Thoughts on the Michigan sign stealing allegations?

[PIBuckeye]

I've been wrong many times in my life, and likely will be wrong again soon, but I don't think I would get my hopes up here for anything but a slap on the wrist at best.

I honestly don't see this going anywhere with a big penalty attached. The NCAA suspended Harbaugh for 4 games to start the season, the University of Michigan said to the NCAA, "Nah, we'll suspend him for 3 games and that will be enough".

The NCAA tried to flex with the NIL stuff, and all it did was neuter them. Now they can't do anything. If colleges can pay recruits thousands of dollars just to visit them now, what does the NCAA really have governing power over? Whatever power that is left is slowly disappearing.

Like I said, I could be wrong and Michigan/Harbaugh could get slammed here, but I just don't see much happening.

I don't think you are paying attention to all the evidence. There is alot and it seems to be not stopping. you can be positive, but don't think you are living in reality. hypothetically, if mich. wins out, no one is going to respect them or not attach an asterisk to it.

if you lay everything out, objectively, there is enough to lay out discipline now. it's not even debatable.

 

[belcherboy]

I don't think you are paying attention to all the evidence. There is alot and it seems to be not stopping. you can be positive, but don't think you are living in reality. hypothetically, if mich. wins out, no one is going to respect them or not attach an asterisk to it.

if you lay everything out, objectively, there is enough to lay out discipline now. it's not even debatable.

The problem is that it is a mountain of allegations right now.

It's interesting how people (mostly Ohio State fans) want to put an asterisk next to Michigan if they win out this year, but TCU claims to have known about it last year. Others claim the same thing. So if TCU knew about it, and others, I think it is safe to say that everyone knew about it. So if everyone knew about it, what advantage did Michigan have this year?

Listen, you might be right. Maybe this will all be proven true and Michigan will be hammered by the NCAA for it. I just think most non-Michigan fans have "wishful thinking" right now due to their bias. It's always debatable until there are official charges laid out. On top of that, programs get penalized every year for something they did wrong. All that matters is how damaging the penalties are.

I honestly don't see this becoming much of anything. Although I likely have a lot of bias "wishful thinking" in my opinion too.

 

[cwerph]

The problem is that it is a mountain of allegations right now.

It's interesting how people (mostly Ohio State fans) want to put an asterisk next to Michigan if they win out this year, but TCU claims to have known about it last year. Others claim the same thing. So if TCU knew about it, and others, I think it is safe to say that everyone knew about it. So if everyone knew about it, what advantage did Michigan have this year?

Listen, you might be right. Maybe this will all be proven true and Michigan will be hammered by the NCAA for it. I just think most non-Michigan fans have "wishful thinking" right now due to their bias. It's always debatable until there are official charges laid out. On top of that, programs get penalized every year for something they did wrong. All that matters is how damaging the penalties are.

I honestly don't see this becoming much of anything. Although I likely have a lot of bias "wishful thinking" in my opinion too.

TCU knew because Ohio State told them. They had 25 days to change their signals and had the Michigan defense confused the entire game.

Changing signs that took all spring and summer to install aren't as easy to change as folks think.

 

[belcherboy]

TCU knew because Ohio State told them. They had 25 days to change their signals and had the Michigan defense confused the entire game.

Changing signs that took all spring and summer to install aren't as easy to change as folks think.

Thank you! That's why I don't understand why anyone would want to put an asterisk next to this years season, if Michigan goes undefeated. Everyone knew about it last year. If they are too lazy to change their signs knowing they are playing a team known for stealing signs, whose fault is that? I mean it only took TCU 25 days to stop Michigan from stealing their signs back in 2022.

 

[cwerph]

Thank you! That's why I don't understand why anyone would want to put an asterisk next to this years season, if Michigan goes undefeated. Everyone knew about it last year. If they are too lazy to change their signs knowing they are playing a team known for stealing signs, whose fault is that? I mean it only took TCU 25 days to stop Michigan from stealing their signs back in 2022.

That was during the off season, when there were no limits on practice/meeting time and no games in between. During the season they only have 20 hours in a week for that stuff and are preparing for 3 other opponents.

It isn't all about you.

 

[redskinsfan1963]

according to ap,big ten coaches are pushing hard for them to punish michigan this season.don,t know how good it,s gonna do cause it,s the ncaa doing the investigation.

 

[belcherboy]

That was during the off season, when there were no limits on practice/meeting time and no games in between. During the season they only have 20 hours in a week for that stuff and are preparing for 3 other opponents.

It isn't all about you.

They still had 6-8 months to plan the game against Michigan, knowing that they steal signs. I mean Michigan has played a weak schedule so for, so maybe they just didn’t have the ability to change?

