World Cup of Hockey returns in 2016

[sabresfaninthesouth]

I really don't want to bring politics into this, but I love the irony of this story coming out on the same day when over 100 new people from all over the world are granted Canadian citizenship in Ottawa. Meanwhile, the country where the ESPN world headquarters are located has two people seeking the presidency that are both talking about extreme vetting of immigrants and one wants to build a wall. But I digress...

I didn't read the article (and I don't plan to based on some of the comments I've read), but does it mention the cost of playing hockey? It's why I stopped playing and turned to basketball as I grew up in a family of five kids where my dad was the sole wage earner. Hockey was just too damn expensive for my dad and basketball was essentially free, so it was a no-brainer. I think some good work has been done to try to be more inclusive to everyone regardless of race etc. to play the game of hockey, but if you don't have the cash, it makes it difficult.

Which is the exact reason that basketball became the preferred sport in inner cities and why soccer has dominated the 2nd and 3rd world (and Europoe obviously) for years now. You need one ball and something to use as a goal. A trash bin, milk basket, etc. for basketball and even just two lines on the ground for soccer.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

so is the article saying hockey is lily white?

the writer of that should come to my sons practice and tell me hockey is a white persons sport

diversity is coming fast ... just a matter of generational cultural assimilation

 

[BGDave]

so is the article saying hockey is lily white?

the writer of that should come to my sons practice and tell me hockey is a white persons sport

diversity is coming fast ... just a matter of generational cultural assimilation

Yep. Just one example

Punjabi 'Hockey Night' Host Is A Hero In Pittsburgh

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Yeah, but realistically it's only been in the last couple decades that hockey could be reasonably played outside of cold countries which, not coincidentally, are also generally the whitest.

It's basically the story of Cool Runnings but on a different type of ice.

25% of Canadians are visible minorities. If someone gets me that list of highest hockey participation rates by state and then looks up the visible minority population of those states I'm sure it'll be close to or higher than Canada's.

Given that 83% of NHLers are from North America, it's a pitiful picture.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

I really don't want to bring politics into this, but I love the irony of this story coming out on the same day when over 100 new people from all over the world are granted Canadian citizenship in Ottawa. Meanwhile, the country where the ESPN world headquarters are located has two people seeking the presidency that are both talking about extreme vetting of immigrants and one wants to build a wall. But I digress...

I didn't read the article (and I don't plan to based on some of the comments I've read), but does it mention the cost of playing hockey? It's why I stopped playing and turned to basketball as I grew up in a family of five kids where my dad was the sole wage earner. Hockey was just too damn expensive for my dad and basketball was essentially free, so it was a no-brainer. I think some good work has been done to try to be more inclusive to everyone regardless of race etc. to play the game of hockey, but if you don't have the cash, it makes it difficult.

This is so much more what the focus should be, and fuck ESPN for trying to make it more about a ditty than actual cause & effect.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

Yep. Just one example

i think its an example being repeated in many rinks and minor hockey associations around canada ... granted, more so in urban/suburban ones

you have people of different ethnicities who were born in canada in the 70's/80's (who are the sons/daughters of immigrants) that wanted to play the sport growing up but could only follow it because their parents didnt have the money or didnt deem hockey important when getting ahead in life through hard work was their main focus in life

And now those people have kids of their own ... and they have money

the barrier to entry isnt skin colour ... its as dash noted: money

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

the barrier to entry isnt skin colour ... its as dash noted: money

Poorer people tend to be people of colour, especially in regions of the United States where hockey actually has a foothold and would benefit immensely from an influx of minority participants and fans.

 

[esls79]

i think its an example being repeated in many rinks and minor hockey associations around canada ... granted, more so in urban/suburban ones

you have people of different ethnicities who were born in canada in the 70's/80's (who are the sons/daughters of immigrants) that wanted to play the sport growing up but could only follow it because their parents didnt have the money or didnt deem hockey important when getting ahead in life through hard work was their main focus in life

And now those people have kids of their own ... and they have money

the barrier to entry isnt skin colour ... its as dash noted: money

See, that's the real reason all the Chinese money is being parked in Vancouver and Toronto - they really want to get good at hockey and the real estate gains are just icing on the cake.

