AFCN Hate Guide

[cincygrad]

I am voting Archie Griffin, RB, Bengals.

I don't think of him as a major bust. Even Buckeye fans can be convinced that he shouldn't have won the Heisman his senior year.... His numbers were not all that great relative to his junior season and there were other running backs (including Tony Dorset) that had much better years. He also wasn't thought of as a great pro prospect - He was the 6th running back taken in that draft!

I'd go with Richardson.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

I’m going with Ki-Jana Carter

Worse career numbers than TRich. Injuries aren’t an excuse when the Bungles knew he was damaged goods. Sure his entire career was riddled with injuries, but he never even sniffed any sort of success like TRich did in his rookie season.

 

[Cincyfan78]

I’m going with Ki-Jana Carter

Worse career numbers than TRich. Injuries aren’t an excuse when the Bungles knew he was damaged goods. Sure his entire career was riddled with injuries, but he never even sniffed any sort of success like TRich did in his rookie season.

I mean - not sure you can plan on a guy blowing out his ACL....
..

I'm sticking with T-Rich.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

I mean - not sure you can plan on a guy blowing out his ACL....
..

I'm sticking with T-Rich.

If a prospect fails a physical BEFORE the draft due to a damaged knee, then you draft him & he turns around & blows out the SAME knee...

Yea I think there are measures you can take to plan around this. Like say, not drafting him in the 1st round.

 

[Cincyfan78]

If a prospect fails a physical BEFORE the draft due to a damaged knee, then you draft him & he turns around & blows out the SAME knee...

Yea I think there are measures you can take to plan around this. Like say, not drafting him in the 1st round.

Fair...but then is that the players fault, or the team...more like the Bengals are the biggest RB bust in still drafting him...

Mike Brown loved him some RB's back in the day...

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

Fair...but then is that the players fault, or the team...more like the Bengals are the biggest RB bust in still drafting him...

Mike Brown loved him some RB's back in the day

Its definitely the team's fault for still drafting him. But thats my point. They knew his injury history, so it wasn't just some fluke thing that he couldn't stay healthy his rookie year. I'd say the other injuries like the torn rotator cuff were more flukey & out of their control.

The knee injuries prevented him from being anything close to the player he was in college. So in my mind, them knowing he was damaged goods doesn't remove him from being one of THEIR biggest draft busts of all time.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

If a prospect fails a physical BEFORE the draft due to a damaged knee, then you draft him & he turns around & blows out the SAME knee...

Yea I think there are measures you can take to plan around this. Like say, not drafting him in the 1st round.

Like trading up to the #1 overall pick and mortgaging future draft stock and then drafting him still? Yeah, stuff can be done.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Its definitely the team's fault for still drafting him. But thats my point. They knew his injury history, so it wasn't just some fluke thing that he couldn't stay healthy his rookie year. I'd say the other injuries like the torn rotator cuff were more flukey & out of their control.

The knee injuries prevented him from being anything close to the player he was in college. So in my mind, them knowing he was damaged goods doesn't remove him from being one of THEIR biggest draft busts of all time.

Certainly is one of the biggest disappointments in Bengals history...but in terms of this excersice, I still feel that T-Rich was worse...I mean, this guy was the next King Henry...and dude looked like...charlie brown.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Its definitely the team's fault for still drafting him. But thats my point. They knew his injury history, so it wasn't just some fluke thing that he couldn't stay healthy his rookie year. I'd say the other injuries like the torn rotator cuff were more flukey & out of their control.

The knee injuries prevented him from being anything close to the player he was in college. So in my mind, them knowing he was damaged goods doesn't remove him from being one of THEIR biggest draft busts of all time.

And to add...if there were more than a few around the league who agree with you, that would lessen the overall thought for Ki-Jana...so, while the Bengals were foolish enough to go all-in on him, the feeling around the league was that it wasn't worth the pick there...
.
From my recollection - that wasn't the case with T-Rich. Everyone thought he was a sure fire stud....and if that is the case...would be the bigger bust here

 

[Superbelt]

Yeah, I'm going with Ki-Jana Carter too.

Not only took a damaged RB at #1 overall, but traded up with their 5th overall and 36th overall to get him.

 

[Maximus Rex]

I have to go with Trent Richardson. I don't know enough about the Archie guy drafted by the Bengals. Worley and Walter Abercrombie can't be too far behind, however. Blech.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

And to add...if there were more than a few around the league who agree with you, that would lessen the overall thought for Ki-Jana...so, while the Bengals were foolish enough to go all-in on him, the feeling around the league was that it wasn't worth the pick there...
.
From my recollection - that wasn't the case with T-Rich. Everyone thought he was a sure fire stud....and if that is the case...would be the bigger bust here

If TRich was awful out the gate then I could get behind this... But he came out as a rookie and put up over 1k yds from scrimmage (rush + rec) and 11 TDs. Broke Jim Brown's rookie TD record in the process.

There was very little evidence, if any, to suggest he was a bust until AFTER he was traded.

FWIW I'm not saying he ISN"T a bust... He clearly is. But KJC is a bigger bust in my opinion based on career numbers.

 

[cincygrad]

Its definitely the team's fault for still drafting him. But thats my point. They knew his injury history, so it wasn't just some fluke thing that he couldn't stay healthy his rookie year. I'd say the other injuries like the torn rotator cuff were more flukey & out of their control.

