2015 Pirates

[Darkstone42]

From everything i have read, Shields is the clear #3, he might get Lester money anyway though, since he will be the last one to sign.

Scherzer's demands may make him last, honestly.

In any case, Ross Detweiler was dealt to the Rangers, which surprised me, so maybe there are still some arms out there on the trade market we aren't aware of.

Also, Tabata apparently has exactly no value in trades since he was available in the minor league Rule 5 and went unselected. I guess teams think his contract is that terrible, because he's a decently useful 4th outfielder.

 

[Illinest]

Yes, but your logic is technically incorrect, Pedro did not hire Boras to negotiate the deal since that would have made him ineligible to return to college. He used Boras as an advisor with the guarentee that he would retain him as his agent. Pedro purposely did not sign the contract before the deadline. He was being childish and has continued to do so into his professional career. Be it by coming into camp out of shape, refusing to play winter baseball, and what seems to be just general disinterest in working to improve his game. I do see room for a bounce back from what were rewarded with last season, but what I would feel more confident in predicting is that we is moping around all winter because the Pirates are moving him to first base and he doesn't want to move. I hope that I am wrong and he starts out hot and we are able to trade him, if we don't trade home before than, but that is probably just empty hope. Regardless, I have not liked him for a long time and I am not going to change my opinion now.

You think he's lazy, disinterested and childish? you think he refuses to improve his game?

He's one of the hardest working people on the team.
I dont remember which writers provided the comments for this so take it for hearsay if you'd like (i think it was kovacevic for one) but i've seen a few of the local writers talk about the "misperception" of alvarez. There is an acknowledgement that he seems to be stand-offish and/or disinterested, but that's always followed by a rebuttal which asserts that he is exceptionally studious, always takes extra BP swings, is always in the weight room, always listens to instruction, etc...

I think you've perceived him as being taciturn, when he's really just private and doesn't wear his heart on his sleeve. I do not question his work ethic or his character.

 

[element1286]

It's pretty common knowledge that Pedro is one of the hardest workers on the team, the narrative of fat, lazy Pedro has no basis in reality.

Everyone hated Adam Laroche too 'because he doesn't look like he cares' or some garbage like that.

 

[pixburgher66]

I saw Scherzer's name crop up amongst Cards rumors. To that I say, DEAR GOD NO.

 

[Darkstone42]

I saw Scherzer's name crop up amongst Cards rumors. To that I say, DEAR GOD NO.

Scherzer doesn't seem like a Cardinals signing...


...please?

 

[sychmd]

pedro has kept in good shape since the one off season.
he always seems to be humble and courteous.
never a hot head or arrogant.
scores more runs than he should batting at the bottom of the order with not much behind him.
seems to take the extra base well. even stole 8 in limited playing time this year. seems like alert and heads up on the bases. i see many pirates on bloopers for their baselining lapses including cutch, snider, marte, but have never seen alvarez.
he seems quiet, sensitive, and takes things to seriously and personal. that is his problem of getting down on himself.

he is a great fielder with a rocket arm. makes the hard throws, off balance charging one handers, but periodically airmails the easy out.

his plate patience and selectivity, especially on the junk is getting better, and he is being more aggressive earlier in the count, but it all started to fall apart when the throwing started snowballing.

i am hoping and an alvarez supporter. his success gives us an awesome lineup and a real WS shot. his failure doesn't ruin those chances, but the climb is much steeper with minimal room for others error.

 

[thecrow124]

You think he's lazy, disinterested and childish? you think he refuses to improve his game?

He's one of the hardest working people on the team.
I dont remember which writers provided the comments for this so take it for hearsay if you'd like (i think it was kovacevic for one) but i've seen a few of the local writers talk about the "misperception" of alvarez. There is an acknowledgement that he seems to be stand-offish and/or disinterested, but that's always followed by a rebuttal which asserts that he is exceptionally studious, always takes extra BP swings, is always in the weight room, always listens to instruction, etc...

I think you've perceived him as being taciturn, when he's really just private and doesn't wear his heart on his sleeve. I do not question his work ethic or his character.

It is fine, I am still not going to like him. I also do not believe much of what is written in the media, although in this case I will have to take it at face value.
That being said I find it humorous that you defend Pedro as though he is above being called out for his flaws, however you continue to bash ownership and management of the team. I am not sure you have been watching but the team has had more success during Pedro's time in uniform than Pedro has.

