AL Central Discussion

[Stakesarehigh]

Once I saw Skubal going for Tigers I actually wanted Guardians to lose.

Ultimately we can still clinch on the field tonight in front of the fans. But the technical clinch likely to come mid game when the Orioles steam roll them for revenge tonight.

despite limited starts Skubal has the 3rd best FIP in baseball the last 2 years combined.

If Detroit can't manage to have a very good rotation next year I fucking give up lol

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Worst part is, all he tries to do his hit homers.

To say hes failing is an understatement

 

[mr.hockey4242]

despite limited starts Skubal has the 3rd highest FIP in baseball the last 2 years combined.

If Detroit can't manage to have a very good rotation next year I fucking give up lol

Oh yeah Skubal is legit, hes just gotta stay healthy. Mise(again health) should at least be a solid 3 at minimum.

Olson carries the momentum and sign a FA(or keep Rodriguez) and Tigers are in business. Manning im still not a huge fan of but hes a great 5th guy.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Oh yeah Skubal is legit, hes just gotta stay healthy. Mise(again health) should at least be a solid 3 at minimum.

Olson carries the momentum and sign a FA(or keep Rodriguez) and Tigers are in business. Manning im still not a huge fan of but hes a great 5th guy.

Behind that is Flores, Madden, Jobe and this Gipson dude has had 2 great starts (added 2 new pitches this year)

Somewhere this has to come together. Jesus Christ.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Behind that is Flores, Madden, Jobe and this Gipson dude has had 2 great starts (added 2 new pitches this year)

Somewhere this has to come together. Jesus Christ.

Ive said it many times and its not just to troll Wiggy.

I think the Tigers are the much bigger threat to the Twins over the next 5 or so years.

All 3 teams have promising young players. But Guardians have 0 that have proven shit on the offensive side of things and I will always fear the team that could potentially get better at anytime with their wallet.

Who knows what type of swings the Tigers take in FA if they see an opening right away

 

[WiggyRuss]

Ive said it many times and its not just to troll Wiggy.

I think the Tigers are the much bigger threat to the Twins over the next 5 or so years.

All 3 teams have promising young players. But Guardians have 0 that have proven shit on the offensive side of things and I will always fear the team that could potentially get better at anytime with their wallet.

Who knows what type of swings the Tigers take in FA if they see an opening right away

Jose Ramirez is only 30 years old. He is not going anywhere. Josh Naylor is good. Gimenez and Kwan are both red hot right now- and in a "bad year" Gimenez is going to have a 5.0 WAR (according to ESPN), and about 15 homers and 30 steals when its all said and done.

Ramirez still has plenty left in the tank and there is no one on the Twins or Tigers that is a star level guy like him- at least not right now and not so sure anyone will get there anytime soon.

Tigers and Guardians both have pitching depth.....I would go with the Guardians though. Sonny Gray will almost assuredly finish top 3 in the AL Cy Young and he is gonzo once the Twins are eliminated and he will not be easy to replace- the Twins dont have nearly the depth of the Guardians or even Tigers pitching wise.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Beside Sal Perez- who could be dealt and or move off of catcher most of the time- Bo Naylor will definitely be the most valuable catcher in the AL Central next year.

 

[Picklerick 2.0]

Once I saw Skubal going for Tigers I actually wanted Guardians to lose.

Ultimately we can still clinch on the field tonight in front of the fans. But the technical clinch likely to come mid game when the Orioles steam roll them for revenge tonight.

Us clinching the division has been a fargone conclusion for over a week now. I just want to see them clinch on the field.

 

[WiggyRuss]

I mean- who are the Twins pitchers after Lopez if Gray leaves?

So- Lopez is your ace- a guy with an era that is typically about 3.5-4.0.......where he is this year....at 3.6

Joe Ryan is at 4.30 this year. He gets K's but?

Ober is 28- and got demoted at one point this year- he is your #3. Another ordinary guy who goes 5 or 6 innings with little to no upside. He actually hasnt even pitched into the 6th in his last 8 starts.

after that---???? Varland? a failed prospect who has been sent to the bullpen? HE is only 26- and maybe could be a weapon in the bullpen?

Paddack - who hasnt been much of anything since his rookie year in 2019?

Could re-sign Maeda I guess to be the #3 or #4--- he has lowered his ERA from 4.7 to 4.3 after a recent hot streak.

point is - Gray has given the Twins a HUGE season- is going to get paid---- Ryan and Ober both started great but have been very mediocre/bad since. From the start of the season till mid-June Ryan had a 2.90 ERA- his ERA is 5.79 since mid-June. Through mid-July Ober had an ERA under 3.0 as well- at 2.74. After mid-July- 5.52. Lopez strikes out a lot of guys and pitches a lot of innings but just really never seems to be able to pitche to "ace" level ERA over the course of a season.

