Fitzpatrick gives in and agree to 1 yr deal with NYJ

[eaglesnut]

Actually he not as bad as you think. Saw a graph put up by Trudem, it doesn't include last years numbers, might surprise you.

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^^^ exactly

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Actually he not as bad as you think. Saw a graph put up by Trudem, it doesn't include last years numbers, might surprise you.

View attachment 124757

Palmer was traded for a 6th for a reason- he was pretty bad in Oakland.

Cutler was hated for good reasons- he was often (at least on the stat sheet) bad.

I have been a huge Andy Dalton hater prior to last year- but Fitzpatrick isn't likely to get better at this point. Dalton did- so I don't think they're quite comparable at this point.

All three of these guys were lightning rods for criticism not very long ago. It's nice perspective, but it doesn't answer for what Fitzpatrick's value is going forward- and it's not as good as those other 3.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Palmer was traded for a 6th for a reason- he was pretty bad in Oakland.

Cutler was hated for good reasons- he was often (at least on the stat sheet) bad.

I have been a huge Andy Dalton hater prior to last year- but Fitzpatrick isn't likely to get better at this point. Dalton did- so I don't think they're quite comparable at this point.

All three of these guys were lightning rods for criticism not very long ago. It's nice perspective, but it doesn't answer for what Fitzpatrick's value is going forward- and it's not as good as those other 3.

Given the Jets alternatives, a one year deal for $12 mil sounds reasonable for Fitz, course I can understand they like $8 mil better. We'll see how this works out.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

2015

YPA: 27th
INT%: 25th
INT'able passes: 2nd most
Sack %: 3rd least
Comp: 29th

Ryan Fitzpatrick with Brandon Marshall and Decker.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

2015

YPA: 27th
INT%: 25th
INT'able passes: 2nd most
Sack %: 3rd least
Comp: 29th

Ryan Fitzpatrick with Brandon Marshall and Decker.

Wait until you see Geno starting.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Wait until you see Geno starting.

Unfortunately for the Jets- all of their options are legitimately terrible at QB- and that defense isn't nearly good enough to hold the fort.

 

[cdumler7]

I was thinking he signed a two year deal with the Jets last yr. It was actually a 2 yr deal with Hou the year before.

At this point he should hold out. With the limited # of quality QBs $12 million is cheap. I'm surprised someone =Denver hasn't sniffed the water.

IMHO Fitz is worth 12 as a starter in today's market.

Hold out and after a couple starters go down he'll get 12.

Something to keep in mind. Fitzpatrick has the same agent as that of Osweiler. He is one that is huge on pushing as hard as possible to get as much money as possible and doesn't mind burning bridges. He actually told Osweiler to cut off all communication with the Broncos a little while after the season was over. Not exactly the best way to go about negotiations in my opinion. They stopped returning calls in my opinion because they were hoping it would maybe cause the Broncos to panic or cause other teams to think the Broncos were panicking and could swoop in and get Osweiler.

 

[tabascojet]

Wait until you see Geno starting.

 

[cdumler7]

Houston needs that good consistent QB play that they haven't had since they came back into the league. I think Oz will turn out to be a good QB since O'Brien is a QB's coach. My guess is he'll play well with some bumps this year in learning the system on the fly and turn that corner next season. I'm still a little baffled that Denver didn't pull the trigger unless they were cap strap and couldn't afford him.

The Broncos were a bit cap strapped this year. Money though really wasn't the issue. They have the most cap space of any team in the league so it is easy to design a contract where they have a small cap hit this year and the big cap hit happens next year. Chiefs just did that with Houston where his first year cap hit was only $6 million yet the deal is worth around $17 million a year.

Essentially what the Broncos do when figuring out contracts is they put a ceiling price on each player. They will not go higher than that. That does mean that some good players will leave for better contracts of teams that are willing to overpay but it helps keep the Broncos in check to not be overpaying for good not great talent. Osweiler's contract got above what they wanted to pay.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Something to keep in mind. Fitzpatrick has the same agent as that of Osweiler. He is one that is huge on pushing as hard as possible to get as much money as possible and doesn't mind burning bridges. He actually told Osweiler to cut off all communication with the Broncos a little while after the season was over. Not exactly the best way to go about negotiations in my opinion. They stopped returning calls in my opinion because they were hoping it would maybe cause the Broncos to panic or cause other teams to think the Broncos were panicking and could swoop in and get Osweiler.

Good point. I mentioned in one of our other threads. The one thing none of us know is what goes on behind closed doors. We all know it wasn't a good situation between Os, Den and the agent. But really how bad was it the agent may have pissed Denver's FO off enough, they don't want to deal with him?

 

[HaroldSeattle]

The Broncos were a bit cap strapped this year. Money though really wasn't the issue. They have the most cap space of any team in the league so it is easy to design a contract where they have a small cap hit this year and the big cap hit happens next year. Chiefs just did that with Houston where his first year cap hit was only $6 million yet the deal is worth around $17 million a year.