Just wait another decade or two, the Chinese will knock the US out of the World Cup of Hockey

 

[jstewismybastardson]

Poorer people tend to be people of colour, especially in regions of the United States where hockey actually has a foothold and would benefit immensely from an influx of minority participants and fans.

Im just coming at it from a canadian perspective ... i think it will be interesting to see if people will still be saying hockey lacks diversity in 10 to 15 years when there will be more Asian and Indo Canadians in the league

 

[jstewismybastardson]

See, that's the real reason all the Chinese money is being parked in Vancouver and Toronto - they really want to get good at hockey and the real estate gains are just icing on the cake.

Just wait another decade or two, the Chinese will knock the US out of the World Cup of Hockey

When my son did the first shift program from March to June, there were 2 7 year old kids from China in the program ... THEY CAME HERE FROM CHINA JUST TO DO AN INTRO TO HOCKEY PROGRAM lol




/but Im sure while they were here, both the 7 year olds became proud new home owners in Vancouver, they both probably paid cash too

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Im just coming at it from a canadian perspective ... i think it will be interesting to see if people will still be saying hockey lacks diversity in 10 to 15 years when there will be more Asian and Indo Canadians in the league

And I do agree, especially in Canada with the incredibly diverse populations in our major cities I think you'll see a lot more names Don Cherry will butcher as he enters his 70th season of HNIC.

I don't think there are any wrong answers or posts here - hockey is a very complicated game both practically and logistically and as such it is a much tougher task for it to grow period than other sports.

 

[thedddd]

I really don't want to bring politics into this, but I love the irony of this story coming out on the same day when over 100 new people from all over the world are granted Canadian citizenship in Ottawa. Meanwhile, the country where the ESPN world headquarters are located has two people seeking the presidency that are both talking about extreme vetting of immigrants and one wants to build a wall. But I digress...

I didn't read the article (and I don't plan to based on some of the comments I've read), but does it mention the cost of playing hockey? It's why I stopped playing and turned to basketball as I grew up in a family of five kids where my dad was the sole wage earner. Hockey was just too damn expensive for my dad and basketball was essentially free, so it was a no-brainer. I think some good work has been done to try to be more inclusive to everyone regardless of race etc. to play the game of hockey, but if you don't have the cash, it makes it difficult.

Yeah trust me I wasn't trying to be political either.

It was strictly a baited article based on standing or sitting during the national anthem. They also brought up the fact that Byfuglien was a healthy scratch the one game and trying to bring race into it.

There was zero facts about demographics and who has the availability to hockey. It was strictkly click bait with no real merit.

 

[sabresfaninthesouth]

25% of Canadians are visible minorities. If someone gets me that list of highest hockey participation rates by state and then looks up the visible minority population of those states I'm sure it'll be close to or higher than Canada's.

Given that 83% of NHLers are from North America, it's a pitiful picture.

Yes, but that % of visible minorities has gone up from 11% in 1996. As that minority population grows and - as jstew said - subsequent generations take up playing hockey, you'll start to see a shift in the demographics of the NHL.

Go back 25 years and you got even fewer guys with names like Gomez, Setoguchi, Torres, Park, etc. Not to mention that there are definitely more black and/or bi-racial players in the NHL now than ever before.

Progress perhaps has not been as fast as we (Darren Pang included) would like or expect, but it is certainly headed in that direction.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Yes, but that % of visible minorities has gone up from 11% in 1996. As that minority population grows and - as jstew said - subsequent generations take up playing hockey, you'll start to see a shift in the demographics of the NHL.

Go back 25 years and you got even fewer guys with names like Gomez, Setoguchi, Torres, Park, etc. Not to mention that there are definitely more black and/or bi-racial players in the NHL now than ever before.

Progress perhaps has not been as fast as we (Darren Pang included) would like or expect, but it is certainly headed in that direction.

Wouldn't say "certainly". As I said, cost issues still exist and the lure of other sports is always strong.

It has grown from a drip to a trickle, and that's good, but to go from a trickle to a steady stream is a tough task.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

Yes, but that % of visible minorities has gone up from 11% in 1996. As that minority population grows and - as jstew said - subsequent generations take up playing hockey, you'll start to see a shift in the demographics of the NHL.

