teams in the KC race this off season

[Sharkinva]

Make a thread on the nfl general board, open to the pub bloc asking about juju, Bryant, crowder see what happens, better yet I will

Rank these wrs

NO major dog in this fight, as I think Crowder is a good slot WR that we tried to make into a legit #2 out of need.

But... Bryant and JuJu (please tell me thats just a nick name by the way) play on a team that is damn near NFL royalty, with a recognized (not debated) franchise QB. By this I mean, how good a player is or isnt considered to be is colored by how much media attention said named player and their respective team get. Kerrigan is a prime example. He has been on par with some of the best OLBs his entire career. But the Skins have sucked, especially on defense. So he is considered the decent player on a shitty defense.

Same stats, same play, put him on say the Sea Hawks defense... mega star..... or the media will make it out that way.

 

[Stymietee]

NO major dog in this fight, as I think Crowder is a good slot WR that we tried to make into a legit #2 out of need.

But... Bryant and JuJu (please tell me thats just a nick name by the way) play on a team that is damn near NFL royalty, with a recognized (not debated) franchise QB. By this I mean, how good a player is or isnt considered to be is colored by how much media attention said named player and their respective team get. Kerrigan is a prime example. He has been on par with some of the best OLBs his entire career. But the Skins have sucked, especially on defense. So he is considered the decent player on a shitty defense.

Same stats, same play, put him on say the Sea Hawks defense... mega star..... or the media will make it out that way.

His full name is.....
John "JuJu" Smith-Schuster

 

[Sharkinva]

His full name is.....
John "JuJu" Smith-Schuster

Had to check. You know how we roll, I grew up with people named after cars and Alcohol... Mercedes mom drove a busted ford after all. LOL

 

[ehb5]

Just doing my normal stirring the pot. Key point, I wouldn't bother if I didn't like you .... even when you are wrong .... or less right.

You and I have had the debate about RO QBs, QBs who run almost as often as they pass. Most often they do not pan out in the NFL. Jackson has run for almost 1500 yards this year as well as passing for over 3,000 yards so he isn't pulling it down once in awhile, he is doing it as part of the offense. It doesn't mean a guy who does that can't be successful but you can only find a handful at best who could make the jump to the NFL.

I think we have had this conversation too. There are a lot of Big 10 QBs in the league because so many of those schools used pro style offenses. With the success of Meyer and Franklin that is changing and has changed largely in college because it takes less overall skill to be successful in the RO offenses. My guess is the NFL is going to have to adapt and I also think finding a successful NFL QB is going to be an even bigger crapshoot than it has ever been.

Fair enough lol

He does run a ton in college but a lot is by design. From what I've seen he still does a good job of keeping his eyes downfield and looking to pass when scrambling.

I think nfl offense are gonna keep becoming more and more like college offense.

 

[ehb5]

Alot of the same things were said about the last mobile QB we drafted.

Shrug. Sometimes scouts are wrong.

 

[ehb5]

Dox - 13 targets, 2 catches. 11 incompletions to one guy out of 18 incompletions.

Holy he'll. What.

 

[ehb5]

jackson as a passer is not more prepared . nor is he when it comes to reading pro defenses . cam took time , watson is a small sample , wilson is a passer first

Why is he not more prepared?

Why can't he read pro defenses?

Those are excuses for Watson and Wilson.

 

[skinsdad62]

For Jackson, Louisville's 2016 Heisman Trophy winner who as a junior could decide to enter the 2018 draft, his Vick-like running and passing ability make him an intriguing NFL prospect.

Yet there seems to be no consensus on Jackson's NFL potential. Is he a can't-miss prospect who could match Vick's No. 1 status or one who lacks the throwing accuracy required to succeed in a pocket-passing NFL? One anonymous ACC coach told Sports Illustrated in January that Jackson has "no shot" at playing quarterback in the NFL.

Either way, draft analysts are eager to see what Jackson does next.

"His sophomore year was historic, was great, was exciting, but whether or not he gets drafted will be because of what he does as a junior, " said Dane Brugler, analyst for NFLDraftScout.com, whose site ranks Jackson the No. 8 prospect for 2018. "The NFL scouts are going to want to see, ‘OK, we know what you can do. But now can you get better? What’s your development not only with the passing game but mentally?' Is he able to read coverages, be more accurate with the football?"


