Big XII

[geneh_33]

My opinion is that the Big 12 won't increase its' membership unless the ACC collapses.

Here are the conferences that won't lose members that haven't already declared their exits(alphabetically and starting from today): Big Ten, Big 12, Pac-12 and SEC-14.

While there are a lot of posters/fans that want the Big 12 to collapse/disappear, it isn't going to happen.

Same is true for the ACC. We've got everybody locked in now just like the Big 12 does. Both conferences are here to stay. Everybody who wanted out of the ACC and the Big 12 have already made their exit.

 

[Hornsstampede2.0]

Central Florida is the school I would like to see some overtures to eventually.
UCF will probably have to make a concentrated effort to improve some facilities and spending but it is the best long term investment.

Nothing would help the Big 12 more than getting those TV markets and lucrative recruiting fields of Florida. The Big 12 sold it soul to get back into a Florida bowl game tie-in this year.
I think its about time to look into moving that direction permanently.

I am glad they passed on Louisville. That would have been another kneejerk move adding another mouth without any infrastructure benefits. We did that once for survival (TCU and WVU to a lesser degree).

Survival is one thing. There is no reason to do it for expansion. UL would still be an AAC school had the ACC not been panicky and desperate after the MD embarrassment.

 

[charlie42s]

Same is true for the ACC. We've got everybody locked in now just like the Big 12 does. Both conferences are here to stay. Everybody who wanted out of the ACC and the Big 12 have already made their exit.

You'll note I wrote "if the ACC collapses" not "when the ACC collapses".

 

[charlie42s]

One of the unwritten aspects of Big 12 expansion is how the divisions will be unbalanced. UT, OU and OSU would be in the same division and unless the Big 12 got creative the other division would be a cakewalk.

 

[john01992]

One of the unwritten aspects of Big 12 expansion is how the divisions will be unbalanced. UT, OU and OSU would be in the same division and unless the Big 12 got creative the other division would be a cakewalk.

for some reason unbalanced divisions seem to be the going trend. just ask the b10 who put osu, um, psu, & msu in one division.

 

[geneh_33]

You'll note I wrote "if the ACC collapses" not "when the ACC collapses".

Yes, it is possible. VT and FSU may leave. But even if they do the ACC will continue on.

I have always wondered how it would have looked had the ACC and Big 12 nearly both collapsed and joined up what was left. We'd have a definite East and West, LOL.

 

[charlie42s]

Yes, it is possible. VT and FSU may leave. But even if they do the ACC will continue on.

I have always wondered how it would have looked had the ACC and Big 12 nearly both collapsed and joined up what was left. We'd have a definite East and West, LOL.

It would have been an interesting alliance.

 

[geneh_33]

It would have been an interesting alliance.

For a while there it looked like it was going to happen. Texas, OU, OSU and one other team going to the PAC while the ACC lost 4-6 teams to the SEC and Big 10. Yeah, I was trying to predict where everybody was going to end up.

I'm glad it didn't happen. But at least we did get a bowl alignment and a deal for some good future games from the Big 12 out of it.

 

[GoldRusher]

Central Florida is the school I would like to see some overtures to eventually.
UCF will probably have to make a concentrated effort to improve some facilities and spending but it is the best long term investment.

Nothing would help the Big 12 more than getting those TV markets and lucrative recruiting fields of Florida. The Big 12 sold it soul to get back into a Florida bowl game tie-in this year.
I think its about time to look into moving that direction permanently.

I am glad they passed on Louisville. That would have been another kneejerk move adding another mouth without any infrastructure benefits. We did that once for survival (TCU and WVU to a lesser degree).

Survival is one thing. There is no reason to do it for expansion. UL would still be an AAC school had the ACC not been panicky and desperate after the MD embarrassment.

^ gets it , I feel close to the same about Cincy and the conference getting into OH for the same reasons.

 

[john01992]

For a while there it looked like it was going to happen. Texas, OU, OSU and one other team going to the PAC while the ACC lost 4-6 teams to the SEC and Big 10. Yeah, I was trying to predict where everybody was going to end up.

I'm glad it didn't happen. But at least we did get a bowl alignment and a deal for some good future games from the Big 12 out of it.

the only 2 acc flight risks were maryland & FSU. no major media outlet ever came out and said that UNC was actively looking at the b10 or FSU/clemson to the b12.

there have been two Freedom of Information Act requests on UNC & Maryland which unloaded 1000s of emails from within the administration which verify that UNC was never in serious discussion with the b10 and that maryland at no point made any reference to other ACC schools joining them in the b10.

as much as this hypothetical is fun to speculate on. its only a hypothetical and nothing more.

 

[GoldRusher]

Yes, it is possible. VT and FSU may leave. But even if they do the ACC will continue on.

I have always wondered how it would have looked had the ACC and Big 12 nearly both collapsed and joined up what was left. We'd have a definite East and West, LOL.

At one time there were some ACC/B12 merger rumors. I guess anything could happen if the money was right.

