Ian Rapoport NFLN: Bears have "Buyers Remorse", wanted to bench Jay at halftime of TB game

[beardown07]

We may be the worst-coached team in football, at all 3 phases.

I don't necessarily dislike Trestman's Offense, but his overall management of the team and game's is awful.

Tucker will never be a DC again.

DeCamillas was obviously overrated.

What the fuck does Kromer even do? I mean, I get that he does shit, but if he's not calling the plays, I don't really give a fuck about what else he does.


This team is a back-alley abortion.

 

[thunderspirit]

Is this also an indictment of Trestman's overall lack of control of the team?

Probably, yep.

The real question is: does it matter to any of the people with authority to do something in Halas Hall?

My guess is no.
I sincerely hope I'm wrong.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

The Lovie haters may want to ignore this, but this was exactly the kind of thing Smith excelled at preventing from happening.

That being said, it is sad that everyone around Cutler has to say and then apologize for what is the obvious truth. What's sad is the one who really should be held accountable is acting like he is the only who is not to blame. Stop shaking your head, Jay, because although Kromer was tactless and betrayed the locker room, at the end of the day, he was dead on right. The only head shaking Cutler should be doing is at himself, but he won't, and he will probably take the whole team down with the ship before he does.

 

[toooverbearing]

I'm wondering though with this... the complaint from Kromer was that Kromer would call a run play, the run play would be bad, and Jay wouldn't check out of it at the line of scrimmage? Meanwhile, we seem to barely run the ball as it is and the "experts" all bitch and moan about us not showing enough commitment to it.

For the crowd out there saying "Kromer is being punished for speaking the truth", how do you reconcile this? Also, can we agree that the problem wasn't whether what he said was truthful or not, but rather that he took it to the media anonymously instead of manning up to the players/coaches and telling them directly?

This is a bizarre situation. Kromer should be excused before the Saints game and either Trestman should assume the OC duties or promote Cavanaugh. In the off season, this team will have a lot of reorganizing to do. I think the team is like an alcoholic who just hit bottom.

 

[JoeyTourettes]

The Lovie haters may want to ignore this, but this was exactly the kind of thing Smith excelled at preventing from happening.

That being said, it is sad that everyone around Cutler has to say and then apologize for what is the obvious truth. What's sad is the one who really should be held accountable is acting like he is the only who is not to blame. Stop shaking your head, Jay, because although Kromer was tactless and betrayed the locker room, at the end of the day, he was dead on right. The only head shaking Cutler should be doing is at himself, but he won't, and he will probably take the whole team down with the ship before he does.

Yes he was... they were much more disciplined had a better "team" as much as it frustrated us fans of never getting any real information.
I don't want to start a thing here now... but Lovie also fired so many coordinators that if they was a problem He, the Coord., wasn't there long enough for it to fester ("Tell Martz to go fuck himself" -Jay Cutler) Also there was bad blood between the offense and defensive players for years under Lovie- and he never did anything about that. There was, still is... a rift between Urlacher/Briggs and offensive players.
*And now I just changed the whole board... No need to argue over this... back to regular scheduled bitching about Trestman and Cutler and Kromer. Lol... well... do what you want. LOL.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

I'm wondering though with this... the complaint from Kromer was that Kromer would call a run play, the run play would be bad, and Jay wouldn't check out of it at the line of scrimmage? Meanwhile, we seem to barely run the ball as it is and the "experts" all bitch and moan about us not showing enough commitment to it.

For the crowd out there saying "Kromer is being punished for speaking the truth", how do you reconcile this? Also, can we agree that the problem wasn't whether what he said was truthful or not, but rather that he took it to the media anonymously instead of manning up to the players/coaches and telling them directly?

This is a bizarre situation. Kromer should be excused before the Saints game and either Trestman should assume the OC duties or promote Cavanaugh. In the off season, this team will have a lot of reorganizing to do. I think the team is like an alcoholic who just hit bottom.

Fair questions, and of course we are only hearing partial half-truths from a bunch of people where everyone has self-interest and no one can probably be trusted. That being said...

The "run dilemma" is very hard to make sense out of, for the reasons you pointed out. I obviously don't know, but I have the following wild-ass guesses:

- they wanted Cutler to check to a different run, on the other side, rather than to a pass
- they are covering their own asses
- different stories refer to different problems at different points in time

The head-scratching part to me is that if Cutler was refusing to check out of runs, that means they were trying to somehow run even less, which somehow seems implausible.