Essentially what the Broncos do when figuring out contracts is they put a ceiling price on each player. They will not go higher than that. That does mean that some good players will leave for better contracts of teams that are willing to overpay but it helps keep the Broncos in check to not be overpaying for good not great talent. Osweiler's contract got above what they wanted to pay.

Which makes the Von Miller situation interesting.

 

[cdumler7]

Good point. I mentioned in one of our other threads. The one thing none of us know is what goes on behind closed doors. We all know it wasn't a good situation between Os, Den and the agent. But really how bad was it the agent may have pissed Denver's FO off enough, they don't want to deal with him?

Well I do know Elway was ticked that Osweiler's agent wouldn't return his phone calls. He had been trying for quite some time to get ahold of him and nothing was going on. Now given if you believe the rumors the week that Osweiler was benched he went to his agent with his wife and told him to get him out of Denver whatever it takes. If that is even remotely true then at least to me kind of a good riddance thing. I mean if you are going to get that upset about getting benched in a game where you are losing and the team sticks in a HOF QB to replace you then I question your ability to handle the tough times in the NFL that will happen at times. Heck Brady has been benched in a game before. It just happens sometimes that it isn't your day. That doesn't mean go sulk in the corner then demand to go to another team.

 

[cdumler7]

Which makes the Von Miller situation interesting.

Well there is an exception to every rule. I do know the Broncos are not wanting to make him the highest paid defensive player in the NFL. They are wanting his number to be between Houston's and Suh's. Both sides right now are playing a bit of hard ball but I do know the negotiations have showed a lot of promise and both sides are optimistic something will get done. My guess is that at the end of the day he does become the highest paid defender by just a little bit over that of Suh.

 

[tabascojet]

o/u for wins for brock this year in houston? 8.5?

 

[Fountain City Blues]

o/u for wins for brock this year in houston? 8.5?

Leaning slightly over at 9.

 

[tabascojet]

Leaning slightly over at 9.

im leaning slightly under at 8.....not sure even 9 will cut it this yea though, so playoffs year 2 then?

 

[NWPATSFAN]

im leaning slightly under at 8.....not sure even 9 will cut it this yea though, so playoffs year 2 then?

Assuming Brock has a decent year stat wise and Houston wins 8 or 9, is the Osweiller contract deemed a good deal for the first year?

 

[NWPATSFAN]

BTW I take the over but reserve the right to change my pick based off of Handicrapper's post season predictions.

 

[cdumler7]

Assuming Brock has a decent year stat wise and Houston wins 8 or 9, is the Osweiller contract deemed a good deal for the first year?

Honestly at this point because they paid so much for him I would think they are thinking he needs to show more than that. I mean they won that much with Hoyer at QB so when you bring in an $18 million man you are saying that is not good enough. I would also think they have to advance in the playoffs beyond the wild card round. That is what happens with big money is big expectations come with it.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

The Broncos were a bit cap strapped this year. Money though really wasn't the issue. They have the most cap space of any team in the league so it is easy to design a contract where they have a small cap hit this year and the big cap hit happens next year. Chiefs just did that with Houston where his first year cap hit was only $6 million yet the deal is worth around $17 million a year.

They have the cap space but that's because they don't have players to pay next year. Sure they could backload it some. Maybe not sign their new tackles and make it work for 2016 with a 8-10 mil cap hit in year 1 and a big signing bonus.

But then in 2016, say that's a 22-25 mil cap hit on the backloading. So then they are there middle of pack in cap space with Von, Ware, Sly Williams, Stewart, Paradis, Sanders and others coming off the books and even bigger issues at tackle than last year.

And while the Chiefs did do that with Houston, next year as of now they have very few players under contract for 2017 with next to no cap space (5 mil currently) so will need to make a pile of moves just to get some cap relief (not even considering what it would cost if they want to give a shot at keeping Eric Berry and Dontari Poe). And with that cap hit on Houston showing up to get above the cap this year they couldn't make competitive offers to Sean Smith, Chase Daniel, Jeff Allen, Donald Stephenson, Tyvon Branch... Sure they got Schwartz and Howard but a big net loss on talent there.

As for how he related to his benching, it is all rumor, I don't really consider that unless it comes from them or a really good set of sources. Sure maybe Kubiak lied to him when he said even if Peyton was healthy it would be his team going forward for better or worse. Maybe he did tell his agent he wanted out because of that.



And the issue with a backloaded contract of course is you are investing more years into him as well. Texans have a 2 year investment in Osweiler. As much as the Bronco's clearly wanted him with that huge guaranteed money deal they were putting up even after he supposedly had cut them off, he is still largely untested in games. If you are going big signing bonus, low early salary to get to that point, you are almost having to guarantee 3 years before it can become financially viable to move on. Flacco's deal would be an extreme example of that.

That's tough. I think the Bronco's offered the most they could under their cap restraints to not gut the roster for him, but not make it a 3 year+ committment either with backloading. Houston was able to offer more without doing those two things.