Kaepernick's Potential Contract Extension

[purguy12]

I guess it depends on your definition of "good." Here's a list of QBs I think are better than Kap:

Brady
Roethlisberger
Luck
Manning
Manning
Rivers
Romo
Stafford
Rodgers
Ryan
Brees

And I think it's debatable who is better amongst Newton, Wilson, and Kap. I'm not convinced he's better than Cutler or Foles. At best he's the 12th best QB, and he could be somewhere between the 15th-17th.

I don't want to pay a guy like that 20 million a year unless he greatly improves, and I don't think he gave any indication this season that he is going to improve. At best, he stagnated. Great athlete and a lot of potential no doubt but I wouldn't say he's a "good" QB at this point.

I'm so glad you're posting again. I think I speak for all of us when I say that we missed your salty, bitter ass imac. How you been brother? And where have you been? Did you get buried under a snowdrift or attacked by a moose or something? This board is worse without you, please post more!

That's a very bad list.

 

[purguy12]

how much of it was the QB, and how much of it was the TEAM? did the QB 'carry' the team, or the team carried the QB?

Kaep certainly did his share and IS worth re-signing, but "starting QB that made it to the super bowl...", and "good playoff record" is a little misleading.

it is similar to saying "Alex Smith is a winning QB and made it to the NFC Championship game, thus deserves............"

Kap carried the team.(Playoffs), Regular season the team carried him for most part in the 2 seasons.

What Kap has done in the playoffs in his young Career is some what amazing. He has already had a couple great games. 2 games against GB, Atlanta and in the superbowl where the Defense choked and let Flacco look like Joe Montana.

 

[yossarian]

I don't think signing Kap to 18-20 mil per year as he is reportedly looking for is all that unreasonable. He has flaws in his game that we've flogged to death here on this board, but I think he can and will improve on those flaws. Also I can think of very few other young quarterbacks I'd rather have right now, and no one is pointing out any stud qb in the draft that we should take over Kaepernick. And I'm going to say this until I'm blue in the face, for all of Kaepernick's stubbornness in going to Crabtree at the end of the super bowl and the NFC title game, to me the defense was the culprit in both of those games more than anything else --- if we had good cb play in those games we'd have two Super Bowl rings by now. I still can't get over that fucking 4th down, offside td pass by Wilson, jesus fucking christ.

 

[MHSL82]

Kap carried the team.(Playoffs), Regular season the team carried him for most part in the 2 seasons.

What Kap has done in the playoffs in his young Career is some what amazing. He has already had a couple great games. 2 games against GB, Atlanta and in the superbowl where the Defense choked and let Flacco look like Joe Montana.

Defense made the crucial stop in the Atlanta game. Carolina was a team game and had the dropped INT. Green Bay had that dropped INT at the end, but yes, he was the reason we won. The offense had its problems in the SB and that created pressure on the defense. The defense played pretty well to allow the comeback. A TD instead of a FG makes the Crabtree pass not even an option to win. The defense played well to prevent a touchdown on Seattle's last two field goals that the offense caused. They got us in the red zone on the first possession with Wilson's fumble.

It's a team game and both did a great job with mistakes or lapses. Maybe we needed to play a different game plan in the playoffs? Stick to the regular season formula, just execute better. When we needed it in the Saints game, Alex turned it up - a guy you would expect it less than from Kaepernick. So maybe a regular season gameplan with a stepped up Kaepernick gets us the wins? We had to comeback in the Atlanta game because of aggressive three and outs to start the game.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

That's a very bad list.

Not that I agree with that list entirely, but I wonder what yours looks like.

 

[whysies]

Not that I agree with that list entirely, but I wonder what yours looks like.

Should be good.

I'm kind of curious who you would quibble with Crimson. I'm guessing Big Ben, Rivers, Romo, Stafford, and Eli?

Another guy I forgot about that I'm not convinced Kap is better than is Vick

 

[MHSL82]

Should be good.

I'm kind of curious who you would quibble with Crimson. I'm guessing Big Ben, Rivers, Romo, Stafford, and Eli?

Another guy I forgot about that I'm not convinced Kap is better than is Vick

Easy. His list is Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Drew Brees, and maybe Luck long term. Tom and Peyton are old, so throw them out.

Just kidding.

 

[Ltrain]

Warning: link to Cohn article Kaepernick salary demand out of line |

Has anyone read this drivel? This one has to take the cake even for POS Cohn in a personal attack barrage on Kap and the potential contract extension.

 

[badazzk9]

Warning: link to Cohn article Kaepernick salary demand out of line |

Has anyone read this drivel? This one has to take the cake even for POS Cohn in a personal attack barrage on Kap and the potential contract extension.

Kaps mom did...

Kaepernick?s mom takes issue with columnist?s criticism | ProFootballTalk

 

[purguy12]

Not that I agree with that list entirely, but I wonder what yours looks like.