The knee injuries prevented him from being anything close to the player he was in college. So in my mind, them knowing he was damaged goods doesn't remove him from being one of THEIR biggest draft busts of all time.

I think it's interesting to think about tread on the tires of running backs the same way we think about pitching prospects in MLB. These days, scouts want to find pitchers that haven't thrown too many innings in their career. They're basically all Tommy John surgery candidates at some point.

Same seems to be true for running backs. Another guy that was a bust for the Bengals was Chris Perry. But, if you look at his senior year in college, and the guy was an absolute stud. But, Lloyd Carr basically ran his wheels off. He averaged 26 carries a game in his senior year. Against Michigan State that season, I think he had something like 50 carrries.... In one game!! That shit is irresponsible. In retrospect, it's not really that surprising that he was damaged goods by the time he was an NFL rookie.

 

[Cincyfan78]

If TRich was awful out the gate then I could get behind this... But he came out as a rookie and put up over 1k yds from scrimmage (rush + rec) and 11 TDs. Broke Jim Brown's rookie TD record in the process.

There was very little evidence, if any, to suggest he was a bust until AFTER he was traded.

FWIW I'm not saying he ISN"T a bust... He clearly is. But KJC is a bigger bust in my opinion based on career numbers.

I don't disagree with most - but as I stated when I first talked about the RB's...when it comes to injuries - it's hard for me to say bust. For me, a bust is a guy who is healthy and doesn't put up. If Ki-Jana had that many issues prior, and was still drafted 3rd...that seems to be more of an organizational "bust" than a player bust...especially, again, when compared to someone like TRich. I'm assuming here, that more than a few teams did not like Ki-Jana due to those medicals. Seems that the consensus on TRich was fairly unanimous that he's be a stud RB...but, I'll digress...

Changing course, and going more for where the player was picked combined with the lack of stats: Let's say...Dick Leftridge for the Steelers. 3rd overall pick. Played 4 games. Wasn't hurt....was fat, and never played more than 4 games. Would think if your 3rd overall pick only played 4 games...would qualify here. If we are going for pick + production...this would seem to be a winner....lol

 

[Cincyfan78]

And can we all make fun of Bill B. selecting a Full Back in 1992 with the 9th overall pick for the Browns? If we are going to add in organizational failures as part of the vetting process...while Vardell wasn't really a bust (he did pave the way for Sander's future 2K season)...drafting a FB outside of the 1950's is criminal malpractice...why not just go up to the podium and say "We've decided to forfeit our pick this year"?

Good, Lord.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

I don't disagree with most - but as I stated when I first talked about the RB's...when it comes to injuries - it's hard for me to say bust. For me, a bust is a guy who is healthy and doesn't put up. If Ki-Jana had that many issues prior, and was still drafted 3rd...that seems to be more of an organizational "bust" than a player bust...especially, again, when compared to someone like TRich. I'm assuming here, that more than a few teams did not like Ki-Jana due to those medicals. Seems that the consensus on TRich was fairly unanimous that he's be a stud RB...but, I'll digress...

Changing course, and going more for where the player was picked combined with the lack of stats: Let's say...Dick Leftridge for the Steelers. 3rd overall pick. Played 4 games. Wasn't hurt....was fat, and never played more than 4 games. Would think if your 3rd overall pick only played 4 games...would qualify here. If we are going for pick + production...this would seem to be a winner....lol

I put Leftridge in my list... Definitely a big time bust. But nobody seems to care about players drafted in the 60s. Hell I don't think we've looked further than the 90s up to this point.

I guess in fairness to the Ravens, we can't.

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

Archie Griffin - 1
TRich - 3
Carter - 2

Still waiting on some to weigh in... @dtgold88 @Pure Steel @thedddd

Or we can just go with TRich.

 

[Cincyfan78]

Archie Griffin - 1
TRich - 3
Carter - 2

Still waiting on some to weigh in... @dtgold88 @Pure Steel @thedddd

Or we can just go with TRich.

I will acquiesce and go with Carter...while I still disagree - I'll concede my point for another day...

 

[FaCe-LeE-uS]

I will acquiesce and go with Carter...while I still disagree - I'll concede my point for another day...

Nah lets wait & see if anyone else chimes in. Might be TRich with ease. FWIW the Reddit AFCN voted TRich.

 

[dtgold88]

Day 2… Time to select a RB to our AFCN ALL-BUST TEAM

View attachment 399101

Names to consider:

Browns
Willie Green (1st Rd - 16th Overall - 2002)
Tommy Vardell (1st Rd - 9th Overall - 1992)
Trent Richardson (1st Rd - 3rd Overall - 2012)

Bengals
Archie Griffin (1st Rd - 24th overall - 1976)
Ki-Jana Carter (1st Rd - 1st Overall - 1995)
Chris Perry (1st Rd - 25th Overall - 2003)

Steelers
Dick Leftridge (1st Rd - 3rd Overall - 1966)
Walter Abercrombie (1st Rd - 12th overall - 1982)
Tim Worley (1st Rd - 7th overall - 1989)

Ravens
Musa Smith (3rd Rd - 77th overall - 2003)
JK Dobbins (2nd Rd - 55th overall - 2020)

sorry out so long. Griffin a good add. Still think between Ki-Jana and TRich. I guess because #1 overall AND he already had some major injury issues they knew about before drafting him I go Carter.