I don't think anyone can doubt that he shouldn't have gone to the media. No doubt. However, I think we can understand that Kromer is probably frustrated as hell. Just like every single other OC in Cutler's history. But hey maybe they all just sucked. He probably lost his patience. Gee...that's not very hard to imagine. Not an excuse, because Kromer is paid to suck it up and not lose his cool, but I would definitely understand it.

See, even though I "understand" where Kromer is coming from, realistically, now the well is poisoned, and since the Bears seem to be all-in on Cutler, what are they gonna do? They have to live with whatever Cutler does. So if you were Trestman right now, why not just fire Kromer right now? Send the message. Why doesn't he? To save the season? Pfft. Give me a break. This season's done. Trestman won't fire him because he wants to try to save his own skin, and that's all there is to it.

 

[toooverbearing]

Silver lining: I think the Bears will have no choice but to build through the draft. I can't imagine quality free agents coming to this environment any time soon and I think Emery is smart enough not to pay the "toxic environment" premium to lure them.

 

[Dolemite censored]

I've said it once; I'll say it again.

Jay Cutler will be the starting QB of the Titans next season.

You heard it here first.

Titans should decline that penalty....

 

[averagejoe]

Do have a question for the board- Many in the media are now saying that Kromer should be fired on the spot for going outside the "code of the LR" and speaking to the media. Throwing his player under the bus...

Can the offensive meeting room believe what a coach is saying now in meetings- and support his game plan if they think he's just going to go to the media and shit on them afterward?

Let me answer it this way... There are co-workers and bosses that I do not trust. But if I were to allow it to affect my performance, then it would show. I would like to think that in a team sport, these guys would approach it the same way.

In some respects, the problems of distrust have already been there. It seems obvious from all of the dysfunction.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

Do have a question for the board- Many in the media are now saying that Kromer should be fired on the spot for going outside the "code of the LR" and speaking to the media. Throwing his player under the bus.

It sort of isn't Kromer's fault, but, yes, he should be fired. Right now. The Bears have established an atmosphere of no one being accountable this season. Someone along the way somewhere should have been thrown under the bus, even if it wasn't fair, to send the organization a message. A major benching, a cut job, a firing, something. Nothing like this has happened.

You think Marc Trestman would have benched Jonas Gray like Belichick has done - over something much more minor? Of course not. And who is the better coach? Sometimes, in this league, you have to go overboard, and not only are the Bears not overboard, they aren't even on the freaking boat. They are on the shore watching everyone else.

 

[JoeyTourettes]

Couple things that have been brought up or inferred in this thread...and in the media.
"Cutler is a coach killer. He's gotten a number of OC's & 2 Head Coaches fired"

Whatever you feel about Jay or his play- none of former Chicago OC's have gone on to other OC jobs or much success. (save for former QB coach Pep Hamilton...who has had all world Andrew Luck as his College and now Pro QB...and is still being questioned about his play calling.)


Denver:
2006-08: Rick Dennison: Now the OC for Houston... how's that look: Good? Defense was ranked 30th in '08 the 8-8 record did in Shananhan *Cutler was voted to Probowl.

Chicago:
2009: Turner- His last gig as an NFL OC was in CHI in 09. He is now the HC for Florida International University. (pep hamilton as qb coach/rookie coach) Ranked 19th. Def. ranked 21st.

2010-11: Mike Martz- Has not coached since. Jay was sacked 75 times in 25 games... Jay had a 17-8 record- from Wikipedia: Martz reportedly resigned over philosophical differences with Bears head coach Lovie Smith.

2012: Mike Tice: His one and only season as an OC. Is now an offensive line coach for one of the worst olines in the NFL. If I remember correctly he was hired as OC because- nobody would come for an interview, fearing Lovie was a lame duck coach. It was also reported at the time that he could run Martz's system and terminology (sound familiar?) with more focus on running the ball and protection.

 

[Chasin' Utleys]

I've said it once; I'll say it again.

Jay Cutler will be the starting QB of the Titans next season.

You heard it here first.

