Kyrie to Boston rumors heating up. Deal nearly complete

[The Q]

I guess what I'm trying to say is that IT at full health is a player worthy of MVP consideration, as we saw last year. It's not as is if he's some throw away player in the deal. Giving him big money is always a concern, but if Lebron leaves, the Cavs could potentially still retain a really great player in IT (again if healthy) and continue a rebuild at the same time. It's really the best situation for them if Lebron chooses to leave. The only other option would be a complete tear down of the team. If that's the case, the Cavs don't have any real assets to get rid of outside of Love and maybe Crowder to a slightly lesser degree. The team is still hamstrung with contracts of Tristan, JR and Korver, without any sizable cap space. The rebuild of the team would take at least 3 years to complete.

If you have IT, you could still complete a rebuild in much the same way. You could offer IT a max for 3 years, which is probably more than most other teams would offer him anyways. Could always through in a 4th year, but hold firm on it. After the 3 year period is up, most of your guys contracts could be off the books. You'll have developed your Brooklyn pick and could complete a rebuild off of him.

With the cap bumps that happened since he signed his deal, you could almost certainly find a taker for TT.

 

[WiggyRuss]

I guess what I'm trying to say is that IT at full health is a player worthy of MVP consideration, as we saw last year. It's not as is if he's some throw away player in the deal. Giving him big money is always a concern, but if Lebron leaves, the Cavs could potentially still retain a really great player in IT (again if healthy) and continue a rebuild at the same time. It's really the best situation for them if Lebron chooses to leave. The only other option would be a complete tear down of the team. If that's the case, the Cavs don't have any real assets to get rid of outside of Love and maybe Crowder to a slightly lesser degree. The team is still hamstrung with contracts of Tristan, JR and Korver, without any sizable cap space. The rebuild of the team would take at least 3 years to complete.

If you have IT, you could still complete a rebuild in much the same way. You could offer IT a max for 3 years, which is probably more than most other teams would offer him anyways. Could always through in a 4th year, but hold firm on it. After the 3 year period is up, most of your guys contracts could be off the books. You'll have developed your Brooklyn pick and could complete a rebuild off of him.

id DEF. rather do the tear down

You could easily move Crowder and Love for first rounders.

Tristan, JR, and Korver arent signed up forever--- how long after this year? 2 years a piece? the following year they would be expiring and could be used to take in other teams problem contracts in order to take the other teams draft picks.

Say- the worst happens---- LeBron leaves----- you let IT walk (or facilitate a trade sicne- if LeBron leaves his cap hold comes offf and you can prob execute a sign and trade)--- you deal Love and Crowder---- and then go into the tank.

you do have smith, korver and thompson---- but after 1 year each becomes expiring.



thats a lot better than having some mediocre team that is like a 7th seed contender that will jsut get wiped out first round of the playoffs.

id rather see them tank and add a great prospect to the great prospect they would hypoethetically get from the nets pick- and use those first rounders from Crowder and Love as well.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Lou Will went for a first last year.

IT can at least fetch that.

Lou was under contract for 7M this year and not injured

i mean- maybe you could but its not like a team is giving up anything of substance for a point guard thats 5'8" with injury issues that wants 30M dollars a year into his mid thirties.

though- i think Isiah is going to have ot accept the fact NO ONE is giving him a max deal

 

[The Q]

Lou was under contract for 7M this year and not injured

i mean- maybe you could but its not like a team is giving up anything of substance for a point guard thats 5'8" with injury issues that wants 30M dollars a year into his mid thirties.

though- i think Isiah is going to have ot accept the fact NO ONE is giving him a max deal

Wizards with Bog.

Someone is looking for guard depth and scoring, every TD it happens.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Wizards with Bog.

Someone is looking for guard depth and scoring, every TD it happens.

yah- i mean- you could prob get some late first rounder possibly if hes healthy at the time.

who plays PG for the Celts than? smart?

 

[CitySushi]

id DEF. rather do the tear down

You could easily move Crowder and Love for first rounders.

Tristan, JR, and Korver arent signed up forever--- how long after this year? 2 years a piece? the following year they would be expiring and could be used to take in other teams problem contracts in order to take the other teams draft picks.

Say- the worst happens---- LeBron leaves----- you let IT walk (or facilitate a trade sicne- if LeBron leaves his cap hold comes offf and you can prob execute a sign and trade)--- you deal Love and Crowder---- and then go into the tank.

you do have smith, korver and thompson---- but after 1 year each becomes expiring.



thats a lot better than having some mediocre team that is like a 7th seed contender that will jsut get wiped out first round of the playoffs.

id rather see them tank and add a great prospect to the great prospect they would hypoethetically get from the nets pick- and use those first rounders from Crowder and Love as well.

Fair enough. I've had enough slumming it with the Warriors for years, that full rebuilds are really hard without some luck. Hell even the Cavs lucked out in getting Kyrie because it wasn't even their pick that got the #1 pick that year, it was the Clippers. They were slotted to be in the 9th spot I think if I recall correctly.

A lot of things have to go well in order for a full rebuild. But I understand where you're coming from.

 

[CitySushi]

yah- i mean- you could prob get some late first rounder possibly if hes healthy at the time.

who plays PG for the Celts than? smart?

They still have Rozier.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Fair enough. I've had enough slumming it with the Warriors for years, that full rebuilds are really hard without some luck. Hell even the Cavs lucked out in getting Kyrie because it wasn't even their pick that got the #1 pick that year, it was the Clippers. They were slotted to be in the 9th spot I think if I recall correctly.

