Bigger fuck up: Losing Barry or losing Suh?

[tpaulus_2]

After reading some of these recent posts I've come to the conclusion that a surprising number of people bitch an awful lot when things don't go exactly as they want them to.


Also, people like having someone to blame for things that are well out of the realm of their personal control.


I think learning to go with the flow on this kind of stuff- realizing that we have no control over the situation- would alleviate a lot of this pent up anger and frustration that some of you are exhibiting here...

 

[tpaulus_2]

Here are the kind of guys this staff of drunk and naked drive thru bozos throw their big money at:

Kyle VandenBosh
Nate Burelson
Chris Houston
Brandon Pettigrew
Golden Tate(needed a true #2 WR)
James Ihedbigo
Reggie Bush(very good RB with good hands)
Glover Quin(leader of our secondary)
Stephen Tulloch(not flashy but a good player)
Rob Sims(again, not flashy but a solid guard)

FIFY

Lol, some people confuse "average starting-level contracts" with "big money." Pettigrew got a big money deal? When did this happen? Dennis Pita got big TE money this offseason, Pettigrew's contract was nowhere close. Tully is a great value for what he's making- he's a much better MLB than he gets credit for here. Sims is another guy not making anything close to "big money."


Since I'm coming to these realizations today it's also kind of startling to me how sure people can be about something they're totally incorrect on.

I'm with ya though, Microwave: it's all in perspective...

 

[tpaulus_2]

Deion Sanders off the top of my head. He played for Atlanta for 5 years(his initial contract) then jetted for SF for a year then Dallas.

Reggie White comes to mind.

 

[RobBase]

After reading some of these recent posts I've come to the conclusion that a surprising number of people bitch an awful lot when things don't go exactly as they want them to.


Also, people like having someone to blame for things that are well out of the realm of their personal control.


I think learning to go with the flow on this kind of stuff- realizing that we have no control over the situation- would alleviate a lot of this pent up anger and frustration that some of you are exhibiting here...

You just can't help but be a total chode when someone doesn't love the Lions like you do. Can't wait for you to follow Mayhew and Lewand out of Detroit since you love them so much. You'll be the biggest Sabercat fan in San Jose.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Pro Bowls don't always vote in the best players. Many players get in based off of name and fans.

Also, we can't always sign big FA's. I think they've signed some quality FA's. The players I've listed have definitely helped this team IMO, even if they aren't Suh.

Listen, I get it. You love Suh. I do too. But I also realize that he may just not want to play here. We have no idea what kind of offers the Lions have thrown at him. If he really doesn't want to play in Detroit, no amount of money is gonna get him here.

He may simply want to play in a different city or something closer to "home". Maybe he wants to play in a big city. Fact is we really don't know what he wants. But placing all the blame on Mayhew and Lewand is ridiculous IMO. Sure, they aren't the best front office employees, but even the big names leave places they've loved and if Suh really wants to play elsewhere, nothing they do can make him stay.

Careful now guy- the realists don't like it when you use actual logical arguments like this. It tends to break the carefully constructed "reality" they've talked themselves into believing.

 

[RobBase]

Deion Sanders off the top of my head. He played for Atlanta for 5 years(his initial contract) then jetted for SF for a year then Dallas.

Reggie White comes to mind.

Exactly. Deion and Reggie. How the hell do you two not see how you are helping me here.

 

[Naughtymax]

Exactly. Deion and Reggie. How the hell do you two not see how you are helping me here.

Can't compare pre-cap-era signings to the current situation. The former it's just a matter of management investing in getting talent. The latter is an issue of balancing the lineup and timing your talent and salary levels to give yourself a window, followed by cap hell for most teams. Only two teams (NE and Pittsburgh) have managed to stay as elite teams for a decade at a time. You can already see the Seattle window getting ready to close with the big-money signings this offseason with Wilson still on a rookie deal.

and yes, I'll take whatever we can sign for $26MM per year plus a third-round compensatory pick over Suh as much as I like him. In a heartbeat. I'd do it at $16MM or more average per year as much as I like the guy. The production just isn't worth the money. $13-$15MM per for 4-6 years yes.

 

[tpaulus_2]

$13-$15MM per for 4-6 years yes.

Exactly. There has to be a limit on what we're willing to pay him per season. He's very good, no doubt, but there has to be a limit somewhere.

 

[RobBase]

Point is guys like Suh never reach free agency. That's history talking. Only the Lions are shitty enough to let this happen.

 

[Microwahevo]

Exactly. Deion and Reggie. How the hell do you two not see how you are helping me here.

Yes, I'm helping you in looking incorrect. You seem to think players never leave championship caliber teams or that players never leave teams unless they're old.

Golden Tate left a SB winning team, a team that could win it again this year. Just bc Detroit hasn't had success in Suh's short career doesn't mean that's the reason he's leaving. It could bc of a number of things. You're simply saying you know the reason why he's leaving and I'm saying nobody knows why he's leaving, or IF he's even leaving.