 

[Illinest]

It is fine, I am still not going to like him. I also do not believe much of what is written in the media, although in this case I will have to take it at face value.
That being said I find it humorous that you defend Pedro as though he is above being called out for his flaws, however you continue to bash ownership and management of the team. I am not sure you have been watching but the team has had more success during Pedro's time in uniform than Pedro has.

The team has had success mostly because of the contributions of McCutchen, Walker and Marte on the position player side, none of whom were acquired by Neal and Frank. So if I continue to bash the front office it's because they really haven't contributed all that much to the team's success. Alvarez is the best draft pick so far, and we know how much you like him. Mercer is okay. Cole might succeed Alvarez. Every other player is just a prospect so far.
They did sign Martin, but I gave them credit for the signing when they did that and I didn't shit on anyone when they decided not to pay enough to retain him. They also signed Liriano, and I did give them credit for retaining him.

So am I supposed to clap my hands for them because they drafted a few can't-miss prospects and made 2 good free agent adds in 7 years of work? I don't think there's any reason to believe that these guys are exceptionally good at their job. They're mediocre, which is my consistent position. Better than Dave Littlefield. Faint praise.

 

[Darkstone42]

Huntington also brought in Burnett and Morton, who have contributed positively, made some good fringe and depth acquisitions, like Worley and Snider, has consistently constructed good bullpens, and more deeply integrated analytics into game management and improved the coaching staff to get more out of the team than just the raw talent.

I think we're going to see some big improvements to the pitching staff this year and/or next as well thanks to NH. And maybe to the lineup, too, especially if Polanco and Bell pan out.

 

[Darkstone42]

Bubby Borden completes the trade for Rodriguez. That's a bit higher a price than I expected. Hard thrower with a good curve, apparently, but struggles with command. Pretty high upside to him.

But he's not close to the Majors, so the risk is still high, which I guess is why he was one of the PTBNL guys.

 

[thecrow124]

The team has had success mostly because of the contributions of McCutchen, Walker and Marte on the position player side, none of whom were acquired by Neal and Frank. So if I continue to bash the front office it's because they really haven't contributed all that much to the team's success. Alvarez is the best draft pick so far, and we know how much you like him. Mercer is okay. Cole might succeed Alvarez. Every other player is just a prospect so far.
They did sign Martin, but I gave them credit for the signing when they did that and I didn't shit on anyone when they decided not to pay enough to retain him. They also signed Liriano, and I did give them credit for retaining him.

So am I supposed to clap my hands for them because they drafted a few can't-miss prospects and made 2 good free agent adds in 7 years of work? I don't think there's any reason to believe that these guys are exceptionally good at their job. They're mediocre, which is my consistent position. Better than Dave Littlefield. Faint praise.

They have made the playoffs the last two years and were in the race the two years prior to that before fading. That is what they deserve credit for, I could care less about the how. They came in with a plan and regardless of anything else, they stuck to that plan and it is now paying off. I do not believe that we will continue making the playoffs every year, but they have set this organization up to have a long run of contention for the playoffs. That is not to say that they don't have their faults, I am sure that just like anything else there a learning curve. I would also like to say that I do not believe that we will ever win a World Series with this particular management team, but that has a lot more to do with the current way that major league baseball is ran than how our team is ran.

Back to Pedro, what exactly am I missing? That question is for anyone that continues to defend him. He has had two seasons where he was slightly above average, but has yet to show that he was deserving of the #2 pick in the draft. I am not even sure that he has shown enough to be handed the first base job, and considering the alternative, that is not good.

 

[pixburgher66]

They have made the playoffs the last two years and were in the race the two years prior to that before fading. That is what they deserve credit for, I could care less about the how. They came in with a plan and regardless of anything else, they stuck to that plan and it is now paying off. I do not believe that we will continue making the playoffs every year, but they have set this organization up to have a long run of contention for the playoffs. That is not to say that they don't have their faults, I am sure that just like anything else there a learning curve. I would also like to say that I do not believe that we will ever win a World Series with this particular management team, but that has a lot more to do with the current way that major league baseball is ran than how our team is ran.

Back to Pedro, what exactly am I missing? That question is for anyone that continues to defend him. He has had two seasons where he was slightly above average, but has yet to show that he was deserving of the #2 pick in the draft. I am not even sure that he has shown enough to be handed the first base job, and considering the alternative, that is not good.

