2014 Offseason Plans Thread Pt2

[TDs3nOut]

BTW, reports coming in that tanaka is gonna cost AT LEAST 17 mil a year if not more. That is absurd. Absolutely outrageous. King felix and verlander are making like 20 next year. This guy, who has never pitched in the mlb before and isnt even projected to be an ace, and not even, by most reports, to be above a 3, is gonna get close to their money? That's why he's a bad idea

Several posters have posted similar remarks, but everything I've read, including the articles that I posted yesterday, suggest that he would be expected to become the best starter on some staffs. Hard to imagine that a team is going to spend over $100 million to try and upgrade their third starter.

 

[scotsman1948]

JD is the one who said that it was at about 130-135 right now, but if its at 120 then why wouldn't we make another move? We could get morales in that range no problem. If we're all in this year then lets freakin be all in.

well i could be wrong but Fielder(24M), Beltre(17M), Choo(14m), Rios(13m) & Darvish(10M) adds up to 78M. Andrus, Soto, Martin, Holland, Harrison & Perez adds up to 18.125M. that's 105.925M. throw in Profar, Moreland, Rosales, Arencibia, E. Beltre, Soria, Feliz, Ogando, Ross, Cotts and Scheppers and you're talking approximately another 12.7M.

that totals 118.625M.

of course that is missing a 5th starter & a bench player/DH. you don't count any minor league signings like Lewis or any of the others unless they make the final roster

 

[jamesx122]

You are off. He's going to be a number 2 and a Greinke type deal is warranted. Aces should be getting 200MM deals and we will see how much that market is when Kershaw signs.

I scoff at anyone saying he's not even a three....that's ridiculous.

Remember Tim Lincecum's contract...he's making 17 a year. Mark Buehrle is making 18 million this year and Tanaka should easily out perform both of those guys. I would have zero issues with Texas offering 7 years 120 for Tanaka.

He's got the ceiling of a #2 pitcher because of his good secondary offerings, but right now I'll be cautious due to his flat fastball and think he's most likely going to be a #3 at the least. That being said I totally agree with you that 17 million isn't an overpay at all, even if he only ends up being a younger version of Hiroki Kuroda (both have good splitters, but not an overpowering fastball) that's at least a 3 win player which is worth around 17 million now and I think he'll do better than 3 wins per season.

Just tell him to keep his fastball low and not in the middle of the zone and he'll do fine.

 

[RevSader]

He's got the ceiling of a #2 pitcher because of his good secondary offerings, but right now I'll be cautious due to his flat fastball and think he's most likely going to be a #3 at the least. That being said I totally agree with you that 17 million isn't an overpay at all, even if he only ends up being a younger version of Hiroki Kuroda (both have good splitters, but not an overpowering fastball) that's at least a 3 win player which is worth around 17 million now and I think he'll do better than 3 wins per season.

Just tell him to keep his fastball low and not in the middle of the zone and he'll do fine.

I should say number 2 is his ceiling and it might take a couple of seasons to fully reach that, but 17 million a year for what he will likely produce in those first two seasons is crazy worth it. He will probably put up at a couple of 4 win seasons in there as well. It also will depend on where he ends up pitching. He would make more money in NY, but that's a horrible spot for RHPs.

 

[scotsman1948]

I should say number 2 is his ceiling and it might take a couple of seasons to fully reach that, but 17 million a year for what he will likely produce in those first two seasons is crazy worth it. He will probably put up at a couple of 4 win seasons in there as well. It also will depend on where he ends up pitching. He would make more money in NY, but that's a horrible spot for RHPs.

i would not go more than 5 years 75-80M

 

[RevSader]

i would not go more than 5 years 75-80M

Well that is not happening.

 

[scotsman1948]

Well that is not happening.

i know the Yankees are desperate and probably go 6 years 125+M

 

[scotsman1948]

on the subject of Closer:

Neftali Feliz is the favorite to close for t - 12-28-2013

 

[jamesx122]

i know the Yankees are desperate and probably go 6 years 125+M

That's the one thing that makes me think we're not going to get Tanaka, the Yankees rotation right now is in desperate need of help if they plan on contending. Santana would get destroyed if he tried pitching in their park, Garza is okay but probably not who they want, and Jiminez is inconsistent as hell.

They're going to go all in on him because they need him.

 

[scotsman1948]

That's the one thing that makes me think we're not going to get Tanaka, the Yankees rotation right now is in desperate need of help if they plan on contending. Santana would get destroyed if he tried pitching in their park, Garza is okay but probably not who they want, and Jiminez is inconsistent as hell.

They're going to go all in on him because they need him.

probably but there's no guarantee that Tanaka wants to go there

 

[terpsfball09]

You are off. He's going to be a number 2 and a Greinke type deal is warranted. Aces should be getting 200MM deals and we will see how much that market is when Kershaw signs.

I scoff at anyone saying he's not even a three....that's ridiculous.

Remember Tim Lincecum's contract...he's making 17 a year. Mark Buehrle is making 18 million this year and Tanaka should easily out perform both of those guys. I would have zero issues with Texas offering 7 years 120 for Tanaka.