Players leave their teams for multiple reasons. Money. Family. Different location. Etc. At this point, no one can say for sure what his reasons are, unless you can see inside Suh's mind.

 

[Microwahevo]

Point is guys like Suh never reach free agency. That's history talking. Only the Lions are shitty enough to let this happen.

Yes they do. I just gave you an example, one that YOU asked for. Don't dismiss it simply bc you don't like the answer.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

I would have offered him 6 years, 108M as a starting point.

And this is why you are not a GM. The highest paid defensive player in 2014 will make 16 million a year, yet you want to offer Suh 18 million a year 'as a starting point'.

Richard Sherman just signed an extension averaging 14.25M a year. Patrick Peterson just signed an extension averaging 14M a year. As much as I like Suh -- No chance should he make more than either of those players.

Since Suh has been on the Lions -- they've had one winning season and it was the offense that carried the team that year, as Detroit came back from multiple double digit deficits at halftime to win games. I could see if Suh was the ring leader of a top 5 or even a top 10 defense, but Detroit's defense has been average to mediocre every year Suh has been on the team. What is going to happen to Detroit's defense without Suh? Will they be more average and more mediocre?

 

[Microwahevo]

After reading some of these recent posts I've come to the conclusion that a surprising number of people bitch an awful lot when things don't go exactly as they want them to.


Also, people like having someone to blame for things that are well out of the realm of their personal control.


I think learning to go with the flow on this kind of stuff- realizing that we have no control over the situation- would alleviate a lot of this pent up anger and frustration that some of you are exhibiting here...

I don't care if people bitch, tbh. It's part of being a fan of a team. But when they can't see any positives in their team, players, etc, and speak their opinions as if they're absolute truths, that's what makes me laugh.

There's plenty of positives about this team. On the flip side, there's a lot of negatives too. I'm not blind to that fact.

 

[Microwahevo]

What is going to happen to Detroit's defense without Suh? Will they be more average and more mediocre?

They're going to crumble. Swarm said it. And it's truth.

Like I've said before, I love me some Suh. I bought his jersey over Stafford, and I am a huge Stafford supporter. I even bought a Suh tshirt. But I've come to realize I may have to store those items away for good if he chooses to move on. But what we lose in Suh's ability, we can gain in a huge monetary sum, and possibly new front office executives to use that money.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Point is guys like Suh never reach free agency

Here is what you seem to be glancing over. Detroit can't MAKE Suh re-sign with the Lions. It isn't as if Detroit hasn't attempted to re-sign him. Suh holds all the cards and can rake Detroit over the coals with his contract demands, because of the cap hits his contract hold.

I think it is glaringly obvious Suh WANTS to test the FA waters. He wants teams to fawn over him and stroke his ego. There is nothing the Lions can do about that.

Also -- just wanted to say -- Mario Williams just jumped ship from Houston to Buffalo in his prime. Same can be said about Julius Peppers from Carolina to Chicago. These are two off the top of my head. I'm sure if I sat down and thought more about it, I could come up with even more.

 

[RobBase]

Another reason losing Suh is the bigger fuck up is because Barry retired. Suh will haunt the Lions for years. Can't wait to see you guys react him to shoving Stafford into the ground and killing him. Stafford might break into a million pieces when that day comes.

 

[RobBase]

Here is what you seem to be glancing over. Detroit can't MAKE Suh re-sign with the Lions.

Sure they could have, they could have can built a winner around him. But they suck so they couldn't. But any other probably would have.

 

[RobBase]

Yes, I'm helping you in looking incorrect. You seem to think players never leave championship caliber teams or that players never leave teams unless they're old.

Golden Tate left a SB winning team, a team that could win it again this year.

You aren't paying attention to me. I said players like Suh, and you come back with Golden Tate. Just stop.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

They're going to crumble. Swarm said it. And it's truth.

Like I've said before, I love me some Suh. I bought his jersey over Stafford, and I am a huge Stafford supporter. I even bought a Suh tshirt. But I've come to realize I may have to store those items away for good if he chooses to move on. But what we lose in Suh's ability, we can gain in a huge monetary sum, and possibly new front office executives to use that money.

I'm in the same boat. I have a Suh jersey and I would hate to see him play for another team, but there is no way they can just give in to his demands and vastly overpay for him.

It isn't as if Suh has been the answer to the Lions defensive woes. As I said -- if Detroit's team was built around the defense and they had one of the best units in the league -- I could see not wanting to let him walk. With or without him though -- the Lions defense has been middle of the road to mediocre.

If they can sign Suh to a deal that makes sense -- I'm all for it and would LOVE to have him back on the team. If he is requesting 15-16 million a year -- I have no problem at all saying "best of luck" and using that money to fill multiple spots on the defensive side of the ball.

 

[Microwahevo]

You aren't paying attention to me. I said players like Suh, and you come back with Golden Tate. Just stop.

No, your reading comprehension seems to be lacking. I said DEION SANDERS. He left after his initial contract with Atlanta. He was the best CB and hit the FA market, and he wasn't old.