Jimmy Graham to get franchise tag

[WizardHawk]

So 1/3 of the time he actually blocks, or at least lines up like he will and yet you want to pay him 100% of the money of a WR that lines up outside and seldom blocks. Sure, that's much more fair.

Already pointed out to you that you and JDM are kind of on an island. Not nearly the support for your position that there is for the team and their view. He's a TE. Sorry, but that's what he is. Don't care if he moves a few feet farther away from the OT or not. He is a TE. End of story.

 

[Midnightangel]

So 1/3 of the time he actually blocks, or at least lines up like he will and yet you want to pay him 100% of the money of a WR that lines up outside and seldom blocks. Sure, that's much more fair.

Already pointed out to you that you and JDM are kind of on an island. Not nearly the support for your position that there is for the team and their view. He's a TE. Sorry, but that's what he is. Don't care if he moves a few feet farther away from the OT or not. He is a TE. End of story.

So, according to you - they can list him as a TE and use him as a WR?

See, I can use that icon as well. Cute, huh?

He puts up WR numbers, so he should get WR money.

But by YOUR standards the WR's on his team are LESS effetive and should get paid MORE.

Look, more icons.

Nice logic there, chief.

He's used as a WR, pay the man like a WR. End of story.

(see, I can use that phrase as well).

Oh...and sometimes when lining up as a WR, he blocks. Chew on that.

 

[WizardHawk]

He isn't the first TE to get over 1,000 yards receiving in a season. TE's actually are allowed to run routes and catch balls. He does that. HE IS A TIGHT END. It's just not rocket science here.

 

[Midnightangel]

He isn't the first TE to get over 1,000 yards receiving in a season. TE's actually are allowed to run routes and catch balls. He does that. HE IS A TIGHT END. It's just not rocket science here.

It's not just the yardage, though.

He's like the 15th best in the league in that regard - no one but WR's around him. But leaving that aside...

He's 1st in the league in TD's with 16. No one had more, not even WR's.

He's top 10 in the league with regard to plays over 20 yards as well as plays over 40 yards.

Does that sound like a TE to you?

If you have more 40 yard plays than most WR's - how are you just a TE?

 

[HaroldSeattle]

I really don't care which way it goes, but I think the Saints will win this battle. JG # on his uniform says he's a TE, he'll have a up hill battle to win this IMO.

 

[Midnightangel]

I really don't care which way it goes, but I think the Saints will win this battle. JG # on his uniform says he's a TE, he'll have a up hill battle to win this IMO.

It's going to be a tough fight either way and, if Graham wins, it could set a precedent.

I think a deal gets done in June or July like they did for Brees.

I also think, while he wont get Megatron money, he'll get paid more like a WR and less like a TE.

 

[Brees#1]

He let us down down the stretch, if he only knew how to make plays late in the season or just sit due to his injury we would likely have won the division and got to the NFCCG.

 

[fearthepelicans]

I'm not concerned. A long-term deal will get done eventually.

 

[Midnightangel]

He let us down down the stretch, if he only knew how to make plays late in the season or just sit due to his injury we would likely have won the division and got to the NFCCG.

It's hard to say that someone that put up his stats 'let you down'. He's far and away the best receiver on your team.

 

[WizardHawk]

It's not just the yardage, though.

He's like the 15th best in the league in that regard - no one but WR's around him. But leaving that aside...

He's 1st in the league in TD's with 16. No one had more, not even WR's.

He's top 10 in the league with regard to plays over 20 yards as well as plays over 40 yards.

Does that sound like a TE to you?

If you have more 40 yard plays than most WR's - how are you just a TE?

Once again you assign more to stats than they actually can portray. Who is his QB and what kind of offense is he in? Did he lead in TD's because he's the best TE or receiver in the nation? Or because he has a future HOF QB on a pass heavy offense that is one of the tops in the league? His stats are a byproduct of the team around him.

What's funny is you will say those things about taking away from Wilson and what he does, but when it comes to another argument it's all about that player.

He is a damn good TE on a damn good team with one of the top QB's in the business running a pass happy offense.

 

[Money]

It's not just the yardage, though.

He's like the 15th best in the league in that regard - no one but WR's around him. But leaving that aside...

He's 1st in the league in TD's with 16. No one had more, not even WR's.

He's top 10 in the league with regard to plays over 20 yards as well as plays over 40 yards.

Does that sound like a TE to you?

If you have more 40 yard plays than most WR's - how are you just a TE?

It sounds to me like a healthy year from Gronkowski. Nobody seems to argue that he's a WR. So basically Graham doesn't do everything Gronk does BUT Graham should be paid as a WR and Gronk should make far less as a TE. That logic makes zero sense.