What are you basing him being a 2 off of exactly, his stuff? The minority of scouting reports that say he could be as good as the best #2 pitcher in the NL? You want to give this guy 17 million a year after he hasn't thrown one big league inning? The dude will allow 2 bombs a game at RBIA. He throws a lower 90's fastball on an even plane with absolutely no movement. He isn't facing japanese slap groundball hitters anymore. He's facing huge dominican hitters that actually follow through with their swings and use steroids. He won't be nearly as good as greinke.

 

[terpsfball09]

I can't believe you said that a greinke type deal is warranted for this guy. I'm sorry, but there is no way in hell I would do that. Everyone thought that even what greinke got was more than he was worth.

 

[jamesx122]

I can't believe you said that a greinke type deal is warranted for this guy. I'm sorry, but there is no way in hell I would do that. Everyone thought that even what greinke got was more than he was worth.

Greinke is making 25 million a year, but he actually has ace caliber stuff and has put up seasons like that before which is why I also don't think Tanaka deserves that type of money but 17 million isn't that much for a #3 pitcher.

And yes terps his secondary stuff is worth of making him a #2 pitcher, his splitter is really good and he does have an above average slider to complement it. Like you have pointed out his fastball is flat which is why I said he'd probably be a mid rotation starter when he comes to the MLB, but I feel like you're way overblowing it by saying he'd allow 2 bombs if he came here. He will have to be careful about not leaving his fastball up and work on keeping it low but I don't think his fastball is going to be the death of him.

 

[jamesx122]

What are you basing him being a 2 off of exactly, his stuff? The minority of scouting reports that say he could be as good as the best #2 pitcher in the NL? You want to give this guy 17 million a year after he hasn't thrown one big league inning? The dude will allow 2 bombs a game at RBIA. He throws a lower 90's fastball on an even plane with absolutely no movement. He isn't facing japanese slap groundball hitters anymore. He's facing huge dominican hitters that actually follow through with their swings and use steroids. He won't be nearly as good as greinke.

I wasn't aware that now only dominicans played in the MLB... somebody better tell that to Cabrera and Trout.

 

[RevSader]

What are you basing him being a 2 off of exactly, his stuff? The minority of scouting reports that say he could be as good as the best #2 pitcher in the NL? You want to give this guy 17 million a year after he hasn't thrown one big league inning? The dude will allow 2 bombs a game at RBIA. He throws a lower 90's fastball on an even plane with absolutely no movement. He isn't facing japanese slap groundball hitters anymore. He's facing huge dominican hitters that actually follow through with their swings and use steroids. He won't be nearly as good as greinke.

I would pay him 7/120+ easily.

I think you forget how cheaply Yu ended up being for Texas and he never threw a pitch in Texas. If the posting fee were only 20MM for Darvish, I can promise you his deal would have blown 6/60 out of the water. I cannot imagine the kind of cash Yu would get if he hit the open market today. Pitching is a premium and Tanaka is going to get a big deal and he's going to be worth every penny of it. You are being short sighted and time will prove you wrong.

 

[RevSader]

I can't believe you said that a greinke type deal is warranted for this guy. I'm sorry, but there is no way in hell I would do that. Everyone thought that even what greinke got was more than he was worth.

If he doesn't get something in the neighborhood of 6 or 7 years at more than 120 million I will be shocked. This is not about worth. It's about investing in a young rotation for the long haul. Contenders will always pay more for talent and if Texas wants to contend then making a serious offer to Tanaka is prudent.

 

[jta4437]

If he doesn't get something in the neighborhood of 6 or 7 years at more than 120 million I will be shocked. This is not about worth. It's about investing in a young rotation for the long haul. Contenders will always pay more for talent and if Texas wants to contend then making a serious offer to Tanaka is prudent.

I disagree about Tanaka on both worth and cost, and I'll leave it at that

We've obviously made up our minds one way or the other

That said, I think he would improve the rotation and eliminate a question mark

 

[donaldson79]

If he doesn't get something in the neighborhood of 6 or 7 years at more than 120 million I will be shocked. This is not about worth. It's about investing in a young rotation for the long haul. Contenders will always pay more for talent and if Texas wants to contend then making a serious offer to Tanaka is prudent.

In the financial world of professional baseball today, I don't even know the definition of worth. I mean, the amount of money which is available to these guys is mind boggling to me.

So I guess he's worth whatever someone will pay him.

 

[donaldson79]

I disagree about Tanaka on both worth and cost, and I'll leave it at that

We've obviously made up our minds one way or the other

That said, I think he would improve the rotation and eliminate a question mark

I don't know if this was media speculation or not, but a few weeks ago the buzz was, if the Rangers get Tanaka, then they'd move someone like Holland for a big bat/COF.

 

[RevSader]

In the financial world of professional baseball today, I don't even know the definition of worth. I mean, the amount of money which is available to these guys is mind boggling to me.

So I guess he's worth whatever someone will pay him.

Cost and worth are not the same different and hardly ever match in the end. Worth gets really muddied...Consider MY. His worth was said to be derived from his leadership and intangibles. It's impossible to quantify intangibles so it's hard to prove or disprove such assertions.