2012 College Football / 2013 NFL Draft

[Bemular]

I've seen you point to his supporting cast, but I don't think you can hold that against Kaep. Also not his fault he has a good coach or is coachable. The kid has 10 starts, he is not being "managed", he has made game changing plays with his arm and legs, he has made every throw and still has a ton of potential.

Not sure what more you could ask for at this point.

I completely agree with this. What Kap did - he did on his own, not because of Harbaugh, or Roman, or the O'line. In fact, our RB/rushing production dropped precipitously from the Chicago game forward - Make of it what you will.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

I completely agree with this. What Kap did - he did on his own, not because of Harbaugh, or Roman, or the O'line. In fact, our RB/rushing production dropped precipitously from the Chicago game forward - Make of it what you will.

Not taking anything at all away from Kaepernick here, but it bears mentioning that we lost Hunter in the NO game and it took LMJ several weeks to get up to speed. We also played a somewhat tougher schedule in that span. If anything, that last is a credit to Kap.

 

[NinerSickness]

I've seen you point to his supporting cast, but I don't think you can hold that against Kaep. Also not his fault he has a good coach or is coachable. The kid has 10 starts, he is not being "managed", he has made game changing plays with his arm and legs, he has made every throw and still has a ton of potential.

Not sure what more you could ask for at this point.

I'm not holding it against him. All I'm saying is that I don't think he's quite as good as people are saying he is. The Niners are a run-first team. It's not like I'm saying he's Alex Smith though.

 

[Bemular]

Not taking anything at all away from Kaepernick here, but it bears mentioning that we lost Hunter in the NO game and it took LMJ several weeks to get up to speed. We also played a somewhat tougher schedule in that span. If anything, that last is a credit to Kap.

Point taken on LMJ. LMJ ended with a .52 YPC average less then KH, but he averaged more carries than KH so their overall per game production was virtually the same.

Gore on the other hand actually averaged more carries/gm after week 9 (the replacement game) but 1.4 yards less per carry with week 9 added to both sides or 1.6 yards less per carry with week 9 subtracted from both sides.

At any rate, outside of Kaps contribution to the rushing game its production definitely diminished after Week 9 (StL).

 

[NinerSickness]

So who else sees some Sidney Rice in Justin Hunter? They seem like very similar prospects.

He's one of the guys I'd target if the Niners trade down. I'm actually hoping for a trade up for Warmack, Hankins or Richardson (or maybe Cooper), but Hunter is a guy who could help if they trade down IMO.

Guys to target in the 2nd round if the Niners trade down (in no particular order):

Eric Reid
Justin Hunter
Jessee Williams
One of the top 2 TEs if they fall there (preferably Eifert).
Margus Hunt later in the 2nd?
I'd look at Tavon Austin (mostly as a return man) in the mid 2nd if he's there too.

 

[Ray_Dogg]

I think Hunter should just be taken with our first round pick if he's the guy you want. He'd be ideal for filling the deep threat need and him and Kap could be insane. I'm gonna have to come to terms with CP not being a Niner.

 

[MHSL82]

Point taken on LMJ. LMJ ended with a .52 YPC average less then KH, but he averaged more carries than KH so their overall per game production was virtually the same.

Gore on the other hand actually averaged more carries/gm after week 9 (the replacement game) but 1.4 yards less per carry with week 9 added to both sides or 1.6 yards less per carry with week 9 subtracted from both sides.

At any rate, outside of Kaps contribution to the rushing game its production definitely diminished after Week 9 (StL).

Three things (IMO):

1.Kaep will also get better at reading and knowing when to call the run instead of the pass. I could see a young QB leaning on one side of the balance when one thing is more natural, especially when one is super confident and has a good arm/accuracy. He may have made choices that affect the run game that may not be a concern next season.
2. They may have called more passes than runs either to throw off the game film, to give Kaep more experience in the pocket, or to have variety for the rest of the season.
3. This offseason, with Kaep, they may add or get better at running sets from the offense that Kaep runs best (including pistol but not just pistol).

 

[imac_21]

Point taken on LMJ. LMJ ended with a .52 YPC average less then KH, but he averaged more carries than KH so their overall per game production was virtually the same.

Gore on the other hand actually averaged more carries/gm after week 9 (the replacement game) but 1.4 yards less per carry with week 9 added to both sides or 1.6 yards less per carry with week 9 subtracted from both sides.

At any rate, outside of Kaps contribution to the rushing game its production definitely diminished after Week 9 (StL).

How do Gore's splits look if you compare his first 5 games with Kaep with the rest? I know Gore mentioned that he wasn't a big fan of the pistol at first and he may have struggled adjusting to the new offensive set and the read option in particular. His numbers may have returned to "normal" once he adjusted.

Another possible explanation with such a small sample size is one poor (or great) day can throw off the averages.

 

[imac_21]

Alec Ogletee charged with DUI | ProFootballTalk

 

[Ltrain]

Alec Ogletee charged with DUI | ProFootballTalk

Damn these kids are stupid! He couldn't stay clean until after the draft?

 

[Bemular]

How do Gore's splits look if you compare his first 5 games with Kaep with the rest? I know Gore mentioned that he wasn't a big fan of the pistol at first and he may have struggled adjusting to the new offensive set and the read option in particular. His numbers may have returned to "normal" once he adjusted.

Another possible explanation with such a small sample size is one poor (or great) day can throw off the averages.

The split we need to know in order to check your theory would be his YPC running out of a pro-set vs. his YPC running out of the RO. Generally speaking Gores production was down with Kap and his outliers were fewer than in the first half of the season.

I think we can safely assume that the adjustments for not only Gore & Co., but for the O'Line as well probably did have an impact on the overall production of our RB's. Maybe I'll put some film on and take a peek.

 

[MHSL82]

The split we need to know in order to check your theory would be his YPC running out of a pro-set vs. his YPC running out of the RO. Generally speaking Gores production was down with Kap and his outliers were fewer than in the first half of the season.

I think we can safely assume that the adjustments for not only Gore & Co., but for the O'Line as well probably did have an impact on the overall production of our RB's. Maybe I'll put some film on and take a peek.

Just a general question, is it possible to have outliers in the negative for a RB that one would ever use as an outlier and not just a number for the averages? Because I feel that when one treats huge carries as an outlier but not bad -4 yard rushes, it hurts the averages (obviously including a 73 yard rush would hurt the averages as far as reliable expectations of production per carry).

 

[Tubbs1518]

So I posted my 49er big board; here's my overall big board. Might as well do one before the combine hype starts up:

1. Tyler Wilson. A good QB trumps everything else.
2. Chance Warmack
3. Johnathan Hankins (don't know how I thought he was 23; he's really 21).
4. Sheldon Richardson
5. Jarvis Jones. Would be #1 overall if not for the potential injury concern
6. Damontre Moore. More versaitle scheme-wise than Jones, but Jones is the better pure pass-rusher.
7. Luke Joeckel
8. Star Lotulelei (always thought he was a little overrated, but he's a great prospect).
9. Geno Smith. Another good QB. Quick release; good pocket presence; cool under pressure. I think he'll be the #1 pick overall. But it'll be a mistake 'cause Wilson surveys the field & gets rid of the ball quicker.
10. Johnathan Cooper. Stud.
11. Alec Ogletree.
12. Johnathan Jenkins (boom or bust). If he works hard enough, he could be the most dominant defensive player in the entire draft.
13. Keenan Allen. One of those guys who's open even if he's not open. The next Boldin IMO.
14. Dion Jordan. I learnd from JPP not to under-estimate great athletic ability.
15. Eric Fisher
16. Dee Milliner
17. Sharrif Floyd
18. Ezekiel Anzah
19. Sam Montgomery
20. Bjorn Werner
21. Barkevious Mingo
22. Kawaan Short
24. Cordarelle Patterson
25. Lane Johnson

Wow I disagree with this list in so many ways.....I'm not sure what to say. Well let's start at #1. He is my 4th ranked QB.

 

[imac_21]

The split we need to know in order to check your theory would be his YPC running out of a pro-set vs. his YPC running out of the RO. Generally speaking Gores production was down with Kap and his outliers were fewer than in the first half of the season.

I think we can safely assume that the adjustments for not only Gore & Co., but for the O'Line as well probably did have an impact on the overall production of our RB's. Maybe I'll put some film on and take a peek.

I think we would also need to compare his success out of the RO and pistol the first 5 games with Kaep to the last 5 games with Kaep. Did he seem to adjust to running out of the pistol as the team ran it more?

 

[Bemular]

I think we would also need to compare his success out of the RO and pistol the first 5 games with Kaep to the last 5 games with Kaep. Did he seem to adjust to running out of the pistol as the team ran it more?

The one thing I and I'm sure we all noticed was the slight delay during the hand-off part of the RO. Naturally, this will impact the timing on hitting holes but whether the RO was weak or perhaps the RO was strong but it made the pro-set weak has me curious so I'll run some film tonight and see what I can come up with.

 

[NinerSickness]

Since I've always known it was extremely unrealistic to hope for a trade up for Chance Warmack in the draft, I now have my eye on Johnathan Hankins as the guy I want the Niners to get. Things could change after the combine, but I have a feeling Johnathan Hankins is going to be my "Vince Wilfork" of this year's draft. Only this time, I'm not going to start a H_A_N_K_I_N_S thread because that didn't work in 2004.

People are sleeping on Hankins just like they did on Wilfork.

 

[NinerSickness]

Anyone think Jordan Poyer could play FS? He's about the same size as Goldson. A little lighter, but he's also a little shorter. He's a good CB prospect, but the Niners need safeties more badly.

 

[ChrisPozz]

Mike Mayock had a conference call with the national media today. Rotoworld produced some early notes from the call:

Citing people familiar with South Carolina RB Marcus Lattimore's (knee surgeries) rehab, NFL Network's Mike Mayock stated on a Monday conference call that he's heard Lattimore is "way ahead of schedule." "I think he's gonna go somewhere in the third round," said Mayock. Mayock turned some heads by ranking Lattimore as a top-five running back in this year's class, but it appears he's got solid information on the onetime college star's rehab. It will be interesting to see whether Lattimore performs any drills before the draft. He tore his right ACL, PCL, and LCL on October 27.

NFL Network's Mike Mayock told reporters on a conference call Monday that Oregon DE/LB Dion Jordan has "Aldon Smith potential" in the pros. "He's two years away from being an Aldon Smith-type player," Mayock said of Jordan. "He’d be a situational pass rusher year one." Smith was a situational pass rusher in his first NFL season, as well. An athletic freak at 6-foot-7, 230, Jordan is Mayock's top-rated outside linebacker prospect for the 2013 draft. A full rundown of Mayock's rankings are accessible at the link below.

NFL Network's Mike Mayock stated on a conference call Monday that he has only one running back with a first-round grade in this year's class. Mayock gave the first-round grade to Alabama's Eddie Lacy, calling No. 2-rated back Montee Ball a "second- to third-round guy." Mayock is also not particularly high on North Carolina's Giovani Bernard or Oklahoma State's Joseph Randle. Ball would be a good fit for a zone-blocking team, but he lacks lateral explosiveness and doesn't create space for himself in the run game.

 

[deep9er]

Mike Mayock had a conference call with the national media today. Rotoworld produced some early notes from the call:

Citing people familiar with South Carolina RB Marcus Lattimore's (knee surgeries) rehab, NFL Network's Mike Mayock stated on a Monday conference call that he's heard Lattimore is "way ahead of schedule." "I think he's gonna go somewhere in the third round," said Mayock. Mayock turned some heads by ranking Lattimore as a top-five running back in this year's class, but it appears he's got solid information on the onetime college star's rehab. It will be interesting to see whether Lattimore performs any drills before the draft. He tore his right ACL, PCL, and LCL on October 27.

NFL Network's Mike Mayock told reporters on a conference call Monday that Oregon DE/LB Dion Jordan has "Aldon Smith potential" in the pros. "He's two years away from being an Aldon Smith-type player," Mayock said of Jordan. "He’d be a situational pass rusher year one." Smith was a situational pass rusher in his first NFL season, as well. An athletic freak at 6-foot-7, 230, Jordan is Mayock's top-rated outside linebacker prospect for the 2013 draft. A full rundown of Mayock's rankings are accessible at the link below.


NFL Network's Mike Mayock stated on a conference call Monday that he has only one running back with a first-round grade in this year's class. Mayock gave the first-round grade to Alabama's Eddie Lacy, calling No. 2-rated back Montee Ball a "second- to third-round guy." Mayock is also not particularly high on North Carolina's Giovani Bernard or Oklahoma State's Joseph Randle. Ball would be a good fit for a zone-blocking team, but he lacks lateral explosiveness and doesn't create space for himself in the run game.

if Baalke/Harbaugh agrees, then do it. nothing helps the D more than pressure.

ok, doesn't have to be Dion Jordan, but someone they feel can bring the heat? even in a situational role year 1, pressure is what we need most.

 

[Ray_Dogg]

NFL Network's Mike Mayock has assigned a first-round grade to only two wide receivers in the 2013 draft: Tennessee's Cordarrelle Patterson and Cal's Keenan Allen.
Mayock was particularly effusive in praising Patterson, who is a Julio Jones kind of wide receiver at 6-foot-3 and 200-plus pounds. "You put him on tape, and he’s going to take your breath away," Mayock said. "He’s a special talent." Mayock is interested to see how Allen runs at this week's Scouting Combine. Allen is more the possession/run-after-catch receiver, a Miles Austin type.