Jose Bautista To Phillies?

[jvett77]

I started reading the CSN article on Bautista and came to this:

He's also missed September two years in a row.
His 2013 ended with a hip injury; his last game was Aug. 25.
His 2012 ended with a wrist injury that he tried, but failed, to come back from. His final game was Aug. 20.
Bautista's 33. Dom Brown is 26.

If Amaro gets this guy for Brown, he really is insane.

 

[_phiLLies_]

i watch baseball and came to this..

2010: 54 HR, 124 rbi, .995 ops, 6.6 WAR
2011: 43 HR, 103 rbi, 1.055 ops, 7.7 WAR
2012: 27 HR, 65 rbi, .885 ops, 3.2 WAR
2013: 28 HR, 73 rbi, .856 ops, 4.1 WAR

brown..

2013: 27 HR, 83 rbi, .818 ops, 2.5 WAR

a hurt bautista is better than a breakout year brown. domonic isn't near his level and never will be. can't be said enough times already, brown is a client of boras. he will be a FA in 4 years. regardless of what he does.. if he's still here, he will not be worth signing.

with the payroll we have and the tv deal upcoming.. 3 years of bautista is significantly better than 4 years of brown. it all comes down to who these other players would be that go along with brown.

we still have the starting pitching with hamels, lee, mag as a top 3. biddle and morgan are very good prospects. you fix the pen and come out with a lineup like this, the team looks pretty fucking good..

revere
rollins
utley
bautista
howard
byrd
asche
(catcher)

guys like ruf and hernandez on the bench. maybe not "pretty fucking good".. but a hell of a lot better than these last 2 years. you'd also have franco in the mix. if not this year, then next season.

but then again, the whole thing can easily be a wild story.

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

you have no clue what you're talking about. the phils big piece for halladay was kyle drabek, who has a career 5.37 era due to inconsistency and injuries. he's already 26 next month and has had multiple TJS. the secondary piece was travis d'arnaud, who went on to tear it up in the minors and was eventually traded to the mets. he looked like crap when called up last year and is turning 25 in a few months. and then there was michael taylor.. who is 28 next month, owns a career .135 average in the majors and is a zero.

for lee.. it's well known the phils easily raked the indians in that deal. it was embarrassing.

so how you figure they "gutted the farm".. i have no idea.

So at the time you're telling me that TDA was not a top prospect? And we're judging him off of a month a half up with the Mets who are awful? lol

 

[Cobiemonster]

you have no clue what you're talking about. the phils big piece for halladay was kyle drabek, who has a career 5.37 era due to inconsistency and injuries. he's already 26 next month and has had multiple TJS. the secondary piece was travis d'arnaud, who went on to tear it up in the minors and was eventually traded to the mets. he looked like crap when called up last year and is turning 25 in a few months. and then there was michael taylor.. who is 28 next month, owns a career .135 average in the majors and is a zero.

for lee.. it's well known the phils easily raked the indians in that deal. it was embarrassing.

so how you figure they "gutted the farm".. i have no idea.

I agree about the Doc deal - they didn't gut the farm for that - all 30 teams would have made that deal - what Doc did for the Phillies those first two seasons was incredible

Cliff Lee deal wasn't bad either, they gave up a bunch of nobodies to the Indians

The issue with RAJ was more so the Shane Victorino/Hunter Pence trades - they're still searching for those big bats when they could have just kept those guys - nobody the Phillies got in those trades look like they're going to amount to anything, not even Tommy Joseph

Issue with the Phillies is the last 4-5 years they haven't drafted for shit - that's where they need better scouting - if they drafted better in the last 4-5 years they wouldn't have to fill so many holes

RAJ is not a great GM by any stretch of the imagination, he's done some really dumb things that are indefensible - but ever since they let Mike Arbuckle go, the scouting/drafting has gone to shit - when Mike Arbuckle was there, it allowed Ruben to be able to make those big deals, now, it's harder to do so

 

[Cobiemonster]

i watch baseball and came to this..

2010: 54 HR, 124 rbi, .995 ops, 6.6 WAR
2011: 43 HR, 103 rbi, 1.055 ops, 7.7 WAR
2012: 27 HR, 65 rbi, .885 ops, 3.2 WAR
2013: 28 HR, 73 rbi, .856 ops, 4.1 WAR

brown..

