Miami Cap-hell

[FlyerFinFan]

Crabtree is the answer!!!!! Sign him please! Yeah, Crabtree!!!!!

They'll only sign him if they like what they see...either way he'll chew up that new corner of yours. Although by the sounds of it that wouldn't be a tough chore.

 

[Southieinnc]

They'll only sign him if they like what they see...either way he'll chew up that new corner of yours. Although by the sounds of it that wouldn't be a tough chore.

Yah! Yah! He will! Sign him, Sign him! Quick before he gets away!

 

[FlyerFinFan]

Yah! Yah! He will! Sign him, Sign him! Quick before he gets away!

I'm hearing he wants 3 years 18 M not sure about that I'm on the fence. It's not like he completely blows...

 

[tducey]

think the Dolphins will be fine but also think they overpaid on Suh,

 

[Southieinnc]

think the Dolphins will be fine but also think they overpaid on Suh,

I think the Dolphins will be fine but
Last place is a conspicuous place for a $114 million contract.....

 

[FlyerFinFan]

think the Dolphins will be fine but also think they overpaid on Suh,

All FA's are overpaid unless there's risk involved...

 

[Southieinnc]

All FA's are overpaid unless there's risk involved...

In the case of Donkeykong Suh - he is both.
He is overpaid and a risk. Tell me the truth?
Are you worried about what happens when he starts hanging out with Chris Johnson and Mike Pouncy???

Being selective in free agency a formula for winning Super Bowls

Such temptation to spend big is always there, but history shows big free agent contracts rarely lead to winning big. So despite making recent headlines, the Jets and Dolphins, who landed Ndamukong Suh with a six-year, $114 million contract, should probably temper their expectations in 2015

 

[HaroldSeattle]

In the case of Donkeykong Suh - he is both.
He is overpaid and a risk. Tell me the truth?
Are you worried about what happens when he starts hanging out with Chris Johnson and Mike Pouncy???

Being selective in free agency a formula for winning Super Bowls

Such temptation to spend big is always there, but history shows big free agent contracts rarely lead to winning big. So despite making recent headlines, the Jets and Dolphins, who landed Ndamukong Suh with a six-year, $114 million contract, should probably temper their expectations in 2015

Didn't the Pats make a big splash last year with free agents? Including Revis and Browner? True they were one year deals, but they seemed to work out OK, Pats fans are most likely wish they longer deals. right?

 

[Southieinnc]

Didn't the Pats make a big splash last year with free agents? Including Revis and Browner? True they were one year deals, but they seemed to work out OK, Pats fans are most likely wish they longer deals. right?

We'll miss Revis. The deals worked in that we won the Superbowl. They cost uis a chunk of our 2015 salary cap. (we'll pay Revis $5Mil this year). Revis was a rental. He was getting beat by shifty receivers and father time will catch him before the Jets contract is one. He just was not worth to us what the Jets are paying

Browner was signed to complement Revis. He was also signed before the rules changed. Without Revis, he is not part of the game plan and not worth the money. We won't miss what the rules change did to his game.

I may be the only Pats fan in existence happy to see them go. They educated our young DB's and developed a toughness to their game. I really believe the secondary is ready (now) to step up to why they were drafted / signed to the Patriots. We don't typically sign players to lose ballgames. Wait and see!

 

[FlyerFinFan]

In the case of Donkeykong Suh - he is both.
He is overpaid and a risk. Tell me the truth?
Are you worried about what happens when he starts hanging out with Chris Johnson and Mike Pouncy???

Being selective in free agency a formula for winning Super Bowls

Such temptation to spend big is always there, but history shows big free agent contracts rarely lead to winning big. So despite making recent headlines, the Jets and Dolphins, who landed Ndamukong Suh with a six-year, $114 million contract, should probably temper their expectations in 2015

Anything can happen in sports but no I'm not worried about Suh he's a top player not some tool one hit wonder....that's the big difference. He will perform well in a position of need. The Fins D line will be tough all the way to the end this year which was their failure last season. But you lose one of the top QB's and rationalize that you'll be better for it??? Wow...

 

[Southieinnc]

Anything can happen in sports but no I'm not worried about Suh he's a top player not some tool one hit wonder....that's the big difference. He will perform well in a position of need. The Fins D line will be tough all the way to the end this year which was their failure last season. But you lose one of the top QB's and rationalize that you'll be better for it??? Wow...

(DB's) Yes, I did. Right there to be bookmarked. Pats win AFC East!

 

[ducky]

Being selective in free agency a formula for winning Super Bowls

Such temptation to spend big is always there, but history shows big free agent contracts rarely lead to winning big. So despite making recent headlines, the Jets and Dolphins, who landed Ndamukong Suh with a six-year, $114 million contract, should probably temper their expectations in 2015

They should temper their expectations for 2015....but the future is bright for them with Suh in the fold IMO.

Building around a dominant defensive lineman makes life a hell of a lot easier.

