Kyrie to Boston rumors heating up. Deal nearly complete

[The Q]

This is a direct quote from the very long insider article:

In RPM's estimation, Boston should get much worse production in place of Crowder. The Celtics were relatively ineffective with Brown on the court last season -- his minus-2.2 on-court net rating was worst among Boston regulars -- while most rookies do little to help their teams win, even ones as highly regarded as Tatum. As a result, Boston's RPM projection tumbles from 49.4 wins on average before the trade to 43.8, putting the Celtics fifth in the Eastern Conference. (Note that these projections haven't yet been adjusted for schedule, though that doesn't make a significant difference comparing within the East.)

 

[The Q]

DAnny could at least try to make the team better by adding Dante Cunningham and Gerald henderson.

But that seems out of the question at this point.

 

[WiggyRuss]

DAnny could at least try to make the team better by adding Dante Cunningham and Gerald henderson.

But that seems out of the question at this point.

Danny still has the Lakers pick, the Memphis pick, their own picks, and young guys like Rozier and YAbusale that hold some value.

Id try and get a real 4 and a shooting guard that can hit a 3.

 

[Vyle203]

DAnny could at least try to make the team better by adding Dante Cunningham and Gerald henderson.

But that seems out of the question at this point.

I want Tony Allen

 

[Gman]

This is a direct quote from the very long insider article:

Pretty dumb analysis, as stated...

... Jaylon Brown was a rookie last year: learning the ropes, developing strength, etc. He was a clearly better player at the end of the season than he was at the beginning. And he's gonna be a better player this season than he was last season.

Any metric that fails to take into account the natural progression of a youngster that obviously progressed and is still progressing is weak.

 

[Gman]

DAnny could at least try to make the team better by adding Dante Cunningham and Gerald henderson.

But that seems out of the question at this point.

Both bad ideas, IMO.

C's already have some of the best talent and depth at the wing position of any team in the NBA. Any slack that needs to be picked up... whatever isn't picked up by Gordon Hayward should be picked up by Jaylon Brown.

 

[Blotch]

I mentioned the article multiple times. It's on EsPN.

Are they big trades, no, not really. But when Danny wins, he wins big.

A lot of these deals were meh. You wanna argue them either way fine. Or some were just fair value:
Some of the ones that were fair value were as follows:
The Brooks/Crawford deal for a handful of 2nds
the 2016 draft day deal with Memphis

Losses:
Kris Humphries Deal
Courtney Lee deal
Brandon Wright deal (although what he did after the fact does help)
Austin Rivers trade
trade down with Philly this year

He lost the Bradley deal but I'm not gonna say count this one because i'm not gonna count the acquring of Zeller since a team dumping a guy to sign Lebron is probably a win for that team

Some of the deals still have outstanding picks so can't really judge those entirely yet. Such as the Jeff Green 3 way deal. The pick was expected to be a late first, if they fall off a cliff that could turn into a win.

Again, I ignored the salary clearing deals that they were a part of on both sides to be consistent.

Ok, so what are you doing here? You specifically said Danny Ainge has lost a lot since the 2000s.

The KG/Pierce deal is universally regarded as as big a sports heist as the Hershall Walker deal.

He got IT for a 2nd round pick and Marcus Thornton

He got Crowder and a 1st for Rondo


I'm gonna stop there because you get the idea.

Neither of us know what will become of the Philly deal. For the record I hated it right up until I watched Tatum play in Summer League. I know, I know. summer league. I don't believe in that shit any more than the next guy. So I'm gonna raise my hypocrite hand here. But, I hated the Tatum pick until I watched him play. I love the kid now.

But c'mon man. The Humphries deal? The Brooks/Crawford deal? What are you doing here?

I'm trying, Q. I'm trying. But you can't do the "yeah, so what about the Rondo/Pierce/KG/IT deals. let's talk about the Kris Humphries/Marshon Brooks, Brandon Wright trades" and not expect me to think you're trolling.

 

[Blotch]

Westbrook "is" a better offensive player than Kyrie. Not only that Westbrook plays great defense. Actually IMO, Curry a better offensive player than Kyrie.

Westbrook plays great defense?

 

[Blotch]

That was kind of the point.

He said Boston actually has a chance against CLE this year, and so i made that comment.

(because they still don't, not really).

As constructed right now, Boston/Cleveland is a coinflip.


Either embrace being a troll or don't. But you can't play the "I'm not a troll" at the same time as saying "Boston has no chance vs Cleveland"

You can't do that. You just can't.

 

[Blotch]

Pretty dumb analysis, as stated...

... Jaylon Brown was a rookie last year: learning the ropes, developing strength, etc. He was a clearly better player at the end of the season than he was at the beginning. And he's gonna be a better player this season than he was last season.

