Jimmy Graham to get franchise tag

[SonnyCID]

Whether he's a number one or good isn't relevant. All that is is where he plays, and he plays WR. If they want to franchise him that's the number they have to do it at.

Of course its relevant. Just because he goes in motion and pulls the LB away doesnt make him a WR. WRs face corners, not LBs.

No team in the NFL would pay him as a top WR, none.

 

[NCChiFan]

So I guess when LT led the league in rushing and receptions he should have leveraged that in to a top receiver contract and a top RB contract.

Graham catches a lot of passes, and they are against LBs, safeties and nickel corners. I don't care where you line up, those are TE duties.

It would depend, if they put LT wide out 2/3'ds of the time he touched the ball then yea, you would franchise him as a Wr not a RB.

 

[JDM]

No, it isn't. The franchise tag is not determined (from a league standpoint) by how good you are at your job. So the arguments of how good he is (or even what he would get paid, which would likely be a good chunk more than gronk's discounted deal with New England) don't matter. All that matters is what position the Saints use him as.

Anything else is a distraction from the relevant topics. Who covers him is a distraction. You could just as easily argue that they line him up inside occasionally to get better mismatches when he plays his actual position outside, and the numbers would support that. He's a WR. That's where he plays.

 

[NCChiFan]

No, it isn't. The franchise tag is not determined (from a league standpoint) by how good you are at your job. So the arguments of how good he is (or even what he would get paid, which would likely be a good chunk more than gronk's discounted deal with New England) don't matter. All that matters is what position the Saints use him as.

Anything else is a distraction from the relevant topics. Who covers him is a distraction. You could just as easily argue that they line him up inside occasionally to get better mismatches when he plays his actual position outside, and the numbers would support that. He's a WR. That's where he plays.

I agree, the Saints are going to lose this argument in arbitration.

 

[SonnyCID]

Why wouldn't he change his designation years ago from TE to WR?

Oh yeah, because then he would actually have to line up outside from the start against cover corners, instead of motioning and disguising against LBs.

He has been perfectly happy with the TE designation to this point because its what helps him exploit matchups and put up great numbers, but now of course its unacceptable.

 

[JDM]

Because the only reason it matters is for a franchise tag. Do you honestly think listing him as a WR would affect how opponents play him in any way? That's outright absurd. What reason would he have to care where he was listed if it weren't for the team trying to take advantage of the fact that he is listed at a position he doesn't play?

This is a slight reach, but if a QB did a couple pooch punts in a season and the team tried to franchise him as a punter, he'd have the same argument. "I did it a few times but the significant majority of my use was at the higher paying position." He is a WR; that is where he lines up and the position he plays.

 

[SonnyCID]

Because the only reason it matters is for a franchise tag. Do you honestly think listing him as a WR would affect how opponents play him in any way?

Hell yes it would. Because then he would actually have to start the play lined up outside instead of motioning out at the line, and they would most likely have their best cover guy on him.

He loves the TE designation when it helps make sure that he doesn't have to face the opposition's best cover guys, but then when it comes time to get paid he wants to be considered a WR.

 

[JDM]

If you think opposing coaches pay attention to how a player is listed you are all kinds of stupid. I can't fix that.

 

[NCChiFan]

Why wouldn't he change his designation years ago from TE to WR?

Oh yeah, because then he would actually have to line up outside from the start against cover corners, instead of motioning and disguising against LBs.

He has been perfectly happy with the TE designation to this point because its what helps him exploit matchups and put up great numbers, but now of course its unacceptable.

Does HE have the power to change his designation? If so, then why can't he change it now? It makes no sense that he can change it back then, but then can't change it now. Anyway, I think it is up to a team to designate where they think a player plays, but then how they utilize him tells a totally different story.

 

[SonnyCID]

If you think opposing coaches pay attention to how a player is listed you are all kinds of stupid. I can't fix that.

Dont be a jerkoff.

If he was listed as a WR he would actually have to line up outside to begin with, instead of starting off tackle and motioning out. Coaches would pay attention that, dont you think?

 

[SonnyCID]

Does HE have the power to change his designation? If so, then why can't he change it now? It makes no sense that he can change it back then, but then can't change it now. Anyway, I think it is up to a team to designate where they think a player plays, but then how they utilize him tells a totally different story.

IDK. He obviously wants to change his designation now. Perhaps he should have tried to change it before and become a full time WR going against cover corners instead of a TE who motions to draw out LBs.

 

[JDM]

Dont be a jerkoff.

If he was listed as a WR he would actually have to line up outside to begin with, instead of starting off tackle and motioning out. Coaches would pay attention that, dont you think?

No, he wouldn't. Designation means literally nothing in-game.

 

[SonnyCID]

No, he wouldn't. Designation means literally nothing in-game.

If he was listed as a WR he would already be outside, so he wouldn't start off tackle and have the option to motion out, so his designation as a TE means a lot.

 

[JDM]

Where is that rule?

 

[SonnyCID]

Where is that rule?

Never said it was a rule. It's a strategy, one that opposing coaches are well aware of.

WRs dont line up off tackle.

 

[JDM]

You honestly think that when Graham wins this the Saints change how they use him?

 

[SonnyCID]

You honestly think that when Graham wins this the Saints change how they use him?

No, he's not going to win this. A TE that starts inside and goes in motion is still a TE, not a WR.

They would never use him as an actual receiver because that would eat in to his production by never going against LBs.

 

[JDM]

He plays WR 2/3 of the time. Where he initially lines up means nothing. Where he takes the snap does, and that is consistently at WR.

You keep bringing up the idea that correctly designating him alters how they use him, but the premise is absurd. Designation is meaningless in-game. Literally its only relevance is franchise tag-wise and for recognition/awards.

 

[Money]

If Graham wins his appeal and is considered a WR, any safety who has ever covered him and gets the franchise tag placed on him should appeal and demand they get CB compensation.

It will be anarchy. When will the madness stop?

 

[JDM]

Did they play corner the majority of the time? No.

The only madness is the idea that a guy who played a position 2/3 of the time isn't that position.