I wouldn't be too happy about that, I've lived just outside Chicago since 79' so I've seen both good Bears football and BAD Bears football.......Jay has a GREAT arm, alas his head is full of shoddy pinball parts. I know you're a Vandy fan, perhaps an alum. I am not digging on the school I have two buddies that graduated med school there, EXCELLENT university - but Jay, well he'sa not so smart football-wise (from what I see watching him weekly here in Burr Ridge) and he has A LOT of quit in him. Did a C+ job Denver and I think about the same here in Chicago. I had buddies here after the signing comparing him to Roethlisberger and Andy Daulton - one has won 2 of 3 Super Bowls, the other has the most touchdown passes in the league since 2011 (albeit has stunk up the joint the last three weeks). Pittsburgh has a crappy line like the Bears and Jay has receivers that are equal (on average) with Pittsburgh. Jay is slower than a Clydesdale in a tar pit and does not fair well when getting hit. After too many pocket collapses his game goes south, until junk time of course which is why he's a pretty decent fantasy QB (INTs notwithstanding).

 

[Chasin' Utleys]

It sort of isn't Kromer's fault, but, yes, he should be fired. Right now. The Bears have established an atmosphere of no one being accountable this season. Someone along the way somewhere should have been thrown under the bus, even if it wasn't fair, to send the organization a message. A major benching, a cut job, a firing, something. Nothing like this has happened.

You think Marc Trestman would have benched Jonas Gray like Belichick has done - over something much more minor? Of course not. And who is the better coach? Sometimes, in this league, you have to go overboard, and not only are the Bears not overboard, they aren't even on the freaking boat. They are on the shore watching everyone else.

For some reason I can't give you a 'thumbs up' for your insightful post, so here's a llama...

 

[Melman]

We may be the worst-coached team in football, at all 3 phases.

I don't necessarily dislike Trestman's Offense, but his overall management of the team and game's is awful.

+1

I think if there was any element of fear or respect for Trestman’s authority, I don’t think Kromer would ever had said anything to anyone in the media.

 

[Melman]

It sort of isn't Kromer's fault, but, yes, he should be fired. Right now. The Bears have established an atmosphere of no one being accountable this season. Someone along the way somewhere should have been thrown under the bus, even if it wasn't fair, to send the organization a message. A major benching, a cut job, a firing, something. Nothing like this has happened.

You think Marc Trestman would have benched Jonas Gray like Belichick has done - over something much more minor? Of course not. And who is the better coach? Sometimes, in this league, you have to go overboard, and not only are the Bears not overboard, they aren't even on the freaking boat. They are on the shore watching everyone else.

A message needs to be sent in the off-season alright… and at this point, I think Phil Emery is the only one who can really do it.

The more I think about it, I think Trestman should be cut loose. The team is obviously playing poorly, and the fact that his assistants seem to think (for any reason) that talking to guys like Ian Rapoport is a good idea isn’t an endorsement on the authority he wields (you mentioned Belichick… I doubt any of Bill’s assistants would have dared to do anything like that behind his back; not every coach can be Belichick, but every assistant should have the same level of respect for their boss and the locker room).

And it’s pretty clear that Trestman’s instincts on assistant coaches are questionable at best as well.

If Phil Emery tries making a silk purse out of the sow’s ear he’s stuck with right now, it could very well cost him his job if Trestman is incapable of getting the team to play better in 2015. If Emery breaks off Trestman now, a few of the talking heads in the media might question his overall judgment, but they’d also be the first ones to say “Why didn’t he do this before?” if Trestman can’t get it together next season.

 

[averagejoe]

I respect your opinions, guys, but...

• ...bringing up Hoodie and the benching of players - we just don't have the depth to do that. Plus Hoodie had Blount in 2013 so he knows what his skill-set could provide. Not to mention having Brady at the helm.
• ...binging up our former OC is stacking the deck so to speak. We can also thank Jerry Angelo for some of those hirings. Having a storied, original franchise that attracts zero quality OC candidates is more of an indictment on management - not the players. Especially just a few years removed from a Conference Championship game.

 

[thunderspirit]

Couple things that have been brought up or inferred in this thread...and in the media.
"Cutler is a coach killer. He's gotten a number of OC's & 2 Head Coaches fired"

Whatever you feel about Jay or his play- none of former Chicago OC's have gone on to other OC jobs or much success. (save for former QB coach Pep Hamilton...who has had all world Andrew Luck as his College and now Pro QB...and is still being questioned about his play calling.)


