Historically worse offender of cupcake sched

[Codaxx]

I don't think the intention was to "disrespect" Miami. It was just the only way to help John Reaves attain a record that his coach & teammates thought he deserved. That being said, I can understand why some might not agree with it, but it was against Miami. The Canes deserve to be shit on as often as possible.

I remember TB Bucs did that once also. Must be a general lack of intelligence and sportsmanship in Florida

 

[boxedlunch]

I don't think the intention was to "disrespect" Miami. It was just the only way to help John Reaves attain a record that his coach & teammates thought he deserved. That being said, I can understand why some might not agree with it, but it was against Miami. The Canes deserve to be shit on as often as possible.

It might not have been the conscious intention, but their act did do that. If they had acted like they played it out and let them score, you might have let them score, but it was not obvious. However, lying down on the ground is a purposeful message to say "we could stop you, but choose not to". Whoever decided to fall to the ground messed up, IMO.

 

[TonyTheGator]

I remember TB Bucs did that once also. Must be a general lack of intelligence and sportsmanship in Florida

It is no different than running up the score against an inferior opponent. That happens all the time.

 

[boxedlunch]

It is no different than running up the score against an inferior opponent. That happens all the time.

You can't seriously believe that.

 

[Uman5]

The play is just a little bit of Cane/gator history. Not that big of a deal.

As for running it up. I don't believe in it. It is not my job to stop scoring, it is your to stop me. Works both ways, if the Canes get run up on, its because we were not good enough to stop it.

 

[FSUmanager]

I'm a little torn on UF's schedule. Naturally the Dawg in me wants to hate. But, how many of you guys would have wanted to play FSU every year from 1987 - 2000. In those 14 years, FSU finished in the top 5 every year, went to 13 of what would become BCS bowls, winning 11 of 13:



While they haven't been as good lately, FSU has been in the top 25 every year since. And it's an in-state grudge match. The only teams that can even come close to this are those that play USC or Notre Dame ( and that is a stretch) every year ... and there aren't but a few of those (USC, ND, Stanford, Michigan, Michigan State) come to mind.

So, there is no way UF is on this list, and certainly not at the top of the list, as much as it pains me to say it.

However, UF fans .... you really should want to play some OOC games outside of Florida. You aren't going to believe this, but going to big OOC away games is a blast. You get to see campuses and fans and traditions you don't normally see. We've had games at ASU, Colorado, OkSU that were great trips for the Dawg people. Win or lose, they are a great trip for the family. You really should try it sometime.

I am playing the card. FSU played Miami and UF during those years. Even when an independent and playing teams like Scar, Clemson, MSU, PSU, Auburn, VT, LSU, Michigan, Syracuse. Even during the first years of the ACC we were still playing teams like that including ND. The SEC was not as dominant as they are now. The excuse of well they played FSU every year when most of the SEC outside of a few teams that were good is bogus. They could have played and still play a better OOC schedule. This year was good, but most years it is what SEC people call the entire ACC schedule. CRAP!

 

[Gator]

I am playing the card. FSU played Miami and UF during those years. Even when an independent and playing teams like Scar, Clemson, MSU, PSU, Auburn, VT, LSU, Michigan, Syracuse. Even during the first years of the ACC we were still playing teams like that including ND. The SEC was not as dominant as they are now. The excuse of well they played FSU every year when most of the SEC outside of a few teams that were good is bogus. They could have played and still play a better OOC schedule. This year was good, but most years it is what SEC people call the entire ACC schedule. CRAP!

What exactly are you calling BS on? UF's schedule? FSU's schedule? Everything in general?

 

[FSUmanager]

What exactly are you calling BS on? UF's schedule? FSU's schedule? Everything in general?

Him talking about the 90's. FSU played just as many ranked teams as UF each year. Even after they joined the ACC. I know it is difficult to phathom but pull up their schedules. He is using FSU as an excuse for UF not having a better OOC schedule during that time.

 

[Bamabino]

Gotta' be Bozo State. Been playing football since the mid-60's and have only dared venture to AQ home turf 18 times(1-17).

 

[smilesid]

Gotta' be Bozo State. Been playing football since the mid-60's and have only dared venture to AQ home turf 18 times(1-17).