 

[john01992]

If the b12 wants to do westward expansion their only option is new mexico. NM is the only western school that has any success recruiting texas and they provide a nice big state for a future LHN. CSU, BYU, & Air Force would be nice on paper but unless the b12 wants to take multiple MWC schools their inclusion will be problematic.

a lot of people say cincy however all cincy really brings is another mouth to feed and not much more. UCF however is a very large school with a growing alumni base and has a lot of potential there. they give the b12 access to the FL market and this move does more to help wvu than cincy. for wvu to remain a powerful program they need as much access to florida as possible for recruiting. UCF + USF (to give UCF a partner and not make them an outlier) guarantees WVU one florida game a year which will be a huge help with recruiting.

as for the 4th school. it needs to be rice. yes this may sound insane but if the b12 wants to be taken seriously as a strong stable conference that provides the same security blanket as the sec, acc, b10 then they need to act like those 3 conferences and follow those conferences blueprint.

so what exactly is the blueprint that the acc, sec, & b10 have ==> 14 teams with an elite academia. Rice is the last remaining elite academia thats not in a power conference, they are located in texas (in houston no less). they won their conference this year and are going to their second straight bowl.

rice does more to stabilize the b12 than any other school that the b12 has a chance at adding. while these are athletic moves they are being made by the school admins not just the athletic directors and academics do play a factor. what makes the b12 so unstable now is texas being tasked with carrying the load athletically and academically for the conference. as it stands texas is an academic outlier in the b12. add a school like rice into the conversation and it effectively shuts up everyone in austin who wants to leave because of the b12s piss poor academics.

yes these 4 programs rice, new mexico, usf & ucf may be very weak in football historically, however that does not matter. the b12 already tried the "lets find the best football schools from the G5" and got burned badly for it. because as the b12 found out, the b12 is a whole different league than the Big East/aac and no other G5 school (except maybe BYU) is going to join the league and run the table within the first couple of years. thats why these 4 programs at the very least bring something else to the table besides football.

as it stands right now the b12 has a lot of good football schools. probably the best conference top to bottom. How else do you explain 9 bowl bids AND a round robin schedule. the b12 can (and more than any other conference) afford to add inferior football schools. if anything it will be to the b12s advantage to do so. giving more scrub matches to the medium level b12 schools will ensure those teams get bowl games ona regular basis. this will guarantee wvu/tcu get to a bowl on almost a yearly basis and help make their b12 transition to the b12 easier and get them on track again to be consistently in the top 25.

so why hasnt the b12 done this yet? because their options from the perspective of ou, osu, & ut is that they can either try to prop of their own conference or join a better conference that can prop them up. I think the choice is pretty obvious. at this point the b12 is just trying to milk the conference for every penny they can while they and then OU/UT are out of there.

 

[GoldRusher]

Id throw UNLV in any western expansion talk for that tv market. I wouldn't be shocked to see the PAC make a move for them for that same reason.

 

[john01992]

Id throw UNLV in any western expansion talk for that tv market. I wouldn't be shocked to see the PAC make a move for them for that same reason.

cough *academics*

 

[geneh_33]

^ gets it , I feel close to the same about Cincy and the conference getting into OH for the same reasons.

We took UL because of the BB revenues they bring to the conference. Louisville makes more money in BB than all but 20 schools do in football. I think you guys made a big mistake in passing up on UL.

 

[geneh_33]

Cinci doesn't bring much and you are right they are just another mouth to feed. Let them be the big boy in the new fangled AAC.

 

[john01992]

We took UL because of the BB revenues they bring to the conference. Louisville makes more money in BB than all but 20 schools do in football. I think you guys made a big mistake in passing up on UL.

UCF does sound good, though. Who would you bring in with them?

UL was a great addition for the acc because it appeased all the factions within the ACC.

i wouldnt say their BB money is the reason why they were a great addition but it is something to note.

the best part about their addition is that they give SU a BB rival and prevent that program from being an awkward 3rd wheel to unc/duke

 

[geneh_33]

UNLV should definitely be the next "big" target for either the PAC or the Big 12. We'll see.

 

[geneh_33]

UL was a great addition for the acc because it appeased all the factions within the ACC.

i wouldnt say their BB money is the reason why they were a great addition but it is something to note.

the best part about their addition is that they give SU a BB rival and prevent that program from being an awkward 3rd wheel to unc/duke

Just wish Wake would pick it back up and NC State would step it up a bit, too.

 

[GoldRusher]

We took UL because of the BB revenues they bring to the conference. Louisville makes more money in BB than all but 20 schools do in football. I think you guys made a big mistake in passing up on UL.

I disagree, take Charlie Strong out of the picture (and that may happen very soon depending on some coaching moves) and UL is just another good basketball school with a sharp AD. No tv market, no football recruiting grounds and a not so great national brand. Don't get me wrong, I don't think they are garbage but I like the FL/OH teams for the football advantages better and football butters the bread these days.