A lot of things have to go well in order for a full rebuild. But I understand where you're coming from.

i just have no interest in having a team thats a 6th, 7th or 8th seed that will just get slaughtered in the first round after winning 40 games max.

 

[WiggyRuss]

They still have Rozier.

would you rather just keep Thomas for the playoff run and see if you can resign him for less or get a pick in the 20's max and have rozier be your starting point guard?

ya think Stevens and Hayward would be happy to see IT traded for some mediocre pick and giving the reigns to Rozier- rather than going for it?

thyd shit a brick

 

[The Q]

would you rather just keep Thomas for the playoff run and see if you can resign him for less or get a pick in the 20's max and have rozier be your starting point guard?

I'll give Rozier and Smart a chance.

The pick gives them another asset to make a deal for another stud.

 

[CitySushi]

would you rather just keep Thomas for the playoff run and see if you can resign him for less or get a pick in the 20's max and have rozier be your starting point guard?

Wait I'm confused because I just jumped in. What was the scenario for this? The Celtics retaining IT or the Cavs?

 

[The Q]

Wait I'm confused because I just jumped in. What was the scenario for this? The Celtics retaining IT or the Cavs?

Cavs veto.

Celts trade IT at the deadline.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Wait I'm confused because I just jumped in. What was the scenario for this? The Celtics retaining IT or the Cavs?

Celts retaining IT- and then supposedly trading him at the deadline.

 

[The Q]

Celts retaining IT- and then supposedly trading him at the deadline.

almost anything is better than this trade.

 

[CitySushi]

Celts retaining IT- and then supposedly trading him at the deadline.

As constructed, probably trade IT. The only reason I do it is because there's almost no way of retaining IT after this trade situation. So, if IT has a great year and say the Cavs have a deep playoff run again, and somehow knock off the Cavs, what do you do with IT then? Do you max him? Do you let him walk for nothing?

It's kind of unfortunate for the Jazz because IT would be their ideal fit over there. He's a guy who could light it up and with the team defensive ability, be hidden a bit with an elite rim protector behind him. But they traded for Rubio so they have to ride that out.

 

[DJ Fieri]

If the Cavs request anything more than a 2nd round pick....Ainge should say no thanks.

 

[WiggyRuss]

i think it will either a. get voided or b. the clippers pick will be added

seems like a reasonable compromise to me.


the problem with IT is that- a guy with a serious injury on a 1 year deal who is demanding a "Brinks" truck deal- has basically no value.

 

[gordontrue]

A doctor on another forum thinks he knows what is at the center of this issue. Obviously, take this with a grain of salt, but it makes a lot of sense and I think he nailed it.

Back in May, after Isaiah visited independent doctors, he said this to the media: "Like I have an extra bone or something, like doctor talk," Thomas said. "I don't understand what they're saying."

Normally, a torn labrum just needs a steroid injection and rest and it will heal in a matter of months.

BUT... if the person with the torn labrum has a femoral-acetabular impingement... the injury is more complicated. Basically, that condition involves having an irregular bone structure. People with that irregluar bone on their hip are more prone to labrum tears and very prone to re-injury once they've had a labrum tear. These people are often reccommend to have surgery to shave down the bown to prevent re-injury. This surgery has a recovery time of 6-9 months.

IT did not have surgery.

So... likely...

IT's torn labrum is more or less healed and he is able to play. BUT... the chance of injury is very high and he really should have that surgery for the sake of his career. This would explain why the Celtics doctors would claim he's ready to go and why the Cavs doctors would be saying he could miss most or all of this season.

Edit: Also, to be fair to the Celtics doctors... IT might be against the surgery since he has his big payday around the corner and doesn't want to put that at risk (Even though you could argue both options put it at risk). With him being just 1 year away from his next contract, both the Celtics and IT were incentivized to skip surgery and ride out the last year. Cavs on the other hand, were hoping to get a piece for the future and are obviously not ok with someone with that risk.

 

[Vyle203]

the problem with IT is that- a guy with a serious injury on a 1 year deal who is demanding a "Brinks" truck deal- has basically no value.

Yea. That's why we tried to give him to you.

 

[WiggyRuss]

A doctor on another forum thinks he knows what is at the center of this issue. Obviously, take this with a grain of salt, but it makes a lot of sense and I think he nailed it.

Back in May, after Isaiah visited independent doctors, he said this to the media: "Like I have an extra bone or something, like doctor talk," Thomas said. "I don't understand what they're saying."

Normally, a torn labrum just needs a steroid injection and rest and it will heal in a matter of months.

BUT... if the person with the torn labrum has a femoral-acetabular impingement... the injury is more complicated. Basically, that condition involves having an irregular bone structure. People with that irregluar bone on their hip are more prone to labrum tears and very prone to re-injury once they've had a labrum tear. These people are often reccommend to have surgery to shave down the bown to prevent re-injury. This surgery has a recovery time of 6-9 months.

IT did not have surgery.

So... likely...

IT's torn labrum is more or less healed and he is able to play. BUT... the chance of injury is very high and he really should have that surgery for the sake of his career. This would explain why the Celtics doctors would claim he's ready to go and why the Cavs doctors would be saying he could miss most or all of this season.

makes total sense.

If the Celtics take him back- basically his value is tanked.

i would just void it and start over if there is a material chance Thomas needs surgery.

Boston would have no chancei n hell of beating the Cavs with a gimpy thomas.