Gotta love these posts.

This, however, reveals the real problem when it comes to scheduling, money and game fixing. Yes, I said game fixing.

In conference play the overall record will be .500, half will win, half will lose. But the "power" conferences want to do better than that. So they hire bad schools to come in for easy home wins and will only travel when they absolutely have to. Statistically, the SEC is the worst offender, over the years about 3/4 of their OOC games are at home and about 3/4 of these games are against easy marks, either FCS schools or really bad FBS teams. The SEC isn't alone, any more, lots of schools follow the pattern of having one semi-difficult game and three cakewalks in the non-conference schedule.

Why? That's easy. The home fans are willing to fork out to watch those glorified scrimmage games, the team can pencil in an almost automatic win, the coach can hope to play second teamers and underclassmen more, and the school artificially pads its win/loss record.

Alabama this year is the worst offender. The have three really bad teams at home, including 2 that were FCS last year, and a perennial cellar dwelling FBS school. The only "road" game is an easy trip up the freeway to Atlanta, where they beat an out-manned VT team that is a shadow of the team they played 5 years ago. But the Tide do this pretty much every year, schedule one decent team, often in a friendly "neutral" venue and then 3 hopeless patsies. This way, they only have to worry about the conference schedule, knowing that they will have only 2 or 3 truly challenging games, and only a handful of truly hostile road dates. No wonder they are favored in every game they play this year.

Now as to my Boise State team, your rant is misplaced.

First, Boise is required to play its conference schedule, good or bad. And in case you haven't noticed, they are doing their best, hell, theypve changed conferences three times, each time trying to get into a better one. It isn't their fault that conference affiliation is a crooked game these days, based not on talent, but money and television markets.

Second, why should Boise be stupid? The various bigs won't travel, your Alabama team wouldn't be caught dead in Boise. Hell, they might lose if things went wrong, and they wouldn't be able to have a home game payday against East Undershirt State instead.

We may be a bunch of spud pickers out here, but we figured that sucker bet a long time ago. Boise tried the rent-a-mule strategy when they first became division one, less than 20 years ago. Sure enough, they lost those early games, you don't win much when the other school has higher rated players, more money, better facilities and all of the many advantages of home field.

Nope, Boise decided that two can play that game. It's a benefit of being a winning program over the years. They will play anyone, but they want something in return, either a return trip to Boise, a big national television deal, a top end payday, or a neutral field.

What do expect Boise to act like the other losing, hopeless teams you play, Alabama fan? God, you guys really must be pretty dumb if you expect us to fall for that one.

 

[BlackSand]

What do expect Boise to act like the other losing, hopeless teams you play, Alabama fan? God, you guys really must be pretty dumb if you expect us to fall for that one.

I don't think anyone expects Boise to act like "other losing, hopeless teams" ...

How is Boise's plan for making AQ Teams support their Oscar nomination for "Best Cheese-Puff Impersonation" working out for them?

 

[smilesid]

I don't think anyone expects Boise to act like "other losing, hopeless teams" ...

How is Boise's plan for making AQ Teams support their Oscar nomination for "Best Cheese-Puff Impersonation" working out for them?

Better than any of us could have imagined, thank you very much.

As a fan, I don't have any complaints. The school has moved straight up. The very fact that folks like you complain is even more proof. Sure we'd like to play better teams, and sure we'd like to win every game, but I remember the old wooden stadium and all those juco, d-2, and 1aa games. These days, it is a lot of fun heading to places like Atlanta, Seattle, DC, BCS bowls, and so forth and hey, the team wins a helluva lot more of those games than they lose. At least now, it's more in the hands of the team. If they can win, they will get considered, it they lose they won't.

Isn't that the way it's supposed to be for everyone?

This year Boise will play 6 games, exactly half of its season on the road, playing some top rated teams.

Name another school that's doing that.

Every year, Boise opens the season on the road, playing some nationally noted team.

Name another school that does that.

As for the other games, trust me, Boise would cancel those easy games in a nanosecond if they could find a top program willing to come to Boise. Trouble is, those brave talkers would rather play creampuffs. It takes two, you know.

 

[Sox33OSU]

Gotta love these posts.

