Forte, in virtually every game Cutler missed his open receivers downfield in those situations. Yes, squeaking out another half yard average out of rush plays would have helped, a few less false starts would have helped, the tight end not quitting after week 13 would have helped, but Cutler's decision making was the biggest problem. Not just the interceptions. Sometimes on the completions. This is why we averaged near the league bottom in yards per completion.

 

[beardown07]

I don't think it helped that Forte ran so often and it got more predictable than would be desirable, but, no, I don't think this was the fundamental issue either. I say Cutler's numerous errors about where to throw the ball were a far bigger problem. Particularly on checkdown completions to Forte, in virtually every game Cutler missed his open receivers downfield in those situations. Yes, squeaking out another half yard average out of rush plays would have helped, a few less false starts would have helped, the tight end not quitting after week 13 would have helped, but Cutler's decision making was the biggest problem. Not just the interceptions. Sometimes on the completions. This is why we averaged near the league bottom in yards per completion.

This kind of shit was a massive problem this last year. Between that and the shitty return game, we started waay too many drives inside our own 20 or with a penalty putting us behind in down and distance.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

To underscore this point....the league average yards per completion was 11.5 yards, the Bears (31st in league) were 10.2 yards. For rushing offense, the league average was 4.2 yards, the Bears were 19th with 4.1 yards per carry.

I think that more yardage not realized clearly was primarily in the passing game.

Furthermore, on turnovers...Forte fumbled once, and Jeffery fumbled once. That's it. On passing plays, Cutler fumbled 3 times, the receivers fumbled 3 times after receptions, and of course there were 19 interceptions.

Not sure I can point my first fingers at the Bears rushing attack.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

This kind of shit was a massive problem this last year. Between that and the shitty return game, we started waay too many drives inside our own 20 or with a penalty putting us behind in down and distance.

This is a myth. Yes the Bears had penalties, but they were around the league average. The league average was 6.6 penalties per game, the Bears were 13th with 7.06, behind league leader Seattle (7.95) and Super Bowl winning New England (7.26) among others.

We were dead smack in the middle of the league in net of being penalized yards versus penalty benefitted yards at -.43 yards per game. That's it.

Penalties are NOT why this team struggled last year. That's simply not an acceptable excuse. Every team's fans focus on their own mistakes by nature, but the numbers don't support the perception for us.

 

[beardown07]

This is a myth. Yes the Bears had penalties, but they were around the league average. The league average was 6.6 penalties per game, the Bears were 13th with 7.06, behind league leader Seattle (7.95) and Super Bowl winning New England (7.26) among others.

We were dead smack in the middle of the league in net of being penalized yards versus penalty benefitted yards at -.43 yards per game. That's it.

Penalties are NOT why this team struggled last year. That's simply not an acceptable excuse. Every team's fans focus on their own mistakes by nature, but the numbers don't support the perception for us.

Looking at penalties through statistical analysis is skewed. It doesn't account for the penalties affect on the game...where and when en sech.



but whatever, yer the expert

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

You have it backwards. Looking at penalties through statistics is the only unskewed way of doing it. Doing it through the prism of being an emotional fan seeing things selectively is what is skewed.

Obviously penalties affect the game, and that goes both ways, for both sides. Sure, in a perfect world, our team would commit no penalties. When we do, it hurts us, no shit. But the 2014 Bears were not any kind of wild aberration in penalization. We had a pretty normal penalty situation by league standards.

You have to expect - and overcome - penalties if you are going to be a good NFL team. Just like injuries. Expect them, don't just crumble when they happen, because they will.

 

[blh7068]

To underscore this point....the league average yards per completion was 11.5 yards, the Bears (31st in league) were 10.2 yards. For rushing offense, the league average was 4.2 yards, the Bears were 19th with 4.1 yards per carry.

I think that more yardage not realized clearly was primarily in the passing game.

Furthermore, on turnovers...Forte fumbled once, and Jeffery fumbled once. That's it. On passing plays, Cutler fumbled 3 times, the receivers fumbled 3 times after receptions, and of course there were 19 interceptions.

Not sure I can point my first fingers at the Bears rushing attack.

I can. A 3.9 ypc from the featured back that accounted for 88% of the carries by the RBs on the roster isnt good. Cutler had more rushes and yards than Carey. Consider this- Forte has never been a home run hitter running the football. Hes good in space. Between the tackles, not so much. Lacks breakaway speed, but hes quick and shifty. He makes defenders miss, and thats how he gets his yards. Too often goes down on initial contact. Defenses will get to know Fortes particular RB "blueprint" inside and out since his skill set, strengths and weaknesses accounted for 88% of the RB carries.

Forte plus additional production from other backs- ones with different skill sets will make the run game more difficult for defenses to account for. The more uncertainty the running game offers a defense will increase the likelihood a defender(s) will be out of position. Everyone on offense will benefit from that. IMO-that will go a long way towards creating mismatches in the passing game. Also, the WRs wont have the frequent struggle of beating coverage/getting over the top of the defense.


Hes averaged 259 carries per season over his career, so the 266 of last year wasnt excessive wrt career averages. However, entering his 8th season as a starter since day one, he certainly doesnt need increased workload. Whats needed is meaningful production from other backs in addition to what Forte offers.

 

[beardown07]

You have it backwards. Looking at penalties through statistics is the only unskewed way of doing it. Doing it through the prism of being an emotional fan seeing things selectively is what is skewed.

Obviously penalties affect the game, and that goes both ways, for both sides. Sure, in a perfect world, our team would commit no penalties. When we do, it hurts us, no shit. But the 2014 Bears were not any kind of wild aberration in penalization. We had a pretty normal penalty situation by league standards.

