2015 Pirates

[element1286]

Eovaldi or H Alvarez, would be fine with either one.

 

[Darkstone42]

Yeah, looking at them both, Eovaldi's decent at getting ground balls, Alvarez is excellent at it, and both would benefit in run prevention from the Pirates' defense. Eovaldi strikes more guys out, but not a ton, and Alvarez has better control. Eovaldi also appears to have the makings of an innings-eater, and Alvarez seems to be capable of it down the road.

Both would slot in nicely as our #3, I think.

 

[Darkstone42]

Getting either, I think, makes one or two of Morton, Locke, Kingham, Cumpton, and Worley expendable, as well. A league average pitcher like Morton or Worley, or a back-end starter like Locke, Cumpton, or Kingham with average upside could probably net a decent bat in this trade market if packaged properly. So if we do pull the trigger on an Alvarez for Eovaldi/Alvarez deal, I would imagine it would set up some deal involving our slew of #5 starters for a new 1B.

 

[element1286]

Well usually when you hear specific names like that the deal is either going to happen soon or never. Apparently the Marlins really want to move Eovaldi, and they are looking at Morneau as well, so I'm guessing it's sooner rather than later.

But yeah, I've been a big fan of Eovaldi for a while, the pure stuff is better than Alvarez's.

 

[Darkstone42]

Ervin Santana to the Twins, 4 years, $54 million. Fair deal, I think. Good signing for Minnesota.

 

[Darkstone42]

Well usually when you hear specific names like that the deal is either going to happen soon or never. Apparently the Marlins really want to move Eovaldi, and they are looking at Morneau as well, so I'm guessing it's sooner rather than later.

But yeah, I've been a big fan of Eovaldi for a while, the pure stuff is better than Alvarez's.

I'm a lot more familiar with Alvarez than Eovaldi, but I really like Alvarez's stuff, so to me, that's a pretty good endorsement of Eovaldi.

I'll be pretty pleased if that deal goes through. We'll still have chips to deal to replace Pedro, and our internal solutions don't totally suck, either.

 

[Darkstone42]

Just looked up Eovaldi's Pitchf/x info. I didn't realize how hard he throws, or how much his fastball moves. I think Searage would enjoy working with that...

 

[thedddd]

Pirates lost this guy also in the minor league rule 5:
Luis Urena Minor League Statistics & History | Baseball-Reference.com

I guess he is an OF turned pitcher?

 

[Darkstone42]

Pirates lost this guy also in the minor league rule 5:
Luis Urena Minor League Statistics & History | Baseball-Reference.com

I guess he is an OF turned pitcher?

Yup, but I think the Rays want to try him out again as an outfielder.

 

[element1286]

Bill Brink ruins the fun.

 

[Darkstone42]

Well, darn.

 

[Darkstone42]

I wonder which team nixed the deal, though...

 

[thecrow124]

Yeah those are pretty good comps, but you don't seem to realize that you're comparing Alvarez to successful hitters. That's the problem. The recent past (steroids era) was filled with guys who had video-game numbers. The 80s and the present day has guys like Alvarez and Deer. Look again at Alvarez's stats in 2014. That's what a successful hitter looks like.
Your comps don't even tell the story you'd like to believe. Each of those guys had at least one productive season in their 30s. Pagliarulo btw hit most of his homeruns in Yankee stadium and is in no way a good comp to Alvarez, who is an actual power hitter. Incaviglia missed his age 31 season and his age 30 season was a partial due to injury. Every other year between age 28 and 32 he was an above average hitter. He and Deer both accumulated more than 200 HRs apiece.

And your main reason for hating Pedro is the strikeouts is it not? He cut 5% off of his rate last year, and boosted his walk rate. He changed his approach and it resulted in better peripherals but his ISO (isolated power) suffered. That's not surprising at all if you consider the circumstances.

Wait a while. See what develops if you give him some time to settle in and get comfortable. I'm betting that he'll start to drive the ball again, and if he can combine his old HR rates with the new K rates and BB rates then your comps will look silly.