Denver:
2006-08: Rick Dennison: Now the OC for Houston... how's that look: Good? Defense was ranked 30th in '08 the 8-8 record did in Shananhan *Cutler was voted to Probowl.

Chicago:
2009: Turner- His last gig as an NFL OC was in CHI in 09. He is now the HC for Florida International University. (pep hamilton as qb coach/rookie coach) Ranked 19th. Def. ranked 21st.

2010-11: Mike Martz- Has not coached since. Jay was sacked 75 times in 25 games... Jay had a 17-8 record- from Wikipedia: Martz reportedly resigned over philosophical differences with Bears head coach Lovie Smith.

2012: Mike Tice: His one and only season as an OC. Is now an offensive line coach for one of the worst olines in the NFL. If I remember correctly he was hired as OC because- nobody would come for an interview, fearing Lovie was a lame duck coach. It was also reported at the time that he could run Martz's system and terminology (sound familiar?) with more focus on running the ball and protection.

This is an interesting point, JoeyT.

It doesn't absolve Cutler of his mistakes, but it's certainly worth putting on the board for discussion.

 

[JoeyTourettes]

...binging up our former OC is stacking the deck so to speak. We can also thank Jerry Angelo for some of those hirings. Having a storied, original franchise that attracts zero quality OC candidates is more of an indictment on management - not the players. Especially just a few years removed from a Conference Championship game.

Oh for sure- Angelo, but I think more-so Lovie Smith... It's been gone over enough, and I think overall agreed that, that group just couldn't get it done. There have been many factors why Jay Cutler hasn't succeeded as we all had hoped after the 09 trade. I think his 09 season and 26 picks was far worse then this Bears record setting QB season. I get that overall expectations and pay rates haven't been met... but if we can agree that the OC's were not that good- and I think the NFL also thinks that. How can that be his fault? Coach Killer... I take it the other way around- The OC's sucked... they helped ruin him.

It doesn't absolve Cutler of his mistakes, but it's certainly worth putting on the board for discussion.

Oh of course not. He's still the guy playing, still the guy throwing picks and fumbling. I just think too many (fans/media) put it just on him. Which I understand- he's the constant. He's the same one making similar mistakes. They can't blame those guys anymore. I think the money also get's people a little crazy too. It's not my money. I don't care one bit, I just like that they made the choice, and didn't leave it hanging for another year. I thought at the time the contract would kinda stop the bitching and second guessing...knowing he was going to be here for awhile... Boy was I wrong.

 

[richig07]

I wouldn't be too happy about that, I've lived just outside Chicago since 79' so I've seen both good Bears football and BAD Bears football.......Jay has a GREAT arm, alas his head is full of shoddy pinball parts. I know you're a Vandy fan, perhaps an alum. I am not digging on the school I have two buddies that graduated med school there, EXCELLENT university - but Jay, well he'sa not so smart football-wise (from what I see watching him weekly here in Burr Ridge) and he has A LOT of quit in him. Did a C+ job Denver and I think about the same here in Chicago. I had buddies here after the signing comparing him to Roethlisberger and Andy Daulton - one has won 2 of 3 Super Bowls, the other has the most touchdown passes in the league since 2011 (albeit has stunk up the joint the last three weeks). Pittsburgh has a crappy line like the Bears and Jay has receivers that are equal (on average) with Pittsburgh. Jay is slower than a Clydesdale in a tar pit and does not fair well when getting hit. After too many pocket collapses his game goes south, until junk time of course which is why he's a pretty decent fantasy QB (INTs notwithstanding).

Actually, I think Jay is incredibly intelligent football-wise. He's always had that rep amongst his teammates.

I just think he has a stubborn/shitty attitude, and doesn't do what coaches want to see when it comes to adjusting the play at the LOS.

 

[richig07]

Let me answer it this way... There are co-workers and bosses that I do not trust. But if I were to allow it to affect my performance, then it would show. I would like to think that in a team sport, these guys would approach it the same way.

In some respects, the problems of distrust have already been there. It seems obvious from all of the dysfunction.

I don't get it. Your answer to the problem, is just to allow to continue to spiral?

What Kromer did was absolutely wrong. Regardless of your opinion of Jay.