You have to expect - and overcome - penalties if you are going to be a good NFL team. Just like injuries. Expect them, don't just crumble when they happen, because they will.

Dude, nobody said its the primary reason they sucked.


No disrespect intended, but I think I'd rather converse with a rattlesnake than I would you.

I know yer a football nerd en sech, but do you associate or talk to people in real life like you do on here? I hope yer a big bastard, if ya do.

 

[beardown07]

You are who you are.....I don't really give a shit en sech, I just wondered.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

Dude, nobody said its the primary reason they sucked.


No disrespect intended, but I think I'd rather converse with a rattlesnake than I would you.

I know yer a football nerd en sech, but do you associate or talk to people in real life like you do on here? I hope yer a big bastard, if ya do.

I'm actually only 5' 9". Worse in person, I promise.

 

[richig07]

So for Jay to go tell someone to fuck theirselves for their inadequacy......Kinda like rest of the team(Brandon Marshall here with the locker room call out of Cutler) telling cutler to go fuck his self for his inadequacy....

But Marshall is labeled a locker room cancer for doing it.

Jay Cutler is a nobody...........He should not be talking to anybody the way he did/does.



So when someone wants to call out someone for their inadequate play calling,Jay had better be ready himself for his insufficient plays..........just saying.

in other words "calling the kettle black".

You don't even remember why Jay said that in the Minnesota game, do you? It had ZERO to do with Martz as an offensive coordinator.

The Bears were 2-3 and struggling HORRIBLY offensively going into that game. They exploded in the first half offensively, and the team was really rolling.

With 40 seconds or so left on the clock, the Bears were in Vikings territory. Martz radioed in the play call for Cutler to sit on the ball and go into half. Cutler and the team were itching to move down the field and pickup more points heading into half. Jay reportedly got the call, looked at his teammates who also wanted to get after it. Called a pass play, and said "fuck it".

He broke the huddle and yelled to the staff on the sideline. "Tell Martz I said fuck him". In other words, fuck this, let's go.

SHOULD HE have done that? I don't know. But to "hate" your veteran QB for wanting to get after it with his team, is absolutely silly. IMO. The NFL is not high school, or even college. Players don't look at coaches as these untouchable superiors, that you simply bend over for. It's a WORKING RELATIONSHIP.

A quarterback and an offensive coordinator having a disagreement on a play call is quite normal. It's usually just not picked up on a TV mic. If you never would have heard that, you wouldn't have noticed a thing.

 

[wood20ks]

You don't even remember why Jay said that in the Minnesota game, do you? It had ZERO to do with Martz as an offensive coordinator.

The Bears were 2-3 and struggling HORRIBLY offensively going into that game. They exploded in the first half offensively, and the team was really rolling.

With 40 seconds or so left on the clock, the Bears were in Vikings territory. Martz radioed in the play call for Cutler to sit on the ball and go into half. Cutler and the team were itching to move down the field and pickup more points heading into half. Jay reportedly got the call, looked at his teammates who also wanted to get after it. Called a pass play, and said "fuck it".

He broke the huddle and yelled to the staff on the sideline. "Tell Martz I said fuck him". In other words, fuck this, let's go.

SHOULD HE have done that? I don't know. But to "hate" your veteran QB for wanting to get after it with his team, is absolutely silly. IMO. The NFL is not high school, or even college. Players don't look at coaches as these untouchable superiors, that you simply bend over for. It's a WORKING RELATIONSHIP.

A quarterback and an offensive coordinator having a disagreement on a play call is quite normal. It's usually just not picked up on a TV mic. If you never would have heard that, you wouldn't have noticed a thing.

And this goes all the way to what I was actually talking about with the mike Tice incident?(Jay walking away from him whehey needed to work things out).
And the Detroit game I was talking about happened in chiago.......Jay fumbled the ball away himself taking sout of fg range after chewing J Webb a new ass for a holding call.

And I`m sure there are plenty of times when the qb and oc don`t get along......its no different than McMahon and Ditka...its part of the game.

 

[richig07]

And the Detroit game I was talking about happened in chiago.......Jay fumbled the ball away himself taking sout of fg range after chewing J Webb a new ass for a holding call.

Cutler didn't chew out Webb in Chicago. It happened in GB on a Thursday night game. I still don't see why firing up your left tackle, who had given up three sacks in that game, and was responsible for multiple false start/holding calls is somehow a horrible thing.

Classic example of Cutler being portrayed as the villain. I don't know of a great QB that never did something like that.

 

[wood20ks]

Cutler didn't chew out Webb in Chicago. It happened in GB on a Thursday night game. I still don't see why firing up your left tackle, who had given up three sacks in that game, and was responsible for multiple false start/holding calls is somehow a horrible thing.

Classic example of Cutler being portrayed as the villain. I don't know of a great QB that never did something like that.

You still have the wrong game............Let me look a little.


This is the game.....play by play.
And it was carimi,not Webb.Cutler chewed his ass for holding.Two plays later,sack by Detroit.(only cause Cutler went to throw the ball and he hit his own damn leg and fumbled the ball.he recovered it himself resulting in a sack0.

But by the law of "what comes around,goes around",Carimi should have really chewed his ass......

Jay "the interception machine"Cutler is a no one to be yelling at anyone for their mistakes.........

Chicago`ball at the 13:16 mark:

Detroit Lions vs. Chicago Bears - Play By Play - October 22, 2012 - ESPN

That's what you call "calling the kettle black"

I remember screaming at the tv over this play...........

 

[beardown07]

I don't know if he was yelling at Carimi for holding or for just sucking, in general.