1.Braady
2.Manning
3.Rogers
4.Brees
5.Ryan
6.Big Ben(on the decline) Might not be in my top 10 next year.
7.Eli(On the decline) Might not be in my Top 10 next year
8.Kap
9.Luck
10.Rivers
11.Wilson
12.Cutler
13. Stafford
14.Romo
15. Cam

12,13,14 can be any order. I can understand if people put Luck in front of Kap. I would rather have Kap. Thats my opinion. This is off the top of my head. Not much thought put into this. Maybe I would change a couple if I really thought about it.

 

[badazzk9]

1.Braady
2.Manning
3.Rogers
4.Brees
5.Ryan
6.Big Ben(on the decline) Might not be in my top 10 next year.
7.Eli(On the decline) Might not be in my Top 10 next year
8.Kap
9.Luck
10.Rivers
11.Wilson
12.Cutler
13. Stafford
14.Romo
15. Cam

12,13,14 can be any order. I can understand if people put Luck in front of Kap. I would rather have Kap. Thats my opinion. This is off the top of my head. Not much thought put into this. Maybe I would change a couple if I really thought about it.

 

[-AC-]

Brady
Manning
Rodgers
Brees

Romo
Rivers

Cutler
Stafford
Roethlesberger
Luck
Wilson
Kaepernick
Ryan

Manning
Palmer
Flacco
RG3
Newton
Smith

I left Foles out because it's too small of a sample size to judge him accurately... I didn't rank each player individually, instead I grouped them... I have Kap in the 7-13 group, and I think that is fair when compared to the others in the group and looking at the body of work for each player...

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Should be good.

I'm kind of curious who you would quibble with Crimson. I'm guessing Big Ben, Rivers, Romo, Stafford, and Eli?

Another guy I forgot about that I'm not convinced Kap is better than is Vick

If we're talking better right now, there aren't many I disagree with. If we're talking better going forward, I think Kap probably moves up several spots.

If we're talking right now, Stafford is probably the big one for me. The guy has talent, but he's not a winner. He doesn't have the overall supporting cast Kap does, but he has Megatron which is an awful lot. I'm curious to see what happens to Ben next year; he looked like he was kind of falling apart this past year. The question is whether he had a genuine injury, or if he's breaking down. I'd take Rivers over Kap right now as a QB. Eli is a tough call for me; he similar to Kap in that he's not statistically great, struggles with accuracy, but can really come through in the clutch. I probably would take him if my goal was to win next year.

Kap is tough to call, because he has shown he's a winner. But he's got a lot of flaws in his game. Considering the strength of the defense, and the pieces he has on offense, there is no other QB in the league who has it as easy as he does IMO. So he's tough to get a handle on. Ultimately, I think Imac is right and we should try to extend him, even if we start pushing $18 million, but given our relatively strong bargaining position this year, I'd really try to get him down around $15-16 million and a favorable structure.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Warning: link to Cohn article Kaepernick salary demand out of line |

Has anyone read this drivel? This one has to take the cake even for POS Cohn in a personal attack barrage on Kap and the potential contract extension.

I think Lowell feels his storied place as biggest blowhard in Bay Area sports media is being threatened by his son. This is perhaps the most idiotic article I've ever read. I feel bad I clicked on the link. His vilification of Kaepernick for trying to get the best contract he can is just ridiculous. What is rude about starting negotiations at a high price? It seems to me that is prudent negotiating.

Gotta say, though, in some ways I absolutely love this:

If the 49ers give Kaepernick the money the Globe says he wants, that will sink the whole franchise. For a quarterback who’s still learning? Imagine what Billy Beane would do in a parallel situation. He’d get a new quarterback.

He spends the entire article railing about how coming close isn't good enough, and then cites the example of a GM who has never won the world series, and only made the ALCS once. If what Harbaugh has accomplished is failure, then Beane has been an abject failure for nearly two decades. That's not a knock on Beane at all; what he's done with the resources available is phenomenal. But Cohn is so clearly just trying to stir shit up that he can make an asinine comparison like this one and not even blink.

 

[purguy12]

My list does change if we are talking about starting a Franchise with a QB.


Starting Franchise:


1.Rogers
2.Ryan
3.Luck (Yes I would take him over Kap if I was starting a Franchise just because I like Drop Back QBs)
4.Kap
5.Newton
6.Stafford
7.Wilson
8.Flacco
9. Foles
10.RG3


Leaving out Brady,Manning and Brees because of Age. Rivers because of Age and don't know if he can lead. Romo just not a winner and always had weapons and couldn't win. Eli and Big Ben is out because they aren't hungry anymore.

 

[Ray_Dogg]

Ryan over Luck

 

[maniax]

If I was starting a franchise today I would take one of Kap, Luck, Newton, Foles as the QB.
That is my short list. Rodgers is great but to me he's at the top of my group B because he's already 30 years old.