Go back 25 years and you got even fewer guys with names like Gomez, Setoguchi, Torres, Park, etc. Not to mention that there are definitely more black and/or bi-racial players in the NHL now than ever before.

Progress perhaps has not been as fast as we (Darren Pang included) would like or expect, but it is certainly headed in that direction.

I reckon that in 15 years, the NHL could be the most diverse pro sport in NA. Amazing the ripple effect that just one guy can make

these twins in my sons league age group wear Matt Dumba jerseys to practice ... at first i was like thats kinda dumb(-a - hehe) ... why would their dad buy them a Matt Dumba jersey but theyre Filipino ... they have a hero

 

[pixburgher66]

The funny thing about the whole Quick/Schneider talk is that (far as I can tell) we haven't mentioned that Bishop was USA's #2 and I think the only benefit Quick has over him is that Bishop can't seem to stay healthy. Quick would've been my scratch.

The only reason I would choose Schneider over Bishop in that game is that Schneider is a bit more mobile. And with Canada's firepower and puck movement, I think that's a benefit.

I would have had Bishop in against Europe.



But I am not a proven winner (tm) like Torts.

Oh I'm absolutely in the same boat. If there's debate to be had it's Schneider v. Bishop. THAT is the tougher decision.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

See, that's the real reason all the Chinese money is being parked in Vancouver and Toronto - they really want to get good at hockey and the real estate gains are just icing on the cake.

Just wait another decade or two, the Chinese will knock the US out of the World Cup of Hockey

And Torts will still be the coach.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

And Torts will still be the coach.

and he'd still say he wouldnt change a thing after they got eliminated by China

 

[sabresfaninthesouth]

I reckon that in 15 years, the NHL could be the most diverse pro sport in NA. Amazing the ripple effect that just one guy can make

these twins in my sons league age group wear Matt Dumba jerseys to practice ... at first i was like thats kinda dumb(-a - hehe) ... why would their dad buy them a Matt Dumba jersey but theyre Filipino ... they have a hero

I guess that depends on how one measures diversity. If we're talking simply % of minority players, the NBA and NFL have very high numbers of players who would be defined as minority for census purposes, but who make up the majority in their respective sports.

Baseball meanwhile has a large Latino population and the largest Asian population (not saying much) of the bunch.

But the NHL has approximately the same % of players born outside of the US and Canada as MLB, which trails only MLS within the North American sports leagues. They just happen to come from primarily white countries.

So if diversity is minority % - NBA and NFL (in that order) by a mile. If it's balance of races, it's MLS and MLB. But if it's % of foreign born players, you have MLS and then MLB/NHL. But even amidst all of that, it's difficult to account for players who were born to minority parents but in NA.

TL;DR: It's easy to say that something is or is not diverse, but those numbers can be skewed to meet almost any agenda.

 

[forty_three]

Which is the exact reason that basketball became the preferred sport in inner cities and why soccer has dominated the 2nd and 3rd world (and Europoe obviously) for years now. You need one ball and something to use as a goal. A trash bin, milk basket, etc. for basketball and even just two lines on the ground for soccer.

Plus, at least here in the states, schools are willing to sink money into equipment and facilities for other sports, but very few are willing to put the money into hockey. So when athletes get into high school, they get drawn away to other sports because the cost burden is less.

So if you have a kid who played hockey with the help of some program that made it more affordable, it comes to an end at some point. Sometimes right when they are at their development peak.

so is the article saying hockey is lily white?

the writer of that should come to my sons practice and tell me hockey is a white persons sport

diversity is coming fast ... just a matter of generational cultural assimilation

I got my son on the ice with a Goalie coach, who happens to be black, who is one of the coaches in the Columbus Ice Hockey Club. That organizations' entire mission (supported by the Blue Jackets) is to get kids without the best financial situation into hockey. Most kids do not pay a penny for gear. They are usually one of the strongest rec teams every year and they have a "High School" team where anyone who is too old for Bantam can keep playing even if their school doesn't have a team. I am not looking forward to playing that team at all.

And Torts will still be the coach.

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO