Is Baker Mayfield a Top 10 QB

[DJ]

Hell, the browns don’t even give him no credit obviously

Um, no. That's not true at all. Stefanski wasn't the coach when they selected Mayfield.

As a team you're always looking to improve your team.....and nobody here is saying Mayfield is better than Watson.

 

[dtgold88]

I would have picked up Mayfield's 5th year option after his 3rd year. Mayfield at $5.1M in 2021 had considerable trade value, and the 5th year option would have been a small plus. A year later and it's a very different situation.

No question about that.

 

[dtgold88]

Hell, the browns don’t even give him no credit obviously

That's actually not obvious as it sure seems possible or even likely had Watson not become available they'd have gone with Baker this season. They also don't seem willing to release Baker or trade him in a deal they don't like.

 

[fastforward]

My point all during this thread has been he is better than Lock and Smith and would give Seattle a chance to compete for a WC in the weaker NFC. Carroll isn't the kind of coach I envision tanking.

I have a hard time believing that either Lock or Smith will be the starter for the Seahawks under Carroll. Carroll's mantra has been that you always compete, you're not in a rebuild, and you don't tank. I hope he doesn't go with Lock/Smith, have a terrible season, and then try to walk-back his no rebuild comments after the fact in order to distance himself from the outcome. That would be total BS.

 

[dtgold88]

I certainly wouldn't say he couldn't or wouldn't play well. He's a good player. Whether he'd be motivated to put everything on the line for a team where he clearly has no future, and without a contractual safety net, is another matter.

But playing well would help him get the contract he wants after the season.

 

[dtgold88]

Um, no. That's not true at all. Stefanski wasn't the coach when they selected Mayfield.

As a team you're always looking to improve your team.....and nobody here is saying Mayfield is better than Watson.

The one hypothetical I'd love to get an answer to (but know we cannot) is what would have happened if Baker been sat down after his initial injury (week 2)? He'd have been coming off an exceptional 2020 season and 2 really good games to open 2021.

My guess is we'd still have gone after Watson if available. would we have gone as all out with the contract they gave him? Not sure.....I also wonder if Houston would have been more inclined to want Baker in the deal.

 

[fastforward]

But playing well would help him get the contract he wants after the season.

That's an opinion. It's not an unreasonable opinion. It could happen, but I just think it's more likely not to happen. If it does improve Mayfield's prospects it likely won't be by much because the 4 previous years show who and what Mayfield is, moreso than will a few fill-in games in 2022. I would certainly say there was more potential downside for Mayfield than upside. I think Mayfield will be thought of more fondly if he's not around for a year, which is ironically what has happened with Watson.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

I have a hard time believing that either Lock or Smith will be the starter for the Seahawks under Carroll. Carroll's mantra has been that you always compete, you're not in a rebuild, and you don't tank. I hope he doesn't go with Lock/Smith, have a terrible season, and then try to walk-back his no rebuild comments after the fact in order to distance himself from the outcome. That would be total BS.

I believe it, Carroll doesn't want to call it a rebuild, maybe he prefers calling it reloading or whatever but I see it as a quick rebuild plan where in 2023 Seahawks can start expecting to be back in the playoffs....hopefully. It's a waste of resources trading for dud QBs and I include a slew of QBs who fit the "dud" description in my view and yes I include Mayfield in that group. Those resources can be put to work better and more effectively at other positions. Roll with Lock, see if there is any untapped potential, if not draft your QB next season and then game on!

 

[NWPATSFAN]

OK, I'll say it this way.

1. I believe the Browns want to wash their hands of Baker.
2. I believe the Browns will have to eat a good portion of his contract.

This^

 

[NWPATSFAN]

You said I would say to prove he milked it by faking an injury. I don't doubt that could have happened with green.......what I did do was try to enlighten you and explain why Green could feign injury but it would be in baker's best interest to prove he could play. Ergo, it does not suit Baker to fake an injury.

Nothing worse than a woman scorned and BM has proven he's a bitch.

We can debate if a player has ever faked injury or not? But we can never prove it as a player would never admit to that. Probably void his contract if he did.

We can discuss wheter any teams want him, at what cost... but we are all speculating until something actually happens.

Why is it that most, if not all Brownie fans can't admit the longer this goes on the worse it is for the Browns. If nothing else we all know BM is a drama queen. The drama will continue to grow and grow until he's out of there, regardless if he starts, backs up, sits out voluntarily or the team tells him to stay home.

There is no positive in this for the Browns unless a team gets desperate. Nothing! Sugar coat it and spin it anyway. Bottom line the Browns more then likely get the short end of the stick.

Yes that includes eating 1/2 his salary and giving up any pick/s.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

did you lie when you said you answered all my questions? But to help you out, after 2020 Baker was coming off an exceptional season (top 10 in QBR and PFF rating). A far better season than Darnold. They were under a nearly identical contract. Exact same deal for 2022 (5th year option season) while Baker was to be paid a tad more in the upcoming season at the time in 2021 than Darnold.

Darnold went for a 2 and a 4.

No way to know? Hope that helps a little.

FYI, there really is no gotcha moment as irrational people like yourself cannot be gotten in their minds.

So why didn't that amazing FO you keep telling us about pull the trigger and trade him?