Free agency or trades is an absolute MUST in the modern NFL. It is nearly impossible to fill out a SB roster without them. And you only have to look at the recent winners. You can not completely draft your way to sustainable success any longer (although you need to do that well too).

2014: Revis
2013: Harvin & Lynch
2012: Boldin
2011: Antrel Rolle
2010: Charles Woodson
2009: Randall Gay, Sharper, Vilma


In all those cases one of the top 5 players on their team for their SB run was acquired via a trade or on the FA market and signed to a top value contract for their position.

An NFL team trying to build completely via the draft these days is on the right path because the draft is first and foremost the key to success. But teams have to supplement via FA and trades in this era of football.

People are letting the new NFL numbers scare them. They just don't realize how Suh's contract in 3 years isn't going to look completely outrageous and how by that point there will be plenty of defensive players within that zip code as the cap is going to continue to go up and up and up to the point that in 3 years we are going to be staring at a near $180M cap at least.

The last team to win it all without a big ticket FA or trade for a big ticket player was the '08 Steeler's.

 

[FlyerFinFan]

(DB's) Yes, I did. Right there to be bookmarked. Pats win AFC East!

Yes stupid spellchecker I meant CB's.

We'll see what happens the pats are obviously favored but anything can happen in football. The Fins really need some 2/3rd year players to step up and if they do they will be in the mix....you can mark me down for that too!

 

[FlyerFinFan]

They should temper their expectations for 2015....but the future is bright for them with Suh in the fold IMO.

Building around a dominant defensive lineman makes life a hell of a lot easier.

Free agency or trades is an absolute MUST in the modern NFL. It is nearly impossible to fill out a SB roster without them. And you only have to look at the recent winners. You can not completely draft your way to sustainable success any longer (although you need to do that well too).

2014: Revis
2013: Harvin & Lynch
2012: Boldin
2011: Antrel Rolle
2010: Charles Woodson
2009: Randall Gay, Sharper, Vilma


In all those cases one of the top 5 players on their team for their SB run was acquired via a trade or on the FA market and signed to a top value contract for their position.

An NFL team trying to build completely via the draft these days is on the right path because the draft is first and foremost the key to success. But teams have to supplement via FA and trades in this era of football.

People are letting the new NFL numbers scare them. They just don't realize how Suh's contract in 3 years isn't going to look completely outrageous and how by that point there will be plenty of defensive players within that zip code as the cap is going to continue to go up and up and up to the point that in 3 years we are going to be staring at a near $180M cap at least.

The last team to win it all without a big ticket FA or trade for a big ticket player was the '08 Steeler's.

Yep DEAD on I agree with everything that you wrote here...

 

[Southieinnc]

Unless the Suh bankruptcy works this year, it's a bust. Next years $27 million cap hit will hobble the Miami efforts to improve. This year they should be better.
Everybody (rightfully) is looking at dethroning the Patriots. I get this.
Are you considering Tannehill throwing against Cromartie, Revis and Skrine?
Are you sure Buffalo will not be able to run against your improved line?
Remember - the improved AFC East will hurt buffalo, Jets and Miami also!!!!!

 

[ducky]

Unless the Suh bankruptcy works this year, it's a bust. Next years $27 million cap hit will hobble the Miami efforts to improve.

Cap hit means nothing. It's just numbers on a piece of paper. NFL teams are more limited by available cash on hand than they are by the cap. It's been that way since the new CBA was signed.

One of the comparable contracts in Watt was due for a big 2nd year and they just restructured his contract pushing the cap hit forward.

And of course you are just trolling here. Just a few posts before you were saying building via FA didn't work and now this contract hurts because they can't build via FA moving forward. Which is it exactly?

Suh isn't going to hurt the Phins unless his play severely declines. Having an elite defensive lineman on the team, even at a big "cap number" (not that that really means anything), isn't a killer at all in today's game. Look around the league. Contracts are big.

As I said awhile back in this thread, the difference between the Dophins resigning Jared Odrick (he signed with Atlanta) and keeping Mike Wallace is about the same amount of coin over the next few years as just Suh will cost them moving forward more or less. If the Dolphin's would have went that route, would you be here saying how they can never afford to improve the team moving forward? Of course not.

Contracts like these can most certainly fail. But they also can succeed. Instead of paying two solid but far from great players at two positions, they are using that money to sign one game changing player. If Suh fails to be a game changer then it fails. But if Suh stays the dominant player he has been, then he is easily worth two solid players.

 

[Jakology]

The fear is already setting in I see. I understand. Wouldn't want Brady to have any grass stains on his jersey.

 

[FlyerFinFan]

Cap hit means nothing. It's just numbers on a piece of paper. NFL teams are more limited by available cash on hand than they are by the cap. It's been that way since the new CBA was signed.

One of the comparable contracts in Watt was due for a big 2nd year and they just restructured his contract pushing the cap hit forward.

And of course you are just trolling here. Just a few posts before you were saying building via FA didn't work and now this contract hurts because they can't build via FA moving forward. Which is it exactly?

