2015 Pirates

[thecrow124]

Why protect Pedro Florimon? He's 27, can't hit, not a great glove, and will be in Indy before June 1st.

Everything I have read says he has a good to better glove, but an outstanding arm, which means he can play any defensive spot on the infield. Since he will likely be the backup MI, the fact that he can't hit should matter very little.

 

[26 elroy face]

Everything I have read says he has a good to better glove, but an outstanding arm, which means he can play any defensive spot on the infield. Since he will likely be the backup MI, the fact that he can't hit should matter very little.

I remember him with Minnesota, and he didn't have a good glove then. Why protect him the minors are full of good gloves that can't hit. The Pirates got him off waivers that should say something.

 

[element1286]

I remember him with Minnesota, and he didn't have a good glove then. Why protect him the minors are full of good gloves that can't hit. The Pirates got him off waivers that should say something.

Probably that the Pirates value defense up the middle, I've never seen him play but the numbers say he is a very good ss. It's him or Barmes.

 

[element1286]

Pirates To Sign Radhames Liz To Major League Deal ? MLB Trade Rumors

Pirates scouts must know something no one else does, 2 years 3 million on a major league deal.

 

[Darkstone42]

Pirates To Sign Radhames Liz To Major League Deal ? MLB Trade Rumors

Pirates scouts must know something no one else does, 2 years 3 million on a major league deal.

He does throw really hard. Fits the NH mold. I figure he'll be a bullpen arm.

 

[steelparrot]

We seem to scour the planet looking for bullpen arms.

 

[thecrow124]

We seem to scour the planet looking for bullpen arms.

Not sure which one it is, but his manager in DR is from the Pirates organization, not much scouting involved there. Just a phone call saying, hey I got a guy that once was a top 100 prospect that is throwing 100mph. And $3 mil for 2 years of that is cheap.

 

[26 elroy face]

Probably that the Pirates value defense up the middle, I've never seen him play but the numbers say he is a very good ss. It's him or Barmes.

No, its probably that the Pirates value dollars over talent. The Pirates just protected a rare talent a career .204 hitter. A switch hitter that can't hit from either side. Money was only reason they protected this stiff.

 

[Darkstone42]

No, its probably that the Pirates value dollars over talent. The Pirates just protected a rare talent a career .204 hitter. A switch hitter that can't hit from either side. Money was only reason they protected this stiff.

I don't see how this could possibly be a money issue. They need a backup middle infielder. This guy is a backup middle infielder. Sure, he's cheap, but if there aren't appreciably better options out there, he saves us some money to fill a different need, one who will actually make regular contributions.

 

[Illinest]

The problem with saying that the pirates are saving money to address other positions, is that they have a history of not addressing those other positions.

 

[element1286]

No, its probably that the Pirates value dollars over talent. The Pirates just protected a rare talent a career .204 hitter. A switch hitter that can't hit from either side. Money was only reason they protected this stiff.

Money? What money did they save by protecting him?

 

[Illinest]

Liz sucks. He has always sucked. If the Pirates think they can fix him that's great, but why would they throw 3 million dollars at a guy who couldn't make it in the Majors OR Japan, and then release Ike Davis? Did they not want to pay Ike Davis 4.5 million? Well what about last year when we paid Ike Davis 3 million? Why are we losing a productive major leaguer just to save 1.5 million if we're turning right around and throwing that money at a guy who is proven NOT to be a major leaguer?

My arbitration numbers might not be exactly right, but the point is the same either way. That money could've been spent on a real major leaguer, but instead we've got another shitty project pitcher. They don't all work out. For every Liriano there's a Bedard or a McDonald.

I hate these cheap assholes.

 

[Darkstone42]

Liz sucks. He has always sucked. If the Pirates think they can fix him that's great, but why would they throw 3 million dollars at a guy who couldn't make it in the Majors OR Japan, and then release Ike Davis? Did they not want to pay Ike Davis 4.5 million? Well what about last year when we paid Ike Davis 3 million? Why are we losing a productive major leaguer just to save 1.5 million if we're turning right around and throwing that money at a guy who is proven NOT to be a major leaguer?

My arbitration numbers might not be exactly right, but the point is the same either way. That money could've been spent on a real major leaguer, but instead we've got another shitty project pitcher. They don't all work out. For every Liriano there's a Bedard or a McDonald.