 

[Wolvie]

TCU knew because Ohio State told them. They had 25 days to change their signals and had the Michigan defense confused the entire game.

Changing signs that took all spring and summer to install aren't as easy to change as folks think.

Teams know that other teams are trying to steal their signs right? This is a long-held accepted practice. Are you telling me that these programs know that an opponent might have a beat on their plays at any given moment but never have thought to build in alternative signs at any point? That is nonsensical.

 

[PIBuckeye]

The problem is that it is a mountain of allegations right now.

It's interesting how people (mostly Ohio State fans) want to put an asterisk next to Michigan if they win out this year, but TCU claims to have known about it last year. Others claim the same thing. So if TCU knew about it, and others, I think it is safe to say that everyone knew about it. So if everyone knew about it, what advantage did Michigan have this year?

Listen, you might be right. Maybe this will all be proven true and Michigan will be hammered by the NCAA for it. I just think most non-Michigan fans have "wishful thinking" right now due to their bias. It's always debatable until there are official charges laid out. On top of that, programs get penalized every year for something they did wrong. All that matters is how damaging the penalties are.

I honestly don't see this becoming much of anything. Although I likely have a lot of bias "wishful thinking" in my opinion too.

 

[Wolvie]

according to ap,big ten coaches are pushing hard for them to punish michigan this season.don,t know how good it,s gonna do cause it,s the ncaa doing the investigation.

The problem here is that we don't know if this alleged cheating scheme was known by the coaches. If that is found to be the case, then Michigan should absolutely be punished. If instead this was some low level employee trying to make a name for himself by showing himself to be a football genius (and doing so not on his own merits but by cheating) then that is a completely different story. We don't even know if any of this cheating actually made its way into in-game scheming yet.

 

[JeffWilk]

No matter what. Michigan and Jim Harbaugh will be tainted by these allegations. Experts say that this kind of cheating is worth a 10-15 point swing each game.

Ill be curious to see if tOSU has new signals and if they beat Michigan. those 2 wins will be tainted as well.

 

[belcherboy]

No matter what. Michigan and Jim Harbaugh will be tainted by these allegations. Experts say that this kind of cheating is worth a 10-15 point swing each game.

I’ll be curious to see if tOSU has new signals and if they beat Michigan. those 2 wins will be tainted as well.

Can you post which experts said this swings each game by 10-15 points. I have not seen that said.

 

[cwerph]

Teams know that other teams are trying to steal their signs right? This is a long-held accepted practice. Are you telling me that these programs know that an opponent might have a beat on their plays at any given moment but never have thought to build in alternative signs at any point? That is nonsensical.

Michigan scouted Ohio State in person for 8 games. They knew all the signs and the variations.

 

[Wamu]

Can you post which experts said this swings each game by 10-15 points. I have not seen that said.

You're wrong!

Take that.

Dammit, wrong thread.

 

[belcherboy]

according to ap,big ten coaches are pushing hard for them to punish michigan this season.don,t know how good it,s gonna do cause it,s the ncaa doing the investigation.

Nothing can happen this season. Even if charges were issued, they have 90 days to defend themselves. The season will be far over by then.

 

[belcherboy]

The problem here is that we don't know if this alleged cheating scheme was known by the coaches. If that is found to be the case, then Michigan should absolutely be punished. If instead this was some low level employee trying to make a name for himself by showing himself to be a football genius (and doing so not on his own merits but by cheating) then that is a completely different story. We don't even know if any of this cheating actually made its way into in-game scheming yet.

Honestly I don’t care about the allegations. The punishment if Michigan is charged is what I want to know. That’s where I see most people wanting the worst punishment for Michigan will be most disappointed.

I could be wrong and Michigan gets some seriously crippling punishments, but I honestly think this will result in basically a hard slap on the wrist and we probably won’t know what it is for at least 6 months.

The NCAA will wire up the helmets next and all this will be forgotten. (They should do it before the playoffs in my opinion, don’t want anyone using it against Michigan now that Michigan has shown them how to take advantage of it)

 

[JeffWilk]

Can you post which experts said this swings each game by 10-15 points. I have not seen that said.

4 min mark

 

[belcherboy]

4 min mark

Interesting. I still think it is click bait when he doesn’t give any specific names to these coaches who claim it gave Michigan an advantage of as many as 21 points in a game.

 

[redskinsfan1963]

Nothing can happen this season. Even if charges were issued, they have 90 days to defend themselves. The season will be far over by then.

i don,t think anything can be done at all till the ncaa finishes its investigation.

 

[belcherboy]

i don,t think anything can be done at all till the ncaa finishes its investigation.

That’s what I’m saying. Even if the investigation was complete, Michigan has 90 days to defend themselves from the charges. Nothing will be done this season.