Big XII

[MarkOU]

for some reason unbalanced divisions seem to be the going trend. just ask the b10 who put osu, um, psu, & msu in one division.

I'm pretty sure there was a lot of whining and crying about "tradition" and that's why those schools were kept together.

 

[outofyourmind]

There are not "home run" additions for the Big12 at this point, so why not be the first Conference to go to 16 teams.
Possible additions could include.
Louisville
Cincinnati
BYU
Southern Miss.
Memphis
SMU
Houston

 

[charlie42s]

There are not "home run" additions for the Big12 at this point, so why not be the first Conference to go to 16 teams.
Possible additions could include.
Louisville
Cincinnati
BYU
Southern Miss.
Memphis
SMU
Houston

Dumb, just ...
Adding 2 schools from Texas won't work. ... SMU? They killed the SWC.

 

[Texas Jefe]

I say, add the Mormons and Boise. Then find someone over in the East to give WVU someone close by, who could that be? I just cant see Cincy, but at least they are in that quadrant.


In the end, I don't have a clue who they should, could or will add. Do like the B1G and get a team with vast TVs, and absolutely zero football fans, like Maryland, does not appeal to me.

 

[Hornsstampede2.0]

LOUISVILLE is not a great add.
The ACC should have waited.
I think they were so pissed that Maryland blindsided them they reacted poorly to try and show up Maryland.

LOUISVILLE adds no recruiting or television market.
It is an oddball academically as well for the a prestige academic ACC.
It has a mediocre brand name and a smallish fanbase nationally.
It is essentially a lesser version of basketball powers (Duke, UNC) that already existed in the ACC.

And whatever junk about Syracuse needing a partner is silly because Boston College is far closer with much deeper ties historically as a long term Cuse rival.

The ACC did a great thing with Pitt, Syracuse, and Notre Dame.
Louisville will end up being something of a minor mistake....not a colossal blunder...but meh overall...
UL would have been there as noboby was trying for them.
The ACC could have took their time and saw how Notre Dame was going to play it long term.

 

[outofyourmind]

Is there just no money in being a really good Basketball Conference? There just aren't any good football choices out there.

 

[Texas Jefe]

Is there just no money in being a really good Basketball Conference? There just aren't any good football choices out there.

Money-wise, there are few BB teams that make any money, if that's what matters. As for the sport, may depend on where you are? I like basketball, but football is far and away the king for me. Basketball is kind of a less stress, just enjoy it type of thing for me.

Don't really think, concerning realignment, that they are looking at basketball. Football is the determining factor, imo, because of the money. Unless it's Louisville or Kentucky, etc., not much money, I guess.

 

[john01992]

LOUISVILLE is not a great add.
The ACC should have waited.
I think they were so pissed that Maryland blindsided them they reacted poorly to try and show up Maryland.

LOUISVILLE adds no recruiting or television market.
It is an oddball academically as well for the a prestige academic ACC.
It has a mediocre brand name and a smallish fanbase nationally.
It is essentially a lesser version of basketball powers (Duke, UNC) that already existed in the ACC.

And whatever junk about Syracuse needing a partner is silly because Boston College is far closer with much deeper ties historically as a long term Cuse rival.

The ACC did a great thing with Pitt, Syracuse, and Notre Dame.
Louisville will end up being something of a minor mistake....not a colossal blunder...but meh overall...
UL would have been there as noboby was trying for them.
The ACC could have took their time and saw how Notre Dame was going to play it long term.

1. I agree that louisville was a move of desperation and not luxury and that if given the opportunity the acc would trade away louisville to get back maryland in a heartbeat.

2. yes they are an outlier academically and that is a huge eyesore for the conference

while you can bash this move as bad ==> I think it was a homerun move considering the circumstances. because

-the ACC has a lot of competing factions (football, basketball, north, south, old big east, original acc). Louisville was really the only school that all the ACC schools could rally around.

-while you may want to downplay their market size, they are a national BB brand with a solid football following. they sold out their sugar bowl allotment so lets not pretend that their BB success doesnt translate to BB as well. kentucky is the 26th most populous state. kentucky is a slightly below average but not horrible in market size.

-Kentuckys recruiting grounds are below average however they are far from horrible. kentucky produces double the amount of d1 talent as iowa & west virginia combined. and had just one less d1 signee than kansas last year.

-Louisville in the acc gives the ACC-SEC an even numbered 4 end of year rivals which goes to huge lengths to make the scheduling between the two conferences easier

-yes syracuse is rivaled with BC, however BC right now is not strong in BB and they are not a top 10 all time BB program. no matter what BC does syracuse truly is an awkward 3rd wheel to duke/unc and having louisville in the conference keeps that from happening. in the big east in the final years it was starting to become painfully obvious that LV was starting to replace uconn as syracuse's go to basketball rival. LV in the ACC does a really good job of continuing the buildup between the two and it works out well for both schools as they will each be each others conference rival while both schools play their true #1 rival OOC. what you may not realize is that syracuse was one of the biggest proponents of Louisville and came out strongly against uconn.

yes louisville is no maryland however there was no "magical university" that had solid academics, solid markets, solid recruiting grounds, great athletics etc. that the ACC could take. and by no means was the ACC going to sit at 13 teams. the maryland move could have done a major dent to the ACC but they recovered from that blow very nicely by adding louisville. the damage from the UMD departure is still there, however LV covered a lot of it up. I honestly believe that this was a grand slam on the ACCs part because they were able to fill a lot of needs in very tough circumstances.

 

[john01992]

Money-wise, there are few BB teams that make any money, if that's what matters. As for the sport, may depend on where you are? I like basketball, but football is far and away the king for me. Basketball is kind of a less stress, just enjoy it type of thing for me.