All in all, the youngest man ever to win the Heisman is coming off a brilliant season in which he was college football's most exciting player but still lacked the passing accuracy and in-pocket polish usually sought in top NFL QBs.

Operating mostly from shotgun or pistol formations and in a read-option rushing attack, Jackson passed for 3,543 yards and 30 touchdowns with nine interceptions and ran for 1,571 yards and 21 touchdowns.

More: Doyel: Purdue football 'abandoned' Indianapolis, wants to win it back

His completion rate improved from 54.7 percent as a freshman to 56.2 percent as a sophomore, but he still ranked only 10th in the Atlantic Coast Conference. He was also one of the nation's most sacked QBs, and he fumbled eight times, losing five.


"Oh, he could be a No. 1 overall pick," Brugler said. "He has that type of ability, is that type of athlete. Obviously arm strength is not an issue. Sometimes the game comes naturally to guys. He seems like one of those types of guys where he sees the field really well and the spacing. The way he controls himself, his ability to improvise and make plays (are impressive).

"The biggest thing for him is his development as a passer – recognizing coverages, breaking down what defenses are trying to do pre-snap and post-snap and being consistent in the pocket. We saw flashes of that (in 2016). He just needs to do it more consistently from the start of the season to the bowl game."

Sporting News and OptimumScouting.com draft analyst Eric Galko projected Jackson as the No. 18 overall pick and fifth QB taken in an early 2018 mock draft. Galko said he thinks Jackson makes reads at a higher level than Vick did coming out of college and that Jackson should get more credit for the vision and decision-making he shows on some of his long scrambling runs.

"Just because he’s taking off running, it doesn’t mean he’s bailing on a play. It’s a read," Galko said. "I think he’s proven that he can make the right decision a lot of the time as a runner or a passer, and that can translate to the NFL. That kind of recognition and anticipation of the defense can translate more and develop him more as a passer."



While Galko is eager to see how Jackson develops as a pocket passer in 2017, he also wants the Cardinals to "unleash him the way he knows best" and continue to playto his strengths.

"When a guy is a prospect like we’ve never seen before in terms of his talent makeup —guys like Reggie Bush, JaMarcus Russell, Robert Griffin, guys we don’t have a direct comparison to — that’s when teams get either really intrigued or really down on a guy," Galko said. "I think Jackson will be one of those guys where there will be at least one or two GMs who think, ‘You know what? This guy is really special and a once-in-a-lifetime player. For better or worse, we’re going to take him early.’"

Bleacher Report draft analyst Matt Miller said he wants to study Jackson a lot more next season but that if the 2018 draft were today he would consider Jackson a "developmental prospect" and grade him as probably a fourth-round pick.

Miller didn't include Jackson on his list of the top 50 prospects for the next draft and ranks him No. 6 among QBs, behind Wyoming's Josh Allen, USC's Sam Darnold, UCLA's Josh Rosen, Washington State's Luke Falk and Oklahoma State's Mason Rudolph, all of whom are considered more traditional pocket passers.

Miller said Jackson's ability to throw deep down the middle of the field impresses him, but Miller has questions about the 6-foot-3 Jackson's slender frame — he's said to have bulked up about 10 pounds to 206 this offseason — and how much value he'll have as a runner in an NFL built on pocket passing.

More: Trinity 2019 defensive end Stephen Herron plans to visit finalists before college decision

"I think it can be frustrating for fans because they see a guy like Lamar have so much success as an open-field runner and you kind of wonder why the NFL just doesn’t let him do what he’s great at," Miller said. "But you can’t expose a quarterback to those kind of hits, and the NFL is designed to be a quick-strike passing league, and you want a guy who plays to those strengths. I think if Lamar was built like Cam Newton it would be different, but because he is such a small guy it becomes more of a negative. We’re going to hear a lot of things like, ‘He doesn’t play from the pocket,’ or ‘He has to move to set up the pass.’"