This, however, reveals the real problem when it comes to scheduling, money and game fixing. Yes, I said game fixing.

In conference play the overall record will be .500, half will win, half will lose. But the "power" conferences want to do better than that. So they hire bad schools to come in for easy home wins and will only travel when they absolutely have to. Statistically, the SEC is the worst offender, over the years about 3/4 of their OOC games are at home and about 3/4 of these games are against easy marks, either FCS schools or really bad FBS teams. The SEC isn't alone, any more, lots of schools follow the pattern of having one semi-difficult game and three cakewalks in the non-conference schedule.

Why? That's easy. The home fans are willing to fork out to watch those glorified scrimmage games, the team can pencil in an almost automatic win, the coach can hope to play second teamers and underclassmen more, and the school artificially pads its win/loss record.

Alabama this year is the worst offender. The have three really bad teams at home, including 2 that were FCS last year, and a perennial cellar dwelling FBS school. The only "road" game is an easy trip up the freeway to Atlanta, where they beat an out-manned VT team that is a shadow of the team they played 5 years ago. But the Tide do this pretty much every year, schedule one decent team, often in a friendly "neutral" venue and then 3 hopeless patsies. This way, they only have to worry about the conference schedule, knowing that they will have only 2 or 3 truly challenging games, and only a handful of truly hostile road dates. No wonder they are favored in every game they play this year.

Now as to my Boise State team, your rant is misplaced.

First, Boise is required to play its conference schedule, good or bad. And in case you haven't noticed, they are doing their best, hell, theypve changed conferences three times, each time trying to get into a better one. It isn't their fault that conference affiliation is a crooked game these days, based not on talent, but money and television markets.

Second, why should Boise be stupid? The various bigs won't travel, your Alabama team wouldn't be caught dead in Boise. Hell, they might lose if things went wrong, and they wouldn't be able to have a home game payday against East Undershirt State instead.

We may be a bunch of spud pickers out here, but we figured that sucker bet a long time ago. Boise tried the rent-a-mule strategy when they first became division one, less than 20 years ago. Sure enough, they lost those early games, you don't win much when the other school has higher rated players, more money, better facilities and all of the many advantages of home field.

Nope, Boise decided that two can play that game. It's a benefit of being a winning program over the years. They will play anyone, but they want something in return, either a return trip to Boise, a big national television deal, a top end payday, or a neutral field.

What do expect Boise to act like the other losing, hopeless teams you play, Alabama fan? God, you guys really must be pretty dumb if you expect us to fall for that one.

This is far too long

 

[Gator]

Him talking about the 90's. FSU played just as many ranked teams as UF each year. Even after they joined the ACC. I know it is difficult to phathom but pull up their schedules. He is using FSU as an excuse for UF not having a better OOC schedule during that time.

I've waited to respond to make certain what you are calling BS. Now, with all due respect I feel that I must make two points.

First, YOUR saying that FSU played as many ranked teams per year as UF did in the 90's just MADE "his" case. IF UF played AS MANY ranked teams as FSU did but played more IN conference then that would support "his" claim that UF didn’t NEED to schedule as many ranked teams OOC as FSU needed to do.

Second, with all due respect, I think you might be looking at FSU history through rose-colored glasses. I submit to you the proposition that in no time frame of at least a decade has FSU played as many ranked teams as UF has played. EVER.

Here are the records for FSU and UF from 1990 to 2000 (I'll even throw in the 11th season so we don't have to argue over what years constitute the 90's).
These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU: #tot games = 125 : #T10 = 19 : #rnk = 42 (33.6%)
UF : #tot games = 128 :# T10 = 26 : #rnk = 50 (39.1%)

In this 11 year stretch, UF played 7 more T10 opponents and 8 more ranked teams than FSU did.


Perhaps you were discussing away games? In away games for the years 1990 to 2000.
FSU: #tot games = 50 : #T10 = 12 : #rnk = 20 (40%)
UF : #tot games = 44 :# T10 = 10 : #rnk = 18 (41%)

If we include away and neutral site games (Kick-off classics and Jax). In away games for the years 1990 to 2000.
FSU: #tot games = 61 : #T10 = 12 : #rnk = 22 (36.1%)
UF : #tot games = 61 :# T10 = 15 : #rnk = 30 (46.2%)

UF and FSU played the same number of games total but UF played 3 more T10 teams and 8 more ranked teams.

In the years FSU was an independent (1976 to 1991) under Bowden and was playing "anyone, anytime, anywhere".

Here are the records for FSU and UF from 1976 to 1991 (16 seasons). These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU : #tot games = 177 : #T10 = 27 : #rnk = 45 (25.4%)
UF : #tot games = 176 : #T10 = 34 : #rnk = 60 (34.1%)

In this 16 year stretch, UF played 7 more T10 opponents and 15 more ranked teams than FSU did.

Here are the records for FSU's ACC years under Bowden, 1992-2009. These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU : #tot games = 209 : #T10 = 25 : #rnk = 69 (33.0%)
UF : #tot games = 214 : #T10 = 39 : #rnk = 80 (37.4%)

In this 18 year stretch, UF played 14 more T10 opponents and 11 more ranked teams than FSU did.

My point is NOT to bash Bowden or FSU. Bowden was a great coach and FSU did amazing things under him (12 years in a row ranked in the top 5 is a record I doubt will ever be beaten). BUT, ONE pilgrimage per year to Nebraska, Michigan, PSU, or where ever does NOT mean that FSU's yearly schedule was tougher than UF's schedule OVERALL. As I pointed out earlier, UF can get away with only playing FSU OOC because they DO play so many good teams IN conference. Everyone is aware that the conference schedules (including the SEC's) are NOT equal for all teams but most don't don't realize how much UF benefits from that inequity in scheduling. Over the 25 years UF has played 110 AP ranked teams in the regular season or 4.4 per year which the highest in all of college football.

 

[TROJAN-MAN]

If you go back and look at opponents from the beginning of CFB time, PSU has played more Non-AQ's as we know them today. However, Alabama is a a very close 2nd.

 

[LawDawg]

I am playing the card. FSU played Miami and UF during those years. Even when an independent and playing teams like Scar, Clemson, MSU, PSU, Auburn, VT, LSU, Michigan, Syracuse. Even during the first years of the ACC we were still playing teams like that including ND. The SEC was not as dominant as they are now. The excuse of well they played FSU every year when most of the SEC outside of a few teams that were good is bogus. They could have played and still play a better OOC schedule. This year was good, but most years it is what SEC people call the entire ACC schedule. CRAP!

1. Learn to take a compliment.

2. The thread is titled: "Historically worse offender of cupcake sched" - we are talking OOC, not IC (unless you are Boise State ... sorry, couldn't help myself).

3. I am pretty sure that UF playing you guys every year would keep them off any list of weak OOC teams.

4. Go read no. 1.

That is all.

 

[FSUmanager]

I've waited to respond to make certain what you are calling BS. Now, with all due respect I feel that I must make two points.

First, YOUR saying that FSU played as many ranked teams per year as UF did in the 90's just MADE "his" case. IF UF played AS MANY ranked teams as FSU did but played more IN conference then that would support "his" claim that UF didn’t NEED to schedule as many ranked teams OOC as FSU needed to do.

Second, with all due respect, I think you might be looking at FSU history through rose-colored glasses. I submit to you the proposition that in no time frame of at least a decade has FSU played as many ranked teams as UF has played. EVER.

Here are the records for FSU and UF from 1990 to 2000 (I'll even throw in the 11th season so we don't have to argue over what years constitute the 90's).
These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU: #tot games = 125 : #T10 = 19 : #rnk = 42 (33.6%)
UF : #tot games = 128 :# T10 = 26 : #rnk = 50 (39.1%)

In this 11 year stretch, UF played 7 more T10 opponents and 8 more ranked teams than FSU did.


Perhaps you were discussing away games? In away games for the years 1990 to 2000.
FSU: #tot games = 50 : #T10 = 12 : #rnk = 20 (40%)
UF : #tot games = 44 :# T10 = 10 : #rnk = 18 (41%)

If we include away and neutral site games (Kick-off classics and Jax). In away games for the years 1990 to 2000.
FSU: #tot games = 61 : #T10 = 12 : #rnk = 22 (36.1%)
UF : #tot games = 61 :# T10 = 15 : #rnk = 30 (46.2%)

UF and FSU played the same number of games total but UF played 3 more T10 teams and 8 more ranked teams.