I hate these cheap assholes.

Liz is a decent risk to take, and I imagine Ike was released because we plan on keeping Pedro. I would rather have Ike than Pedro, but maybe the front office sees more upside to Pedro (who will likely make as much as or more than Ike in arbitration) and/or like the flexibility he affords since he can also play third base if he gets his throwing back under control. Keeping both would have been redundant, both a waste of money and a waste of a roster spot, really.

 

[element1286]

2/3 million is a drop in the bucket, really doubt that will have any bearing on their other moves. The opportunity cost of a roster spot to Liz, who has a questionable at best track record, is the real issue, IMO.

 

[element1286]

And if they were gonna spend a few million on a reliever, would have rather seen them go after Ronald Belisario.

 

[element1286]

Liz sucks. He has always sucked. If the Pirates think they can fix him that's great, but why would they throw 3 million dollars at a guy who couldn't make it in the Majors OR Japan, and then release Ike Davis? Did they not want to pay Ike Davis 4.5 million? Well what about last year when we paid Ike Davis 3 million? Why are we losing a productive major leaguer just to save 1.5 million if we're turning right around and throwing that money at a guy who is proven NOT to be a major leaguer?

My arbitration numbers might not be exactly right, but the point is the same either way. That money could've been spent on a real major leaguer, but instead we've got another shitty project pitcher. They don't all work out. For every Liriano there's a Bedard or a McDonald.

I hate these cheap assholes.

How do you solve first base without making decisions and letting guys go? They obviously committed to Alvarez at first, really don't know if it will end up being the right decision but they can't keep 3 first base only players.

 

[steelparrot]

Teams have to 'save' roster spots, They end up protecting turds like Floriman and Elmore to try to sneak them through waivers as they add people in the offseason/end of spring training.

IF you flush the flotsam and jetsam and protect more people from the rule V draft, then the Rojas and Creasys of the world are the ones getting cut as you add free agents/NRIs later on in the offseason.

Its a balancing act for sure, we did get plundered by the brewers last year, but rule V guys sticking is rare.

 

[Illinest]

Alvarez has never had throwing issues like that before.
The correct answer was to keep Davis, release Gaby, keep Alvarez, play Alvarez at 3b about half the time. Harrison would still be able to play every day because he would play every game against lefties and then you can also very easily sit one of Alvarez, Walker or Davis every other day.

Now instead we've got Gaby Sanchez and no 3b depth unless alvarez secretly is still a 3b.

and it is funny how 3Mil/2 is a drop in the bucket when it comes to guys who have never been good before, but the same money in Davis's pocket is somehow "a waste of a roster spot".
You know who has always been a waste of a roster spot? Radhames Liz.

 

[element1286]

Alvarez has never had throwing issues like that before.
The correct answer was to keep Davis, release Gaby, keep Alvarez, play Alvarez at 3b about half the time. Harrison would still be able to play every day because he would play every game against lefties and then you can also very easily sit one of Alvarez, Walker or Davis every other day.

Now instead we've got Gaby Sanchez and no 3b depth unless alvarez secretly is still a 3b.

and it is funny how 3Mil/2 is a drop in the bucket when it comes to guys who have never been good before, but the same money in Davis's pocket is somehow "a waste of a roster spot".
You know who has always been a waste of a roster spot? Radhames Liz.

He's a waste of a roster spot if they are going to have Alvarez play first ahead of Ike. It has absolutely zero to do with money.

They obviously don't think Alvarez can make that throw anymore.

 

[sychmd]

i think the pirates think harrison can be their 3B and don't won't to move him around to be super sub. give him a home and hope you have repeat performances where he is the leadoff guy and spark with good d at 3B.
alvarez can be insurance for 3B, but give it to harrison.
then of davis and alvarez, pedro has way more potential. great glove (only one fielding error all last year which is unheard of and made some spectacular plays) erratic but strong arm that easily makes the difficult throws. if he pans out at 1B, great. if not, yes but can't hit LHP, then gaby. if he bombs, lets give lambo a shot. lambo would be as good as davis and a lot cheaper. then bell or tony sanchez in 2 years.

our OF, 2B, and SS are set so minimal substitution unless injury and we have snider for the OF and hopefully he found his groove finally.
so harrison at 3B then alvarez at 1B with lambo as plan B.