Looks like both ran out of gas - or both had big corrections after hot starts.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Us clinching the division has been a fargone conclusion for over a week now. I just want to see them clinch on the field.

since August 1 when the Guardians waived the white flag really.

 

[Picklerick 2.0]

since August 1 when the Guardians waived the white flag really.

August first huh? Damn dude, you and the hyperbole are the closest of friends.

 

[VikingFan2k2]

Beside Sal Perez- who could be dealt and or move off of catcher most of the time- Bo Naylor will definitely be the most valuable catcher in the AL Central next year.

Bo is undoubtedly a great talent. But he does need to stay in shape. His brother put on significant weight, although you can probably chalk that up to his injury.

Either way, you can get away with a few extra pounds at first that you can't get away with at catcher.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Jose Ramirez is only 30 years old. He is not going anywhere. Josh Naylor is good. Gimenez and Kwan are both red hot right now- and in a "bad year" Gimenez is going to have a 5.0 WAR (according to ESPN), and about 15 homers and 30 steals when its all said and done.

Ramirez still has plenty left in the tank and there is no one on the Twins or Tigers that is a star level guy like him- at least not right now and not so sure anyone will get there anytime soon.

Tigers and Guardians both have pitching depth.....I would go with the Guardians though. Sonny Gray will almost assuredly finish top 3 in the AL Cy Young and he is gonzo once the Twins are eliminated and he will not be easy to replace- the Twins dont have nearly the depth of the Guardians or even Tigers pitching wise.

Ramirez just turned 31. So hes officially on the wrong side of 30. And while hes still very good and any team would take him. Hes also been declining overall.

And you cant use "bad year" for players like Gimenez because he hasnt proven shit. Ive already told you this he had an insane year last year but look at his current career that was actually the blatant outlier to this point.

And the Twins and Guardians pitching "depth" and options with FA is much closer than their lineups. Thats the Guardians issue they cannot hit. And they wont spend enough to add on lilke the Tigers and Twins will.

And you are already considerably worse

 

[mr.hockey4242]

I mean- who are the Twins pitchers after Lopez if Gray leaves?

So- Lopez is your ace- a guy with an era that is typically about 3.5-4.0.......where he is this year....at 3.6

Joe Ryan is at 4.30 this year. He gets K's but?

Ober is 28- and got demoted at one point this year- he is your #3. Another ordinary guy who goes 5 or 6 innings with little to no upside. He actually hasnt even pitched into the 6th in his last 8 starts.

after that---???? Varland? a failed prospect who has been sent to the bullpen? HE is only 26- and maybe could be a weapon in the bullpen?

Paddack - who hasnt been much of anything since his rookie year in 2019?

Could re-sign Maeda I guess to be the #3 or #4--- he has lowered his ERA from 4.7 to 4.3 after a recent hot streak.

point is - Gray has given the Twins a HUGE season- is going to get paid---- Ryan and Ober both started great but have been very mediocre/bad since. From the start of the season till mid-June Ryan had a 2.90 ERA- his ERA is 5.79 since mid-June. Through mid-July Ober had an ERA under 3.0 as well- at 2.74. After mid-July- 5.52. Lopez strikes out a lot of guys and pitches a lot of innings but just really never seems to be able to pitche to "ace" level ERA over the course of a season.

Looks like both ran out of gas - or both had big corrections after hot starts.

This is why you are so damn dense.

You ask what are the Twins going to do with pitching. When in reality you dont know what youre talking about.

1. How exactly are Pablo Lopez and Sonny Gray currently on our team? Same with Paddock and Maeda. You act like if Gray leaves the Twins are just gonna shrug their shoulders and only pitch 3 guys lmao.

2. Ober wasnt demoted. He was shut down. Made one quick ramp up start then came back. Also, Logan Allen is the king of not going deep into games so wtf are you talking about.

3. Varland also not a failed prospect or sent to the bullpen. He is currently pitching out of the Twins bullpen because they dont need starters and he can be a weapon out of there. Paddack might be joining as early as today int he same role. Does your mind allow you to think outside the box at all? Im actually curious.

4. Maeda recent hot streak? He has a 3.39 ERA since he returned from injury in june over 16 starts. He basically pitched hurt in one game in april, gave up 10 runs and sucked.

 

[VikingFan2k2]

I mean- who are the Twins pitchers after Lopez if Gray leaves?

So- Lopez is your ace- a guy with an era that is typically about 3.5-4.0.......where he is this year....at 3.6

Joe Ryan is at 4.30 this year. He gets K's but?