2013: 27 HR, 83 rbi, .818 ops, 2.5 WAR

a hurt bautista is better than a breakout year brown. domonic isn't near his level and never will be. can't be said enough times already, brown is a client of boras. he will be a FA in 4 years. regardless of what he does.. if he's still here, he will not be worth signing.

with the payroll we have and the tv deal upcoming.. 3 years of bautista is significantly better than 4 years of brown. it all comes down to who these other players would be that go along with brown.

we still have the starting pitching with hamels, lee, mag as a top 3. biddle and morgan are very good prospects. you fix the pen and come out with a lineup like this, the team looks pretty fucking good..

revere
rollins
utley
bautista
howard
byrd
asche
(catcher)

guys like ruf and hernandez on the bench. maybe not "pretty fucking good".. but a hell of a lot better than these last 2 years. you'd also have franco in the mix. if not this year, then next season.

but then again, the whole thing can easily be a wild story.

As I've said all along, I love Dom Brown and his personality, he had a breakout season, but he might be the type that peaks at 27-28 years old - he's not a 22-23 youngster like a lot of these teams have, he was a late bloomer and if you can get someone that can be better for the next 2-3 years, knowing that Dom Brown and Scott Boras might get in a sticky contract scenario, why not give it a shot? They have kids like Mikael Franco coming up that might be able to fill the offensive void very soon anyways

People have to realize, when you lose 89 games and are as pathetic as the Phillies are, nobody should be criticizing the Phillies for trying to at least explore every possible deal - I don't blame them for this move - I gave them a lot of crap for even thinking about moving Dom for Soriano last offseason but Dom for Joey Bats is more understandable

A lot of people love Dom Brown, I do too, but some Phillies fans are hypocrites - they hate certain players and want no part of them but then they'll love certain players and never want them to be moved and they'll be short sighted in the regard that they tell people to not be enamored over specific players but they'll do the same thing - Phillies need to explore just about every option - they've gotten worse and worse the last two years, it's not like it's a guarantee that these guys are going to automatically get better - there are a lot of things this team has to improve on - they were not good in any category this past season, not one - they weren't good at hitting, they weren't good at starting pitching nor the bullpen so all avenues have to be explored

EDIT: For example, some Phillies fans were criticized for being enamored over Hunter Pence, a guy who has been consistent year after year since he came into the league in 2007 but nobody is criticizing Phillies fans for being enamored over Dom Brown, a 27 year old player that has had one good season, and every Phillies fan wants him on this team for life - If they kept Hunter Pence(a right handed hitter they desperately needed), they could have moved Dom Brown for either a true LF/CF or starting pitching

Phillies fans probably wish they still had Hunter Pence now, knowing the situation this team is in

 

[Omar 382]

Mixed feelings toward this. It wouldn't be the worst trade in the world, but I don't want to give up Dom unless I know for sure we will be getting real value back. The positives of Bautista are that he is under contract for the next three years, is a versatile player, plays decent defense, and is a right handed power bat. The bad news is that the price will be steeper than just Brown (at least according to Jon Heyman), Bautista is 33, Bautista has been injury riddled, and Bautista's power has been declining every year since that breakout year in 2010. I say no deal, but I've seen worse trades/moves happen. If the Phillies sign Ruiz to a 2 year 20 million dollar contract, then I will get really angry.

 

[BPNAZ]

Lol, Howard Eskin is such a tool

 

[_phiLLies_]

So at the time you're telling me that TDA was not a top prospect? And we're judging him off of a month a half up with the Mets who are awful? lol

no, he wasn't. i believe baseball america might have had him just inside their top 100.. but his season that year at single A ball wasn't anything special. neither was his next season with the blue jays. it wasn't until 2011 that he started to ball big time and turned into an upper level prospect. regardless, in the end, he's a catcher that's already turning 25. 2 teams parted with him before he even touched MLB action.

what else do you have to judge him by? he was called up, only threw out a weak 20% of runners and provided a horrific .549 ops in 99 AB. the phils received 2 amazing years out of halladay in return for 3 guys who have done absolutely nothing so far. and only one has the chance to score himself a decent career.