I'll tell you what does make sense. With the evolution of the TE position, they should be lumped in with WRs when determining the tag number. Until that happens though...one TE shouldn't get preferential treatment over the rest of the TEs.

 

[Midnightangel]

Once again you assign more to stats than they actually can portray. Who is his QB and what kind of offense is he in? Did he lead in TD's because he's the best TE or receiver in the nation? Or because he has a future HOF QB on a pass heavy offense that is one of the tops in the league? His stats are a byproduct of the team around him.

What's funny is you will say those things about taking away from Wilson and what he does, but when it comes to another argument it's all about that player.

He is a damn good TE on a damn good team with one of the top QB's in the business running a pass happy offense.

You realize you can do this with anyone. Right?

Watch this:

Hey, Peyton Manning didn't REALLY have that great a year. So what if he had 56 TD's - he's a by product of the team around him. Right? He's got all those great WR's to catch the ball for him.

And Joe Monana? Pffffft. By product of the West Coast offense, nothing more. Moreover he had Jerry Rice as one of his receivers.

The Cowboys of the 90's? A by product of not having a salary cap. You notice they haven't done it since. And while were on that subject, Emmitt Smith is just a by product of having cattle as your Oline and he's not being touched until you get to the second level.

I could do this all day.

In the end the result is still the same - Graham is putting up SICK numbers, far eclipsing any WR on his team. And you're STILL saying it's OK for those that put up less numbers to get paid MORE simply because of where they line up.

That doesn't make sense to me.

You lose points for trying to drag Wilson into this. Homer.

 

[Midnightangel]

It sounds to me like a healthy year from Gronkowski. Nobody seems to argue that he's a WR. So basically Graham doesn't do everything Gronk does BUT Graham should be paid as a WR and Gronk should make far less as a TE. That logic makes zero sense.

I'll tell you what does make sense. With the evolution of the TE position, they should be lumped in with WRs when determining the tag number. Until that happens though...one TE shouldn't get preferential treatment over the rest of the TEs.

Then stop treating him like a WR. Simple.

But as long as teams are going to use their players any way it takes to win AND you're going to pay by the numbers they put up, then Graham deserves WR money.

You can't have it both ways on this. You don't get to treat him like a WR 67% of the time and still pay him like a TE...not when he's the most productive receiver - by far - on your club.

 

[Money]

Then stop treating him like a WR. Simple.

But as long as teams are going to use their players any way it takes to win AND you're going to pay by the numbers they put up, then Graham deserves WR money.

You can't have it both ways on this. You don't get to treat him like a WR 67% of the time and still pay him like a TE...not when he's the most productive receiver - by far - on your club.

Should Darren Sproles and Pierre Thomas be paid like WRs? They amassed almost 150 receptions between them.

Colston had a bad year for sure, but he also didn't have the luxury of being defended by safeties and linebackers most of the time.

 

[Midnightangel]

Should Darren Sproles and Pierre Thomas be paid like WRs? They amassed almost 150 receptions between them.

Colston had a bad year for sure, but he also didn't have the luxury of being defended by safeties and linebackers most of the time.

Do they line up as WR's more than 2/3 of the time?

 

[RoboticDreams]

It's not just the yardage, though.

He's like the 15th best in the league in that regard - no one but WR's around him. But leaving that aside...

He's 1st in the league in TD's with 16. No one had more, not even WR's.

He's top 10 in the league with regard to plays over 20 yards as well as plays over 40 yards.

Does that sound like a TE to you?

If you have more 40 yard plays than most WR's - how are you just a TE?

Again, none of that makes him a wideout.

 

[Midnightangel]

Again, none of that makes him a wideout.

Well, why not?

If you're using him as a WR 67% of the time, and he's got the numbers to match that position, why not PAY THE MAN!

 

[Money]

Do they line up as WR's more than 2/3 of the time?

Sorry...WRs have CBs lined up across from them. The high tag cost of CBs goes hand in hand with the high tag cost of WRs. See how that works?

 

[RoboticDreams]

Well, why not?

If you're using him as a WR 67% of the time, and he's got the numbers to match that position, why not PAY THE MAN!

He doesn't line up outside? He generally lines up at the TE position and them motions into the slot. He's not facing coverage that an actual wideout does. I think they will meet in the middle somewhere. Probably around 9 million or so.

 

[Money]

He doesn't line up outside? He generally lines up at the TE position and them motions into the slot. He's not facing coverage that an actual wideout does. I think they will meet in the middle somewhere. Probably around 9 million or so.

That's exactly what the Ravens and Suggs did in 2008. He was given the LB tag and Suggs claimed he was a DE. They worked out a long term deal that both parties were happy with.