Ober is 28- and got demoted at one point this year- he is your #3. Another ordinary guy who goes 5 or 6 innings with little to no upside. He actually hasnt even pitched into the 6th in his last 8 starts.

after that---???? Varland? a failed prospect who has been sent to the bullpen? HE is only 26- and maybe could be a weapon in the bullpen?

Paddack - who hasnt been much of anything since his rookie year in 2019?

Could re-sign Maeda I guess to be the #3 or #4--- he has lowered his ERA from 4.7 to 4.3 after a recent hot streak.

point is - Gray has given the Twins a HUGE season- is going to get paid---- Ryan and Ober both started great but have been very mediocre/bad since. From the start of the season till mid-June Ryan had a 2.90 ERA- his ERA is 5.79 since mid-June. Through mid-July Ober had an ERA under 3.0 as well- at 2.74. After mid-July- 5.52. Lopez strikes out a lot of guys and pitches a lot of innings but just really never seems to be able to pitche to "ace" level ERA over the course of a season.

Looks like both ran out of gas - or both had big corrections after hot starts.

Joe Ryan struggled this year for an extended period because he hid an injury (he caught a lot of heat for that). It's why he got blasted for 6 HRs by the Braves.

Ober was sent down a couple of times, but he had never pitched that many innings, so fatigue is a factor, work load management.

Varland is not a failed prospect, we just didn't need him. We had Maeda who was pitching well and got some smoke and mirrors starts out of Keuchel. Worst case scenario Louie is a flame thrower out of the bullpen.

I do think that the Twins will have to sign a free agent starter, but with the way Sinclair/Bally's has fucked with the money so much (I believe Cleveland was in the same boat and they Welched on your TV contract too), it probably won't be a very good pitcher.

 

[Picklerick 2.0]

Ramirez just turned 31. So hes officially on the wrong side of 30. And while hes still very good and any team would take him. Hes also been declining overall.

And you cant use "bad year" for players like Gimenez because he hasnt proven shit. Ive already told you this he had an insane year last year but look at his current career that was actually the blatant outlier to this point.

And the Twins and Guardians pitching "depth" and options with FA is much closer than their lineups. Thats the Guardians issue they cannot hit. And they wont spend enough to add on lilke the Tigers and Twins will.

And you are already considerably worse

I have come to realize that with wiggyruss.....if it's a guardian, the guy is showing his potential, if it's another teams players the guy had an outlier year and we should expect a return to form.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

I have come to realize that with wiggyruss.....if it's a guardian, the guy is showing his potential, if it's another teams players the guy had an outlier year and we should expect a return to form.

Oh yeah, any Guardian is as good as their best year. Every other season is a fluke outlier. Twins players are unproven for life

 

[Picklerick 2.0]

Oh yeah, any Guardian is as good as their best year. Every other season is a fluke outlier. Twins players are unproven for life

I love the guy, I don't care how you feel, he provides "mostly" good discussion and entertainment. Just don't start comparing Cleveland players to anyone else and never question Cleveland players potential. He loses his damn mind worse than fightingfunbags when it comes to homer risk.

 

[fightinfunbags]

I love the guy, I don't care how you feel, he provides "mostly" good discussion and entertainment. Just don't start comparing Cleveland players to anyone else and never question Cleveland players potential. He loses his damn mind worse than fightingfunbags when it comes to homer risk.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Joe Ryan struggled this year for an extended period because he hid an injury (he caught a lot of heat for that). It's why he got blasted for 6 HRs by the Braves.

Ober was sent down a couple of times, but he had never pitched that many innings, so fatigue is a factor, work load management.

Varland is not a failed prospect, we just didn't need him. We had Maeda who was pitching well and got some smoke and mirrors starts out of Keuchel. Worst case scenario Louie is a flame thrower out of the bullpen.

I do think that the Twins will have to sign a free agent starter, but with the way Sinclair/Bally's has fucked with the money so much (I believe Cleveland was in the same boat and they Welched on your TV contract too), it probably won't be a very good pitcher.

Varland does throw hard- he would be a weapon in the pen- but you probably should keep him as a starter and see if he can figure it out.

Paddack is a wild card- he could be a good mid-back end rotation guy.

Ryan has good stuff- he just needs to put it together- he still has plenty of time too.

Ober is "young" experience wise- but the guy is 28 - and hes gigantic- he should be more than a 5 and fly guy or he wont be much better than a mid-back end guy.

Lopez has the talent to be a true ace but just has not put a full season of ace level work together- it very well could be next year- or not- we shall see. I cant wait to see Lopez in the playoffs and see if he rises to the occasion.