Former NFL scout Chris Landry, who runs LandryFootball.com, said he wants to see more consistency from Jackson in the pocket in 2017 before he's convinced he'll be a successful NFL passer.

He said he wants Jackson to show he can consistently throw NFL-level back-shoulder fades and deliver on slant routes that hit the receiver's front-side shoulder.

"In the NFL, that’s the difference in your receiver getting the ball knocked out or being completed for a big play," Landry said. "He’s got a gun for an arm, but accuracy and getting the ball out on time are the things I want to see.

"You’re not going to make a living running the ball. You’re going to make a living as a passer, and the running is only going to augment what you do."

ProFootballFocus.com analyst Steve Palazzolo, who in an early mock draft projected Jackson as the No. 12 pick next year, said Jackson's strengths and limitations remind him of Vick, who completed 56.2 percent of his passes for his NFL career, identical to Jackson last season.

Though he expects it to improve, Palazzolo said Jackson's accuracy would be a problem if he had to go to the NFL right now.

More: Trinity four-star WR Rondale Moore commits to Texas

"Ball location, he still misses too many open throws," Palazzolo said. "Even when he’s completing passes, they’re not exactly where he wants them to be. ... But then he’ll come back and throw a tight-window post and a downfield post route and put it right where he wants. You kind of see the potential there, but throw for throw, it’s not there yet. That just reminds me a lot of Vick — a guy who will make some big throws, who will create with his legs but probably right now is leaving too many plays off the table."



that is the book on him and everything i have said appears in this evaluation

 

[SteelersPride]

NO major dog in this fight, as I think Crowder is a good slot WR that we tried to make into a legit #2 out of need.

But... Bryant and JuJu (please tell me thats just a nick name by the way) play on a team that is damn near NFL royalty, with a recognized (not debated) franchise QB. By this I mean, how good a player is or isnt considered to be is colored by how much media attention said named player and their respective team get. Kerrigan is a prime example. He has been on par with some of the best OLBs his entire career. But the Skins have sucked, especially on defense. So he is considered the decent player on a shitty defense.

Same stats, same play, put him on say the Sea Hawks defense... mega star..... or the media will make it out that way.

Juju is a real name and yes he’s a great #3 slot wr

 

[ehb5]

For Jackson, Louisville's 2016 Heisman Trophy winner who as a junior could decide to enter the 2018 draft, his Vick-like running and passing ability make him an intriguing NFL prospect.

Yet there seems to be no consensus on Jackson's NFL potential. Is he a can't-miss prospect who could match Vick's No. 1 status or one who lacks the throwing accuracy required to succeed in a pocket-passing NFL? One anonymous ACC coach told Sports Illustrated in January that Jackson has "no shot" at playing quarterback in the NFL.

Either way, draft analysts are eager to see what Jackson does next.

"His sophomore year was historic, was great, was exciting, but whether or not he gets drafted will be because of what he does as a junior, " said Dane Brugler, analyst for NFLDraftScout.com, whose site ranks Jackson the No. 8 prospect for 2018. "The NFL scouts are going to want to see, ‘OK, we know what you can do. But now can you get better? What’s your development not only with the passing game but mentally?' Is he able to read coverages, be more accurate with the football?"


All in all, the youngest man ever to win the Heisman is coming off a brilliant season in which he was college football's most exciting player but still lacked the passing accuracy and in-pocket polish usually sought in top NFL QBs.

Operating mostly from shotgun or pistol formations and in a read-option rushing attack, Jackson passed for 3,543 yards and 30 touchdowns with nine interceptions and ran for 1,571 yards and 21 touchdowns.

More: Doyel: Purdue football 'abandoned' Indianapolis, wants to win it back

His completion rate improved from 54.7 percent as a freshman to 56.2 percent as a sophomore, but he still ranked only 10th in the Atlantic Coast Conference. He was also one of the nation's most sacked QBs, and he fumbled eight times, losing five.


"Oh, he could be a No. 1 overall pick," Brugler said. "He has that type of ability, is that type of athlete. Obviously arm strength is not an issue. Sometimes the game comes naturally to guys. He seems like one of those types of guys where he sees the field really well and the spacing. The way he controls himself, his ability to improvise and make plays (are impressive).

"The biggest thing for him is his development as a passer – recognizing coverages, breaking down what defenses are trying to do pre-snap and post-snap and being consistent in the pocket. We saw flashes of that (in 2016). He just needs to do it more consistently from the start of the season to the bowl game."

Sporting News and OptimumScouting.com draft analyst Eric Galko projected Jackson as the No. 18 overall pick and fifth QB taken in an early 2018 mock draft. Galko said he thinks Jackson makes reads at a higher level than Vick did coming out of college and that Jackson should get more credit for the vision and decision-making he shows on some of his long scrambling runs.

"Just because he’s taking off running, it doesn’t mean he’s bailing on a play. It’s a read," Galko said. "I think he’s proven that he can make the right decision a lot of the time as a runner or a passer, and that can translate to the NFL. That kind of recognition and anticipation of the defense can translate more and develop him more as a passer."



While Galko is eager to see how Jackson develops as a pocket passer in 2017, he also wants the Cardinals to "unleash him the way he knows best" and continue to playto his strengths.

"When a guy is a prospect like we’ve never seen before in terms of his talent makeup —guys like Reggie Bush, JaMarcus Russell, Robert Griffin, guys we don’t have a direct comparison to — that’s when teams get either really intrigued or really down on a guy," Galko said. "I think Jackson will be one of those guys where there will be at least one or two GMs who think, ‘You know what? This guy is really special and a once-in-a-lifetime player. For better or worse, we’re going to take him early.’"

Bleacher Report draft analyst Matt Miller said he wants to study Jackson a lot more next season but that if the 2018 draft were today he would consider Jackson a "developmental prospect" and grade him as probably a fourth-round pick.

Miller didn't include Jackson on his list of the top 50 prospects for the next draft and ranks him No. 6 among QBs, behind Wyoming's Josh Allen, USC's Sam Darnold, UCLA's Josh Rosen, Washington State's Luke Falk and Oklahoma State's Mason Rudolph, all of whom are considered more traditional pocket passers.

Miller said Jackson's ability to throw deep down the middle of the field impresses him, but Miller has questions about the 6-foot-3 Jackson's slender frame — he's said to have bulked up about 10 pounds to 206 this offseason — and how much value he'll have as a runner in an NFL built on pocket passing.

More: Trinity 2019 defensive end Stephen Herron plans to visit finalists before college decision

"I think it can be frustrating for fans because they see a guy like Lamar have so much success as an open-field runner and you kind of wonder why the NFL just doesn’t let him do what he’s great at," Miller said. "But you can’t expose a quarterback to those kind of hits, and the NFL is designed to be a quick-strike passing league, and you want a guy who plays to those strengths. I think if Lamar was built like Cam Newton it would be different, but because he is such a small guy it becomes more of a negative. We’re going to hear a lot of things like, ‘He doesn’t play from the pocket,’ or ‘He has to move to set up the pass.’"

Former NFL scout Chris Landry, who runs LandryFootball.com, said he wants to see more consistency from Jackson in the pocket in 2017 before he's convinced he'll be a successful NFL passer.

He said he wants Jackson to show he can consistently throw NFL-level back-shoulder fades and deliver on slant routes that hit the receiver's front-side shoulder.

"In the NFL, that’s the difference in your receiver getting the ball knocked out or being completed for a big play," Landry said. "He’s got a gun for an arm, but accuracy and getting the ball out on time are the things I want to see.

"You’re not going to make a living running the ball. You’re going to make a living as a passer, and the running is only going to augment what you do."

ProFootballFocus.com analyst Steve Palazzolo, who in an early mock draft projected Jackson as the No. 12 pick next year, said Jackson's strengths and limitations remind him of Vick, who completed 56.2 percent of his passes for his NFL career, identical to Jackson last season.

Though he expects it to improve, Palazzolo said Jackson's accuracy would be a problem if he had to go to the NFL right now.