I'm fine with you criticizing his performance, it's pretty much valid, but when you got on his character you lost me. He's a quiet, reserved guy; doesn't get in trouble, doesn't cause waves, works hard, etc. Going back to the contract dispute is a pretty weak argument about the guy's character.

 

[Darkstone42]

The Liriano and Liz contracts are official now. Liz has only been signed for one year, though, not two like previously reported. Not sure about money, but I imagine it'll be around $1.5 million.

The Rodriguez deal is also official.

 

[Darkstone42]

I suspect the asking price on Hamels is going to start dropping soon, and we should get in on it. Teams seem to be addressing their needs through other venues so far.

Another pitcher I'd be inquiring on is Scott Kazmir, even though the A's say he's not available. At least ask and see what kind of package it would take.

 

[Illinest]

The front office gets all of the credit they've earned. Which is to say not much.

Any idiot could've drafted Pedro, and there were a few other excellent choices in that draft including Posey.
Any idiot could've drafted Cole, and I preferred Rendon who seems to be working out as well.
Aside from those two high draft picks the drafts have been kind of bad. Lots of high picks that aren't working out (Tony Sanchez in particular) and not too many late picks having success. There's a few guys here and there - Mercer for one - but not as many as there ought to be.

I give them all the credit they deserve for fucking up with Sano.
I give them all the credit they deserve for failing to sign a good starter last offseason. We could've avoided the wild card game debacle against bumgarner if we had simply won the division. A few games made a big difference.

But mostly I just don't buy into the idea that just because McCutchen carried a team to the playoffs, I need to appreciate the front office. We didn't get good because of Neal and friends. We got good when McCutchen got good. If I have to give anyone credit for the past two seasons it's going to McCutchen.

 

[Darkstone42]

Morton thinks he'll be ready by opening day. That would be nice.

I still want a #3 for the rotation, though. Chuck and AJ as a 4/5, backed up by Worley, Locke, and Cumpton would be really nice. Or we could use Morton, Worley, Locke, and/or Cumpton in trades to either acquire that #3 or to find another bat.

 

[26 elroy face]

pedro has kept in good shape since the one off season.
he always seems to be humble and courteous.
never a hot head or arrogant.
scores more runs than he should batting at the bottom of the order with not much behind him.
seems to take the extra base well. even stole 8 in limited playing time this year. seems like alert and heads up on the bases. i see many pirates on bloopers for their baselining lapses including cutch, snider, marte, but have never seen alvarez.
he seems quiet, sensitive, and takes things to seriously and personal. that is his problem of getting down on himself.

he is a great fielder with a rocket arm. makes the hard throws, off balance charging one handers, but periodically airmails the easy out.

his plate patience and selectivity, especially on the junk is getting better, and he is being more aggressive earlier in the count, but it all started to fall apart when the throwing started snowballing.

i am hoping and an alvarez supporter. his success gives us an awesome lineup and a real WS shot. his failure doesn't ruin those chances, but the climb is much steeper with minimal room for others error.

You had me going me, but when you said he was a fine fielder you lost me.

 

[sychmd]

You had me going me, but when you said he was a fine fielder you lost me.

he is a fine fielder. He only made one fielding error last year while making many very difficult plays. Same trend in 2013 as well.
He also makes many difficult throws that some 3B don't make.
consistency on the routine throws has been his downfall the last 2 years.

don't make the mistake of looking at his gross number of errors and assume he can't field. just watch the tape and look into the numbers.

 

[pixburgher66]

Morton thinks he'll be ready by opening day. That would be nice.

I still want a #3 for the rotation, though. Chuck and AJ as a 4/5, backed up by Worley, Locke, and Cumpton would be really nice. Or we could use Morton, Worley, Locke, and/or Cumpton in trades to either acquire that #3 or to find another bat.

Same here. Just a 3/4 guy. If Chuck ends up as the #5, that's a great rotation. There are a lot of great options out there. That said, I have a feeling they may be done. The payroll is up around $87-90M.

 

[Darkstone42]

You had me going me, but when you said he was a fine fielder you lost me.

When his arm is under control, like it was two years ago, he actually is one of the best defensive third basemen in the National League. His range and hands are excellent.