In the years FSU was an independent (1976 to 1991) under Bowden and was playing "anyone, anytime, anywhere".

Here are the records for FSU and UF from 1976 to 1991 (16 seasons). These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU : #tot games = 177 : #T10 = 27 : #rnk = 45 (25.4%)
UF : #tot games = 176 : #T10 = 34 : #rnk = 60 (34.1%)

In this 16 year stretch, UF played 7 more T10 opponents and 15 more ranked teams than FSU did.

Here are the records for FSU's ACC years under Bowden, 1992-2009. These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU : #tot games = 209 : #T10 = 25 : #rnk = 69 (33.0%)
UF : #tot games = 214 : #T10 = 39 : #rnk = 80 (37.4%)

In this 18 year stretch, UF played 14 more T10 opponents and 11 more ranked teams than FSU did.

My point is NOT to bash Bowden or FSU. Bowden was a great coach and FSU did amazing things under him (12 years in a row ranked in the top 5 is a record I doubt will ever be beaten). BUT, ONE pilgrimage per year to Nebraska, Michigan, PSU, or where ever does NOT mean that FSU's yearly schedule was tougher than UF's schedule OVERALL. As I pointed out earlier, UF can get away with only playing FSU OOC because they DO play so many good teams IN conference. Everyone is aware that the conference schedules (including the SEC's) are NOT equal for all teams but most don't don't realize how much UF benefits from that inequity in scheduling. Over the 25 years UF has played 110 AP ranked teams in the regular season or 4.4 per year which the highest in all of college football.

1990-2000 was not the only time period I was speaking of. I was speaking of 1987-2000 which was the "Dynasty". And it was 14 years not 12 as to their top 5 streak. Which you are correct will most likely never be matched.

In the 90's UF had FSU OOC and then had TENN to play IN conference. Those were your two games per year to worry about. Why not add another team OOC during that time? Hell the SEC did not become the Dominate Conference until 2006. Before that it was a toss up each year as to who was on top. So the


Also I did not make his case for him because with me stating that I also stated that FSU played Miami and UF OOC. Not 1 good team, but 2 good teams OOC. That was until 2005 and Miami joined the ACC. All I have been saying from the get go is that UF should at MINIMUM play FSU and one other decent to good team OOC every year. That leaves the two other OOC games for cupcakes or tune ups. However you would like to call them.

Also with all of your numbers. 7 more top 10 opponents over an 11 year period is not a large difference. And neither is 8 more ranked teams. I was showing that UF CAN schedule another good team each year besides FSU.

 

[FSUmanager]

1. Learn to take a compliment.

2. The thread is titled: "Historically worse offender of cupcake sched" - we are talking OOC, not IC (unless you are Boise State ... sorry, couldn't help myself).

3. I am pretty sure that UF playing you guys every year would keep them off any list of weak OOC teams.

4. Go read no. 1.

That is all.

I am talking OOC too. And besides FSU every year their OOC schedule is not very good at all. Trying to claim 1 game out of 4 as a reason is not a good one imho. Two out of 4 definitely, but not 1.

I understand how good FSU was in the 90's, but it did not stop us from playing tough OOC games each year. So why should I let any other team pass?

 

[Uman5]

I've waited to respond to make certain what you are calling BS. Now, with all due respect I feel that I must make two points.

First, YOUR saying that FSU played as many ranked teams per year as UF did in the 90's just MADE "his" case. IF UF played AS MANY ranked teams as FSU did but played more IN conference then that would support "his" claim that UF didn’t NEED to schedule as many ranked teams OOC as FSU needed to do.

Second, with all due respect, I think you might be looking at FSU history through rose-colored glasses. I submit to you the proposition that in no time frame of at least a decade has FSU played as many ranked teams as UF has played. EVER.

Here are the records for FSU and UF from 1990 to 2000 (I'll even throw in the 11th season so we don't have to argue over what years constitute the 90's).
These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU: #tot games = 125 : #T10 = 19 : #rnk = 42 (33.6%)
UF : #tot games = 128 :# T10 = 26 : #rnk = 50 (39.1%)

In this 11 year stretch, UF played 7 more T10 opponents and 8 more ranked teams than FSU did.