People who say Brady or Manning are the best QBs in the NFL need a reality check. Manning totally sucked against Seattle, he couldn't of have sucked more. He's old and I think he's done championship wise. Sure he can rule the AFC west for a few more years. And what has Brady done lately? Also another team that just beats up every year on the AFC east and then bows out in the playoffs.

 

[yossarian]

I think Lowell feels his storied place as biggest blowhard in Bay Area sports media is being threatened by his son. This is perhaps the most idiotic article I've ever read. I feel bad I clicked on the link. His vilification of Kaepernick for trying to get the best contract he can is just ridiculous. What is rude about starting negotiations at a high price? It seems to me that is prudent negotiating.

Gotta say, though, in some ways I absolutely love this:

If the 49ers give Kaepernick the money the Globe says he wants, that will sink the whole franchise. For a quarterback who’s still learning? Imagine what Billy Beane would do in a parallel situation. He’d get a new quarterback.

He spends the entire article railing about how coming close isn't good enough, and then cites the example of a GM who has never won the world series, and only made the ALCS once. If what Harbaugh has accomplished is failure, then Beane has been an abject failure for nearly two decades. That's not a knock on Beane at all; what he's done with the resources available is phenomenal. But Cohn is so clearly just trying to stir shit up that he can make an asinine comparison like this one and not even blink.

I read that article, I'm sorry to say. Cohn is just an huge douchebag. Unbelievable. The amount of personal attacks in that column made me think it was written by a sixth grader.

 

[SeattleNinersFan]

Warning: link to Cohn article Kaepernick salary demand out of line |

Has anyone read this drivel? This one has to take the cake even for POS Cohn in a personal attack barrage on Kap and the potential contract extension.

Ltrain, thanks for calling out that it was a Cohn article! I hate that guy so much and now he won't benefit from my traffic.

 

[AngryNiner]

You forgot a key part of this. They were tired of paying huge contracts to players who hadn't taken a snap in the NFL



Some of these guys you list are on their 3rd or 4th contract. It's also important to consider the change in salary cap. Of course Peyton Manning wasn't making 18M per year in 2004. Manning's 04 contract averaged 14M per year (98M for 7 years), but the salary cap that year was $80.582M. If Kap were to get 18M per year on a $133M cap he takes up 13.5%. 14M with an 80M cap is 17.5%.

Simply put, you can't compare contracts from 10 years ago to contracts today. The most Montana ever made in a year was 3.25M. We can't use that as a standard to judge today's QB salaries.



They will. They have to. Unless you want to role out Tim Rattay 2.0 in 2015.



They spread the wealth when they got rid of Jeff Garcia too. They went 8 straight years without making the playoffs, and earned them the first overall pick, the 6th overall pick, the 11th, the 7th, the 10th, the 13th, and the 7th pick overall. That's 7 straight years with a top 15 pick because we chose not to pay a QB.



No, it hasn't.



That contract is an insult to Kaepernick and shows a significant lack of understanding of NFL economics on your part. If you managed to coerce him into that contract, you'd be dealing with a QB holdout in the very near future.

After reading your last paragraph, I really regret taking the time to type of the responses I did.

1) No I didnt.

2) I am not comparing contracts from 10 years ago. Kaepernick is no where near worth the talent Manning was in 04. Yet the 11-13 per number I threw out at the end of my post is close to the 14 mil per Manning got. So the problem here is that I value Kaep a lot less then you do.
Also, you sort of made a point for me. Those guy were on their 3rd or 4th contracts, meaning they have a body of work to back up their worth and overblown rookie contracts that inflated it.
Kaep has played in 29 games with some pretty god awful performances in there. How in the hell can you possibly justify 18 mil per under his resume. It just isnt gunna happen.
Your point about Montana's contract doest have much to do with my point. Thats what he was worth back when he played. He is also JOE MONTANA!
My point there, is that the guys except Flacco and Cutler were top QBs that have a body of work and some pretty out standing stats to back them up. Where is Kaepernicks stats to back up that massive contract? He is not worth Top Dollar yet.

3) You are talking about an entirely different situation. Did Tim Rattay have half the talent the 49ers have now? No.
Did Tim Rattay have the coaching staff the 49ers have now? No.
There is more then 1 model of success to follow. With the 49ers and the Seahawks doing what they did, i thought that made it apparent to anyone paying attention, You dont need a great QB to win a championship in the NFL.

4) They are spreading the wealth now and have been picking in the last 3 years 30, 31, and 30. Also then as opposed to now again no talent on the roster and that was because of years worth of cap hell brought on by careless spending in the past. Do you foresee that happing again any time soon under the current front office?

5) It hasnt been successful so far?
That same amount of success, is your biggest argument for why Kap is such a good QB. Its is going to be the biggest point for Kaepernicks reps in negotiations.

6) Kaep's feelers are the least of my concerns.
Not a hold out. A renegotiation in about 3 or 4 years. That buys time to really see what he is made of.

After reading your last paragraph, I really regret taking the time to type of the responses I did.

You're so smart.

SMART SMART SMART