Got to love this forum.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

I can agree he'd likely have had less success if he were drafted by the Jets. To be fair, though, the guy joined a dysfunctional disaster coming off an 0-16 season. Hue jackson as the coach AND an OC trying to get Hue fired.....and the Browns were 7-8 when Baker played.

How many top 1st round and early picks was he surrounded by?

 

[dtgold88]

That's an opinion. It's not an unreasonable opinion. It could happen, but I just think it's more likely not to happen. If it does improve Mayfield's prospects it likely won't be by much because the 4 previous years show who and what Mayfield is, moreso than will a few fill-in games in 2022. I would certainly say there was more potential downside for Mayfield than upside. I think Mayfield will be thought of more fondly if he's not around for a year, which is ironically what has happened with Watson.

a few fill in games? Maybe, but we are talking a number of games as in the hypothetical it was a long suspension and Baker filling in and playing well. I mean, if he had a great season in 2022 that makes 3 really good years out of the 4 he was healthy

I happen to believe even a few really good games would help him but could see thinking it wouldn't help enough.

 

[dtgold88]

Nothing worse than a woman scorned and BM has proven he's a bitch.

We can debate if a player has ever faked injury or not? But we can never prove it as a player would never admit to that. Probably void his contract if he did.

We can discuss wheter any teams want him, at what cost... but we are all speculating until something actually happens.

Why is it that most, if not all Brownie fans can't admit the longer this goes on the worse it is for the Browns. If nothing else we all know BM is a drama queen. The drama will continue to grow and grow until he's out of there, regardless if he starts, backs up, sits out voluntarily or the team tells him to stay home.

There is no positive in this for the Browns unless a team gets desperate. Nothing! Sugar coat it and spin it anyway. Bottom line the Browns more then likely get the short end of the stick.

Yes that includes eating 1/2 his salary and giving up any pick/s.

Fairly certain most Browns fans think it's best he is moved sooner rather than later.....but also know there is no reason to make a deal that doesn't help the team since training camp doesn't even start until July.

If you were reading this discussion and want to chime in feel free. I was really only disagreeing with someone who thinks IF Baker was brought in to replace watson should he be suspended a while and IF he played well this would not help Baker (as well as the Browns).

 

[dtgold88]

So why didn't that amazing FO you keep telling us about pull the trigger and trade him?

Got to love this forum.

why would they trade Baker after the 2020 season with no replacement?

Agree, your question does deserve a "ya gotta love this forum."

Maybe you'd like to simply answer the question for which he was struggling....a lifeline if you will? IF they did put him on the market after 2020 season what do you think dealing Baker could have brought back in trade (knowing a lesser QB with a nearly identical contract brought back a 2 and a 4)?

 

[dtgold88]

How many top 1st round and early picks was he surrounded by?

Top 1st rounders who were good in that rookie season I mentioned? Garrett and Ward. Neither plays on Baker's side of the ball if you didn't know and the 2018 defense was pretty bad. Peppers, Zeitler and Njoku were late first rounders. But, hey, Greg Robinson was picked early in the 1st round. should he be included as a bigtime bust?

 

[dtgold88]

How many top 1st round and early picks was he surrounded by?

should add he was surrounded mostly by guys who had gone 1-31 in their previous 2 seasons.

 

[Wamu]

Nothing worse than a woman scorned and BM has proven he's a bitch.

We can debate if a player has ever faked injury or not? But we can never prove it as a player would never admit to that. Probably void his contract if he did.

We can discuss wheter any teams want him, at what cost... but we are all speculating until something actually happens.

-->Why is it that most, if not all Brownie fans can't admit the longer this goes on the worse it is for the Browns.<-- If nothing else we all know BM is a drama queen. The drama will continue to grow and grow until he's out of there, regardless if he starts, backs up, sits out voluntarily or the team tells him to stay home.

There is no positive in this for the Browns unless a team gets desperate. Nothing! Sugar coat it and spin it anyway. Bottom line the Browns more then likely get the short end of the stick.

Yes that includes eating 1/2 his salary and giving up any pick/s.

I completely agree with what you said. BM's a big time drama queen. But I don't agree with the very odd part where you tried to lump all Browns fans into the same category.

Why do so many people continue to think all Browns have fully supported BM?

 

[dtgold88]

I completely agree with what you said. BM's a big time drama queen. But I don't agree with the very odd part where you tried to lump all Browns fans into the same category.

Why do so many people continue to think all Browns have fully supported BM?

Right? The few Browns' forums I look at I would say the vast majority do not like Baker.

 

[Wamu]

Right? The few Browns' forums I look at I would say the vast majority do not like Baker.

Damn right. There are more Browns fans that dislike BM than there are that like him.

Here's the way I breakdown that jackass in cleats four seasons in Cleveland. It started out with alotta promise. Then he had a sophomore slump, which I put more on Freddie than anyone else. His third year was damn good. And his fourth season was an injury riddled disaster. He should have never tried to play through all the injuries.

His attitude/ego is bigger than Cleveland Stadium. He wants the praise. But wants nothing to do with the ridicule that comes with being a former # 1 overall pick.

Did he fully live up to the expectations of being a # 1 pick? I gotta say absolutely not.

He belongs in the league there's no doubt about that. But without the Browns eating a large portion of that 18m contract no team will want him.