Ray Rice super thread.

[Melman]

Doesn't look good for the NFL that Ray McDonald was playing yesterday, either.

No, it doesn't. It really doesn't help that Jim Harbaugh was talking tough about his intolerance for domestic violence not that long ago; then he basically had to justify to the media why he was allowing McDonald to play shortly thereafter. Not good for his look at all.

 

[Money]

before this video came out we knew that he knocked this woman out. Now we see how.

You didn't. You assumed. The fact that your assumption was correct (sadly) does not justify jumping to that unsupported assumption in the first place.

 

[fordman84]

You didn't. You assumed. The fact that your assumption was correct (sadly) does not justify jumping to that unsupported assumption in the first place.

Well, I guess I was making an assumption. Of course that assumption was bolstered by everyone including the parties involved admitting he hit her and knocked her out.

But you are right, I guess, it was an "assumption".

 

[Nascar Addict]

We knew that SOMETHING had to have happened before the dragged her out of the elevator. Now we have the video. And It's beyond me why the airhead married him. Oh yeah. $$$

Anywaay. Ray Rice should be banned for life. And Goodell should should get canned.

 

[fordman84]

We knew that SOMETHING had to have happened before the dragged her out of the elevator. Now we have the video. And It's beyond me why the airhead married him. Oh yeah. $$$

Anywaay. Ray Rice should be banned for life. And Goodell should should get canned.

We knew that there was a physical altercation and that she was rendered unconscious. Pretty easy to figure out that Rice must have hit her, but that's still an "assumption" remember. :rollseyes:

 

[Broncosr0k]

You didn't. You assumed. The fact that your assumption was correct (sadly) does not justify jumping to that unsupported assumption in the first place.

I guess you missed that whole press conference where Rice spent 30 seconds saying "I did it" and his wife spent the next 10 minutes saying she instigated the face bashing.

 

[Broncosr0k]

We knew that there was a physical altercation and that she was rendered unconscious. Pretty easy to figure out that Rice must have hit her, but that's still an "assumption" remember.

I have been on this Merry-Go-Round with Money. He argued that we had no idea what happened in the elevator and followed it up with the thought that domestic violence has different levels of wrongness so we don't know how bad he messed up.

 

[fordman84]

I guess you missed that whole press conference where Rice spent 30 seconds saying "I did it" and his wife spent the next 10 minutes saying she instigated the face bashing.

Or his attorney stating that there was a physical altercation very soon after the first video hit the air? Or the court summons from February which states he hit her with his hand and knocked her unconscious?

 

[Broncos6482]

I don't see why the Ravens can't cut him if they want to. NFL contracts aren't guaranteed, so if they just cut him and paid him whatever else they owed him, how in the world could he sue them?

Here's another thing: let's assume for a second that no one in the Ravens front office actually saw the video. So if Rice lied to them and told them that she instigated the whole thing and attacked him, then why couldn't they cut him on the grounds that he lied to them now that the video is out and they have proof what happened?

 

[fordman84]

I have been on this Merry-Go-Round with Money. He argued that we had no idea what happened in the elevator and followed it up with the thought that domestic violence has different levels of wrongness so we don't know how bad he messed up.

When we have people who are forced to divest themselves of their teams because of words they said, or missing twice as much time for taking medication that is physician prescribed...I don't care about "levels of wrongness". Knocking someone half your size out cold for any reason should be a much stiffer penalty than two damn games.

 

[Money]

We knew that there was a physical altercation and that she was rendered unconscious. Pretty easy to figure out that Rice must have hit her, but that's still an "assumption" remember. :rollseyes:

There are A LOT of other ways that could have gone down. Many of which would have made much more sense given the fact that the police let a woman go "home" with a man who had just not only hit her, but also knocked her out.

 

[fordman84]

I don't see why the Ravens can't cut him if they want to. NFL contracts aren't guaranteed, so if they just cut him and paid him whatever else they owed him, how in the world could he sue them?

Here's another thing: let's assume for a second that no one in the Ravens front office actually saw the video. So if Rice lied to them and told them that she instigated the whole thing and attacked him, then why couldn't they cut him on the grounds that he lied to them now that the video is out and they have proof what happened?

I'm betting if the cut him they try to get their money back. If not, the punishment isn't too severe. As for how to cut him, I'm sure there are plenty of grounds they could use. The group in the worst spot will be the NFLPA who would have to defend him in any action taken by the team or league.

 

[fordman84]

There are A LOT of other ways that could have gone down. Many of which would have made much more sense given the fact that the police let a woman go "home" with a man who had just not only hit her, but also knocked her out.

 

[fredmccallyRTR]

Ray Rice arrest: police statement [PDF] - baltimoresun.com

Original Police Statement on Incident

 

[Money]

I guess you missed that whole press conference where Rice spent 30 seconds saying "I did it" and his wife spent the next 10 minutes saying she instigated the face bashing.

He took responsibility for "his actions". Those actions were never spelled out.

 

[Broncos6482]

I'm betting if the cut him they try to get their money back. If not, the punishment isn't too severe. As for how to cut him, I'm sure there are plenty of grounds they could use. The group in the worst spot will be the NFLPA who would have to defend him in any action taken by the team or league.

Does the NFLPA absolutely have to defend him? I've seen a ton of current players come out and say he needs to be out of the league. So if the Ravens or the league took further action, could the NFLPA not defend him on the grounds that most of it's members don't want them to? Or could the NFLPA even kick him out?

By the way these are all serious questions, I'm genuinely curious as to the legal ramifications of this.

 

[fredmccallyRTR]

Ray Rice's police arrest report says he knocked fiancee unconscious

The actual police report

 

[ducky]

After re-watching the video, at most she slapped him halfheartedly and then he hits her, she walks forward and he knocks her cold out. Easy assault case.

In a court of law the fact that one of the attackers is a female is completely irrelevant to the situation.

And the fact of the matter is that the "victim" in this case threw the first blow and was attempting to strike the defendant when the final and decisive blow was thrown. And the prosecutor would have the "victim" on the stand testifying for the defense saying that she started it and was attempting to fight when she was hit.

And in New Jersey there is a law on the books that automatically downgrades a simple assault charge down to petty disorderly if the fight was consensual. Which it clearly was. Meaning there is little to no chance of convicting Rice of assault with this video.

Again not trying to condone his actions....just talking about how the law would view it. This video in a lot of ways shows the prosecutor was smart to plead him down.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

We all knew this was bad even before the video was released...now we know just how bad...I'm surprised the NFL made a judgement prior to knowing all the data...I was one saying Rice is paying the price, time to move on, but it would be difficult as a Ravens fan to support this guy after only sitting out 2 games.

 

[germanjohn]

The NFL handed out its punishment. It cannot go back and re-punish him. We live in a fucking democratic society with rules, people. The NFL has had this policy for domestic violence before, but NOW because everybody saw the video he has to be punished worse? Fuck off. I really am getting tired of this shit with TMZ. Part of Rice's plea bargain was that the footage from inside the elevator would never be shown. And you know what? I'd be perfectly okay with it getting leaked if someone inside the dept. was generally disgusted by what they saw, but chances are it's somebody with an ulterior motive and could give a shit less about Rice's wife. The same goes for TMZ. Their video is bringing in shitloads of views. But all this gets overlooked if you get a strong enough public reaction. Same thing happened with Sterling. The way TMZ's material (in Sterling's as well as Rice's cases) were obtained was through illegal means.

Be very careful. Like I've said in the past, yes, these guys need to be punished, but we have to go by the book. We can't just allow popular sentiment to trump what our rules are.