Does Wash deserve any credit for the turn around?

[bradw516]

That can't be right information. Anyone who thinks Gentry's arm and Martin's arm is the same is clearly not watching the same games I am

I could say the same for anybody who thinks Martin has an arm similar to Cruz

 

[RevSader]

Ok so this is from Fangraphs. I will admit I remembered this info incorrectly (had Gentry and Murphy swapped in my mind), but it still backs up my point that Martin isn't the power arm you want him to be, and is technically closer to Murphy than Cruz. This puts Martin as barely above average, and Murphy barely below. So yes he has a stronger arm, but it doesn't change my point really.

Gentry Arm Strength/Accuracy = 58/57
Martin Arm Strength/Accuracy = 58/62
Murphy Arm Strength/Accuracy = 43/51
Cruz Arm Strength/Accuracy = 78/60

I think all this proves is that it's tough to take extra bases on major league out fielders.

 

[Windingmywatch]

That can't be right information. Anyone who thinks Gentry's arm and Martin's arm is the same is clearly not watching the same games I am

I didn't say "Gentry's arm and Martin's arm is the same" ... I said they had the two best OF arms on this team. In addition ... they are the two best OFers on the roster ... with Gentry being the better CFer. Martin has more errors this year than Gentry has in his career.

 

[jta4437]

Ok so this is from Fangraphs. I will admit I remembered this info incorrectly (had Gentry and Murphy swapped in my mind), but it still backs up my point that Martin isn't the power arm you want him to be, and is technically closer to Murphy than Cruz. This puts Martin as barely above average, and Murphy barely below. So yes he has a stronger arm, but it doesn't change my point really.

Gentry Arm Strength/Accuracy = 58/57
Martin Arm Strength/Accuracy = 58/62
Murphy Arm Strength/Accuracy = 43/51
Cruz Arm Strength/Accuracy = 78/60

Not that I can tell how they determined this number, but Cruz's arm is not that accurate in comparison to the other OFers, so it calls into question, for me, the rest of the numbers

 

[romeo212000]

I'm not convinced Martin has any stronger of an arm than Murphy does.

You're joking right? Have you watched the games this season? Martin 's arm might be better than Cruz's.

 

[romeo212000]

Going to completely disagree with you. Cruz has what is widely considered a top 10 arm in all of baseball, Martin definitely does not have that. On a scale of 1-10, I would put Martin closer to Murphy on that scale than Martin to Cruz.

 

[jta4437]

Ok so this is from Fangraphs. I will admit I remembered this info incorrectly (had Gentry and Murphy swapped in my mind), but it still backs up my point that Martin isn't the power arm you want him to be, and is technically closer to Murphy than Cruz. This puts Martin as barely above average, and Murphy barely below. So yes he has a stronger arm, but it doesn't change my point really.

Gentry Arm Strength/Accuracy = 58/57
Martin Arm Strength/Accuracy = 58/62
Murphy Arm Strength/Accuracy = 43/51
Cruz Arm Strength/Accuracy = 78/60

And I'm not saying its not a helpful tool, but it certainly seems pretty flawed, but it does give you an idea

 

[bradw516]

You're joking right? Have you watched the games this season? Martin 's arm might be better than Cruz's.

I've watched every minute of every game outside of day games during the week, so yes, I have. That's my opinion, you're welcome to yours just as much as I am.

 

[romeo212000]

Not that I can tell how they determined this number, but Cruz's arm is not that accurate in comparison to the other OFers, so it calls into question, for me, the rest of the numbers

Exactly. These numbers don't add up. Martin's arm grades out at 70/70 according to one scouting report I read.

 

[romeo212000]

I've watched every minute of every game outside of day games during the week, so yes, I have. That's my opinion, you're welcome to yours just as much as I am.

Then that tells me all I need to know about your eye test.

 

[bradw516]

Then that tells me all I need to know about your eye test.

I think you need to lay off the Tag koolaid if you think Martin's arm strength even comes close to Cruz.

 

[jta4437]

I think you need to lay off the Tag koolaid if you think Martin's arm strength even comes close to Cruz.

Cruz is gone, maybe forever, so lets stop even using him as a part of any argument

 

[bradw516]

Cruz is gone, maybe forever, so lets stop even using him as a part of any argument

I didn't bring him in to it, I was originally comparing Martin and Murphy, then people started saying Martin >= Cruz, which is ridiculous.

 

[jta4437]

I didn't bring him in to it, I was originally comparing Martin and Murphy, then people started saying Martin >= Cruz, which is ridiculous.

Just as ridiculous as an assertion that Martin = Murphy

I actually meant to quote Romeo, b/c now we're arguing about shit that don't matter

Cruz > Martin >> Murphy done

 

[romeo212000]

I think you need to lay off the Tag koolaid if you think Martin's arm strength even comes close to Cruz.

Like I said, his arm graded out at 70/70 on one report and 60/70 on another. You're kidding yourself if you think Murphy's arm is anywhere close to that.

 

[bradw516]

Just as ridiculous as an assertion that Martin = Murphy

I actually meant to quote Romeo, b/c now we're arguing about shit that don't matter

Cruz > Martin >> Murphy done

I would agree, because I never made that assertion.

 

[romeo212000]

Going to completely disagree with you. Cruz has what is widely considered a top 10 arm in all of baseball, Martin definitely does not have that. On a scale of 1-10, I would put Martin closer to Murphy on that scale than Martin to Cruz.

^^^^^^

I would agree, because I never made that assertion.

 

[bradw516]

Originally Posted by bradw516
Going to completely disagree with you. Cruz has what is widely considered a top 10 arm in all of baseball, Martin definitely does not have that. On a scale of 1-10, I would put Martin closer to Murphy on that scale than Martin to Cruz.
^^^^^^


Quote:
Originally Posted by bradw516
I would agree, because I never made that assertion.

Tell me where that says I said Martin=Murphy? Several times I've said that that Martin has the stronger arm.

 

[jta4437]

Martin has an arm that rivals Cruz and is probably more accurate

Murphy has a adequate arm, but is not in the same class as Martin, at all, but for sure he can make the occasional great throw

Murphy showed why he shouldn't be out there in RF, and hasn't played there all year, Martin has

Going to completely disagree with you. Cruz has what is widely considered a top 10 arm in all of baseball, Martin definitely does not have that. On a scale of 1-10, I would put Martin closer to Murphy on that scale than Martin to Cruz.

And I never said Martin's = Cruz, but they are certainly in the same ballpark, Murphy's not even in the same city

 

[romeo212000]

Tell me where that says I said Martin=Murphy? Several times I've said that that Martin has the stronger arm.

You didn't say that exactly, but you did say you'd put him closer to Murphy than Cruz which is ridiculous. The scouting reports on Martin say you're 100% wrong. But haven't seen you address that yet.