More: Trinity four-star WR Rondale Moore commits to Texas

"Ball location, he still misses too many open throws," Palazzolo said. "Even when he’s completing passes, they’re not exactly where he wants them to be. ... But then he’ll come back and throw a tight-window post and a downfield post route and put it right where he wants. You kind of see the potential there, but throw for throw, it’s not there yet. That just reminds me a lot of Vick — a guy who will make some big throws, who will create with his legs but probably right now is leaving too many plays off the table."



that is the book on him and everything i have said appears in this evaluation

Thanks for posting. Certainly not a prospect above criticism but he's got a lot going for him.

My biggest problem is probably the difference in the way people talk about Jackson and Allen. I don't think Allen does a single thing better than Jackson except be bigger (and how's that working out for Brock osweiler).

You see people knock Jackson as inaccurate but then put Allen as a 1st round pick when Allen has been extremely inaccurate.

 

[skinsdad62]

Thanks for posting. Certainly not a prospect above criticism but he's got a lot going for him.

My biggest problem is probably the difference in the way people talk about Jackson and Allen. I don't think Allen does a single thing better than Jackson except be bigger (and how's that working out for Brock osweiler).

You see people knock Jackson as inaccurate but then put Allen as a 1st round pick when Allen has been extremely inaccurate.

allen is inaccurate allen is a risk , a huge one

 

[Sportster 72]

Smart move using Petrino family motto to craft Louisville offense to Lamar Jackson

 

[Sportster 72]

I thought I posted that a couple hours ago before I took the dog to the beach.

All the QBs have question marks. You just love dual threat college QBs ehb. That's cool but it doesn't often translate to the NFL. As I said I think the league is changing a little but you aren't going to see too many 1,000 rushing QBs so that means they have to learn to work in the pocket.

 

[Sharkinva]

allen is inaccurate allen is a risk , a huge one

Agree Allen is a risk.. as a QB prospect.

What he isnt a risk of is...

News flash.. the Washington Redskins have traded two 1st round picks, a 2nd, 3rd and an as yet to be named virgin in order to move up in the draft to take him.

So all in all, if we are dead set on taking a QB, I would be less pissed with us just drafting Allen, than the usual alternative we try and take.

 

[ehb5]

I thought I posted that a couple hours ago before I took the dog to the beach.

All the QBs have question marks. You just love dual threat college QBs ehb. That's cool but it doesn't often translate to the NFL. As I said I think the league is changing a little but you aren't going to see too many 1,000 rushing QBs so that means they have to learn to work in the pocket.

I do lol. But I don't love them at the cost of players I think can be good nfl QBs. I think Jackson does a lot of things really well as a passer. Certainly he's have plenty to learn like any rookie QB.

 

[ehb5]

Agree Allen is a risk.. as a QB prospect.

What he isnt a risk of is...

News flash.. the Washington Redskins have traded two 1st round picks, a 2nd, 3rd and an as yet to be named virgin in order to move up in the draft to take him.

So all in all, if we are dead set on taking a QB, I would be less pissed with us just drafting Allen, than the usual alternative we try and take.

What about sitting tight and taking Jackson? No trade up.

 

[Sharkinva]

What about sitting tight and taking Jackson? No trade up.

Man.. just say no to RG4 already.

Besides, some one will draft him in the top ten. And thats fine... I just dont think it should be the Redskins... period.

 

[j_y19]

Man.. just say no to RG4 already.

Besides, some one will draft him in the top ten. And thats fine... I just dont think it should be the Redskins... period.

I'm not so sure he goes in the top 10. Not even sure he goes in the 1st round. I think teams have to be wary of these "dual threat" QBs as there have been so many flame outs. He will have to completely change his game to make it in the NFL. Especially on a Gruden coached team. The last thing Gruden wants is a QB that has had much of his success using his legs.

 

[Sharkinva]

I'm not so sure he goes in the top 10. Not even sure he goes in the 1st round. I think teams have to be wary of these "dual threat" QBs as there have been so many flame outs. He will have to completely change his game to make it in the NFL. Especially on a Gruden coached team. The last thing Gruden wants is a QB that has had much of his success using his legs.

 

[ehb5]

Man.. just say no to RG4 already.

Besides, some one will draft him in the top ten. And thats fine... I just dont think it should be the Redskins... period.

I'm saying assuming he's there. I know you don't wanna trade up and I'm with you.

Why is he rg4 though? Why are we assuming he'll fail?