Any metric that fails to take into account the natural progression of a youngster that obviously progressed and is still progressing is weak.

And when you're getting that argument from a guy who has repeatedly sung the praises of Avery Bradley, it just feels like a troll, no? Avery Bradley didn't see the court until his 4th season.

not unlike a zillion other guys. I'll throw Jermaine O'Neal out as my bellcow example.

 

[Blotch]

This is a direct quote from the very long insider article:

So, let me ask you this.


When you read something like that. How does it not fail your internal bullshit test?

How?

 

[Blotch]

I want Tony Allen

co-signed

 

[WiggyRuss]

As constructed right now, Boston/Cleveland is a coinflip.


Either embrace being a troll or don't. But you can't play the "I'm not a troll" at the same time as saying "Boston has no chance vs Cleveland"

You can't do that. You just can't.

im just interested in knowing why you think Cleveland/Boston is a coin flip.

I think the Cavs are quite a bit better for these reasons:

1. Cavs have LeBron
2. Celtics have no one that can cover LeBron
3. Crowder is a solid option to guard Hayward
4. Cavs have a big rebounding advantage
5. Cavs have a big 3 pt shooting advantage
6. Cavs are prob deeper now- esp. if/when Dwade gets bought out.

 

[Vyle203]

im just interested in knowing why you think Cleveland/Boston is a coin flip.

I think the Cavs are quite a bit better for these reasons:

1. Cavs have LeBron
2. Celtics have no one that can cover LeBron
3. Crowder is a solid option to guard Hayward
4. Cavs have a big rebounding advantage
5. Cavs have a big 3 pt shooting advantage
6. Cavs are prob deeper now- esp. if/when Dwade gets bought out.

It's not a coin flip. If we still had Crowder I'd feel better about it, but it still wouldn't be a coin flip.

 

[flyerhawk]

Pretty dumb analysis, as stated...

... Jaylon Brown was a rookie last year: learning the ropes, developing strength, etc. He was a clearly better player at the end of the season than he was at the beginning. And he's gonna be a better player this season than he was last season.

Any metric that fails to take into account the natural progression of a youngster that obviously progressed and is still progressing is weak.

Brown is likely to improve but he's not going to turn into a stud overnight. He very well may get much better at the end of this season as well but there will be growing pains especially without Crowder there.

I believe that RPM does assume progression for young players.

 

[The Q]

Pretty dumb analysis, as stated...

... Jaylon Brown was a rookie last year: learning the ropes, developing strength, etc. He was a clearly better player at the end of the season than he was at the beginning. And he's gonna be a better player this season than he was last season.

Any metric that fails to take into account the natural progression of a youngster that obviously progressed and is still progressing is weak.

It does, but the reality is most rookies aren't positive contributors their first 2 years in the league.

 

[The Q]

And when you're getting that argument from a guy who has repeatedly sung the praises of Avery Bradley, it just feels like a troll, no? Avery Bradley didn't see the court until his 4th season.

not unlike a zillion other guys. I'll throw Jermaine O'Neal out as my bellcow example.

You got the point, and yet missed it...all at the same time.

 

[CitySushi]

im just interested in knowing why you think Cleveland/Boston is a coin flip.

I think the Cavs are quite a bit better for these reasons:

1. Cavs have LeBron
2. Celtics have no one that can cover LeBron
3. Crowder is a solid option to guard Hayward
4. Cavs have a big rebounding advantage
5. Cavs have a big 3 pt shooting advantage
6. Cavs are prob deeper now- esp. if/when Dwade gets bought out.

I know you think Wade to Cleveland is a lock, but the real team you need to watch out for signing him is the Spurs. Spurs would offer all the championship opportunity, and Wade would immediately be a key cog in the system. He'd get to play for Pop and he wouldn't be seen riding Lebron's coattails.

Wade signing with the Spurs would make them the absolute biggest threat to the Warriors. If you really think about it, the Spurs actually make the most sense for Wade to sign with. If he signs with Cleveland, with all the uncertainty about next year he'll be back on the Free Agent market. If he signs with the Spurs, he might be inclined to stay there a few more years in a system that would allow him to rest and maximize his efficiency.

As for the Cavs matchup with the Celtics, I agree the Cavs hold a substantial edge. 90% of that being Lebron and 10% being rebounding.

 

[The Q]

So, let me ask you this.


When you read something like that. How does it not fail your internal bullshit test?

How?

Because it's interesting.

Especially it's clear the Crowder is being severely undervalued.

The celtics did not get better this year unless Irving makes a big leap. I thought 6 was high, but a couple of wins I could buy.

 

[Vyle203]

You got the point, and yet missed it...all at the same time.

One thing it doesn't take into account probably is the fact that the bottom half of the East is going to be a giant tankfest.