Suh isn't going to hurt the Phins unless his play severely declines. Having an elite defensive lineman on the team, even at a big "cap number" (not that that really means anything), isn't a killer at all in today's game. Look around the league. Contracts are big.

As I said awhile back in this thread, the difference between the Dophins resigning Jared Odrick (he signed with Atlanta) and keeping Mike Wallace is about the same amount of coin over the next few years as just Suh will cost them moving forward more or less. If the Dolphin's would have went that route, would you be here saying how they can never afford to improve the team moving forward? Of course not.

Contracts like these can most certainly fail. But they also can succeed. Instead of paying two solid but far from great players at two positions, they are using that money to sign one game changing player. If Suh fails to be a game changer then it fails. But if Suh stays the dominant player he has been, then he is easily worth two solid players.

He's not wrong about the AFCE it's going to be a blood bath. Brady will have to dodge 6 games of insane dline play as all of the teams can hurt a QB. It will be interesting that's for sure I just hope that they don't wash all of their divisional games and let inferior teams from other weak divisions get in.

 

[Southieinnc]

Cap hit means nothing. It's just numbers on a piece of paper. NFL teams are more limited by available cash on hand than they are by the cap. It's been that way since the new CBA was signed.

One of the comparable contracts in Watt was due for a big 2nd year and they just restructured his contract pushing the cap hit forward.

And of course you are just trolling here. Just a few posts before you were saying building via FA didn't work and now this contract hurts because they can't build via FA moving forward. Which is it exactly?

Suh isn't going to hurt the Phins unless his play severely declines. Having an elite defensive lineman on the team, even at a big "cap number" (not that that really means anything), isn't a killer at all in today's game. Look around the league. Contracts are big.

As I said awhile back in this thread, the difference between the Dophins resigning Jared Odrick (he signed with Atlanta) and keeping Mike Wallace is about the same amount of coin over the next few years as just Suh will cost them moving forward more or less. If the Dolphin's would have went that route, would you be here saying how they can never afford to improve the team moving forward? Of course not.

Contracts like these can most certainly fail. But they also can succeed. Instead of paying two solid but far from great players at two positions, they are using that money to sign one game changing player. If Suh fails to be a game changer then it fails. But if Suh stays the dominant player he has been, then he is easily worth two solid players.

I looked back and cannot find a post that what you say I said. Please enlighten me.

You used Watt as an example of re-structure - that is totally dependent on willingness of the player to sign.
Trolling, of course I am. I am giving a division rival a hard time.
I made my point and some disagree. Is it that surprising that some fans think $114 million contract is a good deal?
Is it that surprising that some fans think Miami just bought the farm?
So is Miami now the AFC East champions to be?????

 

[ducky]

I looked back and cannot find a post that what you say I said. Please enlighten me.

You used Watt as an example of re-structure - that is totally dependent on willingness of the player to sign.
Trolling, of course I am. I am giving a division rival a hard time.
I made my point and some disagree. Is it that surprising that some fans think $114 million contract is a good deal?
Is it that surprising that some fans think Miami just bought the farm?
So is Miami now the AFC East champions to be?????

Odrick + Wallace would have cost Miami an average of about $18M per season. Suh averages right around $19M. If all the Dolphins do is resign Odrick and keep Wallace would anyone even for a second thought about the possible cap hell Miami is facing? No. One big Suh contract is the exact same as two good vet contracts. Miami choose to move forward with 1 great player rather than 2 solid but not great players.

There are obviously other factors that make those two scenarios different (Suh costs more cash up front and the promises to him last longer) but in terms of cap hits over the next 3 seasons they are virtually identical (or can be made so with the sweep of a pen).

Restructures are not gifts from players. It's paperwork. The media is idiotic when it comes to reporting it. ESPN for Watt's contract restructure the other day had the opening line of the story "Watt is the gift that keeps on giving" or something to that effect. It's moronic. All Watt did was agree to take a huge check that Houston was scheduled to pay him and agreed to call it a signing bonus instead of a roster bonus. He isn't getting paid one cent less than what he was scheduled to make. And in fact by accepting to make the change, it actually decreases the likelihood that Houston would cut him in the future if his play severely declined tomorrow because the new structure of the contract would increase his accelerated cap hit if Houston released or traded.

There are times when players give back money. But Miami wouldn't be asking Suh to do that. They would just be asking him to take the same amount of money he was scheduled to make and call it something else. And in Suh's case it would be more beneficial to him because he would be converting a huge base salary to a signing bonus so he would get $15M of the $23M of the base salary he is due to make as game checks and get it paid up front before the season starts as a signing bonus. And if the Phin's do that they can turn his cap hit next year from $28M to less than $17M. As I said: Cap hit is nothing more but numbers on a piece of paper. All of it is easily manipulated. And pushing cap hits forward these days isn't that big of deal knowing that a $180M salary cap looms in the future before Suh's contract ever plays out.