Don't really think, concerning realignment, that they are looking at basketball. Football is the determining factor, imo, because of the money. Unless it's Louisville or Kentucky, etc., not much money, I guess.

personally I believe that BB plays very little in conference realignment.

uconn couldnt get into a power conference

louisville coulnt get into a power conference until they got a gift from maryland

kansas was one of 4 b12 schools that was not reported to have been given an official invite from another power conference during the 2 rounds of realignment that hit the b12.

average football > elite basketball

 

[john01992]

Is there just no money in being a really good Basketball Conference? There just aren't any good football choices out there.

BB tounry payouts for a decent BB conference can reach into the millions (a final four = $9.5 mill) however those payouts come once every 6 years.

BB tv contracts can become pretty solid. but most likely the most elite BB conference wont get more than 5 mill per school a year.

so while BB can provide enough money to make one power conference a couple more mill a year than another power conference. it cant carry the weight of a conference. conferences are better off making football centric moves and tap other resources to make up for the BB $$$ shortfall. (for example the b10 makes 2 mill per school on hockey alone)

 

[Wild Turkey]

Football pays the bills even at most D1 basketball schools the bulk of the athletic budget comes out of the football contract. Now schools that do not have a football team have a lot less expense and can make $ if they are good.

That is why the ACC probably best bb conference still only has a network deal worth about 19 mil per team much less than the SEC, PAC, B1G or B12.

 

[john01992]

Football pays the bills even at most D1 basketball schools the bulk of the athletic budget comes out of the football contract. Now schools that do not have a football team have a lot less expense and can make $ if they are good.

That is why the ACC probably best bb conference still only has a network deal worth about 19 mil per team much less than the SEC, PAC, B1G or B12.

the ACC has a 20 mill a year deal because of.....

1) they were not due for a new TV contract during conference realignment. they did not have the luxury of fielding competing bids.

2) overall incompetence & stupidity on the ACC leadership when it comes to handling tv contracts. they have an unnecessary deal with raycom, they unnecessarily signed away their tier 2 & 3 for a fraction of its real value, and they continue to lag on getting an acc network up & running. after the FSU fiasco the ACC got their head out of their ass and started making smarter moves, but the damage was already done.

on paper the ACC should be making significantly more than they currently do. they have the largest footprint of any conference however they suck at maximizing that potential.

 

[GoldRusher]

Unless the contract has changed I thought the ACC was at 17mm per and that was back loaded.The ACC is the poorhouse of the P5, the new BigEast with better leadership if you will.

 

[john01992]

Unless the contract has changed I thought the ACC was at 17mm per and that was back loaded.The ACC is the poorhouse of the P5, the new BigEast with better leadership if you will.

the contract has changed. they got an extra 3 mill bump when Notre Dame joined.

 

[Hornsstampede2.0]

and by no means was the ACC going to sit at 13 teams.

The ACC had 14 teams at the time NOT 13.
They lost MD, but they added Syracuse, Notre Dame, and Pitt.

Adding Louisville made it an odd number (15) further adding scheduling headaches.
Notre Dame was the 14th member in all sports but football, and they are obligated to play 5 games in football.

The scheduling mismatch was not there at the time.
If anything Louisville makes scheduling a pain for every other sport.

 

[Wild Turkey]

the ACC has a 20 mill a year deal because of.....

1) they were not due for a new TV contract during conference realignment. they did not have the luxury of fielding competing bids.

2) overall incompetence & stupidity on the ACC leadership when it comes to handling tv contracts. they have an unnecessary deal with raycom, they unnecessarily signed away their tier 2 & 3 for a fraction of its real value, and they continue to lag on getting an acc network up & running. after the FSU fiasco the ACC got their head out of their ass and started making smarter moves, but the damage was already done.

on paper the ACC should be making significantly more than they currently do. they have the largest footprint of any conference however they suck at maximizing that potential.

Doesnt matter football drives the contract regardless.

 

[john01992]

The ACC had 14 teams at the time NOT 13.
They lost MD, but they added Syracuse, Notre Dame, and Pitt.

Adding Louisville made it an odd number (15) further adding scheduling headaches.
Notre Dame was the 14th member in all sports but football, and they are obligated to play 5 games in football.

The scheduling mismatch was not there at the time.
If anything Louisville makes scheduling a pain for every other sport.

dude notre dame is not a full member. that means for football the acc will have only 13 teams. that IS a scheduling mismatch and you are just trying to bullshit me on a technicality.

the ACC was already set on a 14 full member, 1 non FB member slate before UMD left. for scheduling & contractual purposes they were better off adding LV rather than pulling a MAC & go down the NCAA waiver 13 team league route.

 

[john01992]

Doesnt matter football drives the contract regardless.

do you seriously lack reading comprehension? because what i basically said was (and im paraphrasing myself here) "on paper the acc in football is worth a lot more than they are currently getting paid because the ACC leadership is incompetent when it comes to tv contract negotiations"

 

[john01992]

The ACC had 14 teams at the time NOT 13.
They lost MD, but they added Syracuse, Notre Dame, and Pitt.

Adding Louisville made it an odd number (15) further adding scheduling headaches.
Notre Dame was the 14th member in all sports but football, and they are obligated to play 5 games in football.

The scheduling mismatch was not there at the time.
If anything Louisville makes scheduling a pain for every other sport.

and theres one other major thing that you missed. you assume that all 14 of the full ACC members play every ACC sport when that is not the case.

without Louisville there are 8 ACC sports that would have had odd number teams. if anything LVs inclusion to the ACC does more to make scheduling easier for the non FB acc sports than you try to claim. and again these are non football sports where scheduling doesnt come anywhere close to being as complicated as football. this is just your whining over nothing.

 

[occupant]

Goddamn.