 

[northeastphillyguy]

Let's face it,Amaro does not give a crap about the farm players. He thinks that the farm is there for supplying relief pitchers and strictly call ups for injured players. Amaro loves to trade and buy, I believe it is like a mental illness for him. Our real needs are pitchers,starters and relievers. Even if we gave Asche and Ruf starting roles next season,along with a healthy Howard and Dom Brown, we would have an improved team. Before we trade and buy,I would like to see the young players such as hernandez get some playing time as well. But Amaro is short sighted and Moronic,so we will have to live with his decisions.

 

[John]

i want the team to go more towards the young side as well. however, you need established players with them to be successful. who are you going to find at age 22 to possibly hit 35-40 homers, command respect and be a force?

What good is a lineup filled with 35 year olds who can no longer hit?
If they don't get younger, in 2 years they are going to be really, really bad - 100 loss bad.

 

[Caligula]

i watch baseball and came to this..

2010: 54 HR, 124 rbi, .995 ops, 6.6 WAR
2011: 43 HR, 103 rbi, 1.055 ops, 7.7 WAR
2012: 27 HR, 65 rbi, .885 ops, 3.2 WAR
2013: 28 HR, 73 rbi, .856 ops, 4.1 WAR

brown..

2013: 27 HR, 83 rbi, .818 ops, 2.5 WAR

a hurt bautista is better than a breakout year brown. domonic isn't near his level and never will be. can't be said enough times already, brown is a client of boras. he will be a FA in 4 years. regardless of what he does.. if he's still here, he will not be worth signing.

with the payroll we have and the tv deal upcoming.. 3 years of bautista is significantly better than 4 years of brown. it all comes down to who these other players would be that go along with brown.

we still have the starting pitching with hamels, lee, mag as a top 3. biddle and morgan are very good prospects. you fix the pen and come out with a lineup like this, the team looks pretty fucking good..

revere
rollins
utley
bautista
howard
byrd
asche
(catcher)

guys like ruf and hernandez on the bench. maybe not "pretty fucking good".. but a hell of a lot better than these last 2 years. you'd also have franco in the mix. if not this year, then next season.

but then again, the whole thing can easily be a wild story.

You're putting Asche in the outfield?

 

[powerchord86]

Sounds like a stretch.

 

[Retroram52]

Number one has this one correct. It is not about being enamored with a player. It is about getting equal or greater value for a player. In the Bautista for Brown scenario, we lose. And we all know Amaro doesn't have a clue. So again, this is not a good idea until we get equal or better value for Brown.

 

[jvett77]

Bautista is a very good 33 year old player as the stats above show, even with the last two years of injuries, however, getting him adds another "if" to the Phillies next year where others on the team must also come back healthy. Brown is 26 and just had a breakout season. We should keep Brown.

 

[Arizona_Sting]

Don't believe in every little rumor or tweet you see during the offseason. It'll hurt your head.

 

[Caligula]

Don't believe in every little rumor or tweet you see during the offseason. It'll hurt your head.

There is no rumor or tweet dumb enough to make any of us think Amaro isn't capable of doing it. The dumber the rumor the higher the probability of it being accurate.

 

[powerchord86]

Don't believe in every little rumor or tweet you see during the offseason. It'll hurt your head.

This is good advice.

 

[lhagen931]

I started reading the CSN article on Bautista and came to this:

He's also missed September two years in a row.
His 2013 ended with a hip injury; his last game was Aug. 25.
His 2012 ended with a wrist injury that he tried, but failed, to come back from. His final game was Aug. 20.
Bautista's 33. Dom Brown is 26.

If Amaro gets this guy for Brown, he really is insane.

If Amaro does this, he should definitely be fired, IMO

 

[Cedrique]

So at the time you're telling me that TDA was not a top prospect? And we're judging him off of a month a half up with the Mets who are awful? lol

A month and a half isn't enough to judge someone. It's also not enough time to call him "TDA". Spell his name you lazy bastard

 

[Cedrique]

Who keeps floating the idea out there that Bautista has more value than he would otherwise because he has played third base in the past? Hopefully not Amaro. I've seen his track record with stuff like this. "It's under control, we have Ty Wigginton, who can play first, third and outfield, and three days a week we'll be starting Thome at first base...........oh, that didn't work out? I've got it, we'll sign Michael Young. I know he's been DHing for two years but he can just step in and play third base for us...throw in Delmon Young for the outfield as well- problem solved".

It's not a fantasy league, Rube when you put a guy at third base he actually has to field the position......

T