Perhaps you were discussing away games? In away games for the years 1990 to 2000.
FSU: #tot games = 50 : #T10 = 12 : #rnk = 20 (40%)
UF : #tot games = 44 :# T10 = 10 : #rnk = 18 (41%)

If we include away and neutral site games (Kick-off classics and Jax). In away games for the years 1990 to 2000.
FSU: #tot games = 61 : #T10 = 12 : #rnk = 22 (36.1%)
UF : #tot games = 61 :# T10 = 15 : #rnk = 30 (46.2%)

UF and FSU played the same number of games total but UF played 3 more T10 teams and 8 more ranked teams.

In the years FSU was an independent (1976 to 1991) under Bowden and was playing "anyone, anytime, anywhere".

Here are the records for FSU and UF from 1976 to 1991 (16 seasons). These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU : #tot games = 177 : #T10 = 27 : #rnk = 45 (25.4%)
UF : #tot games = 176 : #T10 = 34 : #rnk = 60 (34.1%)

In this 16 year stretch, UF played 7 more T10 opponents and 15 more ranked teams than FSU did.

Here are the records for FSU's ACC years under Bowden, 1992-2009. These are using AP rankings and don't include Bowl Games.
FSU : #tot games = 209 : #T10 = 25 : #rnk = 69 (33.0%)
UF : #tot games = 214 : #T10 = 39 : #rnk = 80 (37.4%)

In this 18 year stretch, UF played 14 more T10 opponents and 11 more ranked teams than FSU did.

My point is NOT to bash Bowden or FSU. Bowden was a great coach and FSU did amazing things under him (12 years in a row ranked in the top 5 is a record I doubt will ever be beaten). BUT, ONE pilgrimage per year to Nebraska, Michigan, PSU, or where ever does NOT mean that FSU's yearly schedule was tougher than UF's schedule OVERALL. As I pointed out earlier, UF can get away with only playing FSU OOC because they DO play so many good teams IN conference. Everyone is aware that the conference schedules (including the SEC's) are NOT equal for all teams but most don't don't realize how much UF benefits from that inequity in scheduling. Over the 25 years UF has played 110 AP ranked teams in the regular season or 4.4 per year which the highest in all of college football.

uf fan dicussing going on the road to play an AQ team OOC, now that is funny.

 

[Gator]

I am talking OOC too. And besides FSU every year their OOC schedule is not very good at all. Trying to claim 1 game out of 4 as a reason is not a good one imho. Two out of 4 definitely, but not 1.

I agree UF's OOC isn't that great but playing FSU every year means that is ISN'T a cupcake schedule either. It is what it is. It IS good enough for UF.

Over the past 25 years (1988 to 2012) in OOC games (excluding independents) in the regular season FSU has played the most ranked opponents at 37 and the most T10 opponents at 21. UF is 7th on the list with 26 ranked opponents (mostly FSU!) and 4th on the list of T10 opponents (mostly FSU) so UF's OOC isn't that bad!

I understand how good FSU was in the 90's, but it did not stop us from playing tough OOC games each year. So why should I let any other team pass?

Well, that is a two edged sword. FSU did play a great OOC schedule and I can see why you would want to push it but they also played a rather POOR in-conference schedule. Since joining the ACC, FSU is ranked at #55 for the number of ranked opponents IN-conference played. Since 1992, UF has played 75 Ranked teams in conference compared to 43 for FSU. It is even more striking for T10 opponents. Since 1992 FSU has played 6 T10 opponents in conference compared to 36 for UF. That requires one Hell of an OOC schedule to make up the difference. IMHO, It seems a tad hypocritical to throw stones at UF's OOC schedule when there is that big of a difference in schedule of IN-conference games. FWIW, Miami is ranked 60th for # of in-conference games vs ranked opponents with 42 ranked opponents. When you look at the entire regular season games UF is #1 in both Ranked opponents (96) and #T10 opponents (48), FSU is #11 in Ranked Opponents (77)and #42 in T10 opponents(27), Miami is #31 in Ranked Opponents (70) and #39 in T10 opponents (28.