The main reason inmate Pedro is the way he and his advisor handled negotiating their initial contract with the Pirates. The fact that he has been no better than an average baseball player for his career only serves to make me despise him even more. It has little to nothing to do with his strike outs.

Personally, if he hits .300/.380/.550 I am still not going to like him, and if he hits like that next year it would only piss me off worse.

 

[Illinest]

The main reason inmate Pedro is the way he and his advisor handled negotiating their initial contract with the Pirates. The fact that he has been no better than an average baseball player for his career only serves to make me despise him even more. It has little to nothing to do with his strike outs.

Personally, if he hits .300/.380/.550 I am still not going to like him, and if he hits like that next year it would only piss me off worse.

You hate Pedro Alvarez because of the initial signing? How is that even Pedro's fault?

Alvarez signed an agent to negotiate contracts. He's not responsible for what happened. If you want to hate Boras then that's sort-of understandable. There's lots of people who hate Boras. If you want to hate Neil for being a cheapskate then you know I'm on-board with that.

But Alvarez didn't negotiate that contract. The only thing Alvarez MIGHT have done is to agree to lower his asking price.
There was some speculation that the contract fiasco was engineered by Boras and that it was a part of his attempts to question the legality of the contract deadline. I don't think that was ever confirmed, but if you're looking for a storyline I think that makes a lot more sense than the "Pedro Alvarez is a dickhead" story that you seem to be implying.

 

[steelparrot]

Pedro hasnt been great, but he has been okay. Plus, he has major breakout potential.

 

[Darkstone42]

I can get on board with the current lineup, but I'm not sure I'm satisfied with the starting rotation just yet. If trading Alvarez and replacing him in another move can allow us to add a legitimate #3, then I think we should do it.

Also, I haven't really heard anything on Shields. Anyone know what's going on with him? Or will his market be set by Scherzer?

 

[Darkstone42]

Never mind. San Francisco is in on Shields. They'll likely pay him handsome funds having not landed Lester or McCarthy, and likely being out on Scherzer.

 

[thecrow124]

You hate Pedro Alvarez because of the initial signing? How is that even Pedro's fault?

Alvarez signed an agent to negotiate contracts. He's not responsible for what happened. If you want to hate Boras then that's sort-of understandable. There's lots of people who hate Boras. If you want to hate Neil for being a cheapskate then you know I'm on-board with that.

But Alvarez didn't negotiate that contract. The only thing Alvarez MIGHT have done is to agree to lower his asking price.
There was some speculation that the contract fiasco was engineered by Boras and that it was a part of his attempts to question the legality of the contract deadline. I don't think that was ever confirmed, but if you're looking for a storyline I think that makes a lot more sense than the "Pedro Alvarez is a dickhead" story that you seem to be implying.

Yes, but your logic is technically incorrect, Pedro did not hire Boras to negotiate the deal since that would have made him ineligible to return to college. He used Boras as an advisor with the guarentee that he would retain him as his agent. Pedro purposely did not sign the contract before the deadline. He was being childish and has continued to do so into his professional career. Be it by coming into camp out of shape, refusing to play winter baseball, and what seems to be just general disinterest in working to improve his game. I do see room for a bounce back from what were rewarded with last season, but what I would feel more confident in predicting is that we is moping around all winter because the Pirates are moving him to first base and he doesn't want to move. I hope that I am wrong and he starts out hot and we are able to trade him, if we don't trade home before than, but that is probably just empty hope. Regardless, I have not liked him for a long time and I am not going to change my opinion now.

 

[steelparrot]

I can get on board with the current lineup, but I'm not sure I'm satisfied with the starting rotation just yet. If trading Alvarez and replacing him in another move can allow us to add a legitimate #3, then I think we should do it.

Also, I haven't really heard anything on Shields. Anyone know what's going on with him? Or will his market be set by Scherzer?

From everything i have read, Shields is the clear #3, he might get Lester money anyway though, since he will be the last one to sign.

 

[steelparrot]

Dan O'Dowd just called Cervelli a young Russel Martin on mlbtv.