Why do the Pats

[FlyerFinFan]

Subterfuge and stretching the rules are two totally different things.

I guess you could argue what the Pats did was subterfuge except that in the offseason, that rule will likely get changed because no one will want to deal with it.

I still remember the Pats players that fell down faking injuries against Peyton because the Pats ran out of timeouts. BB is always pushing the envelope of what he can get away with.

Good example although most teams were doing that by the time the rule changed. That's the point of this he would rather push the envelope than just flat out beat a team man on man. BB is usually in the mix of this unsavory stuff.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

Lol,....you got a new system = jack del rio,.....*aka=========retread*.

The raiders used to be awful with abusing rules they've come a long way over the years. One could say the Patriots have set claim to that throne now
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Dude]

The raiders used to be awful with abusing rules they've come a long way over the years. One could say the Patriots have set claim to that throne now
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

"Just win baby!"

 

[PatsFan2003]

Subterfuge and stretching the rules are two totally different things.

I don't know I think there's a little of both except that when other teams are doing it, it must be ok.

I guess you could argue what the Pats did was subterfuge except that in the offseason, that rule will likely get changed because no one will want to deal with it.

I still remember the Pats players that fell down faking injuries against Peyton because the Pats ran out of timeouts. BB is always pushing the envelope of what he can get away with.

Now everyone does it. Belichick leads the way once again.

 

[PatsFan2003]

What do you not understand. The D should have the ability to know who's eligible or not with enough time before the balls snapped or its a huge advantage. Should everyone's D burn their time outs immediately until they have no more left? What is your solution then because if you say go into base zone D then you are effectively telling us that teams may have to play the game that way..every game which is ridiculous.

The defense doesn't have the right to slow down the offense either. The question is what is a reasonable time? 5 seconds, 10 seconds, 30 seconds? Raise their hand when they're ready?

Teddy Bruschi had a comment on this on TV but I can't find it but he basically said it's on the defensive players too to be able to be aware and respond to these types of changes in a reasonable time. That's part of the game.

If the defense is not prepared then it does become a question of calling a time out or something. Teams do that often enough on both sides of the ball.

 

[NEPatsfan]

That is an excellent article NEPf....thanks.

You're more than welcome.

I found it intersting in the sense that the author approached it from a perspective of how would it play out in a courtroom or legal setting.

and back at ya

 

[NEPatsfan]

Sure I read it and believe me I don't think that the commish is fully legit either as its business but if you think that this guy has all the facts there's a guy on here ready to sell you some gold chains! The article also proves the OP's point that BB will do everything in his power to manipulate the rules. This is why they constantly have to look at the rules and formed a competition committee. Unfortunately over time flaws come up and in most cases there's your coach abusing them instead of informing the committee in advance instead of making the NFL look like a bunch of tools. That's probably why he was penalized harsher than most...

Which part of his article do you dispute as being factually wrong?

See that's how a debate works, an argument was put forth to refute your position. Now is when you retort said information.

 

[NEPatsfan]

The signals sent in by hand are minor compared to the past you are just making yourself look more ridiculous please stop.... filming today doesn't give a team the same advantage as in the past.

So the threshold now is that the use of signals is less than in the past so it's no big deal?

I thought people of your ilk considered filming the opposing teams sidelines as the crime of the century?

The helmet audio is cut off at the 15 second to go mark on the play clock. (Someone else can look that up and see if I have the right time remaining.)

After that the defense sends in signals based on formations being seen via hand signals. Just like the old days.

Psssst, the signals sent in via helmet audio are team coded too, because most if not all teams are worried the radio signal could be stolen.

 

[NEPatsfan]

The head official just said last night that it's a time issue so that will most likely be the change. Don't argue with me about this if it upsets you call the league office.

Your coach realized that if he snaps quickly he could take advantage of the rule and he was right as your TE was wide open. Are you blind? A D deserves the opportunity to set it's D...

Please provide a link to this so I can review what he actually said.

And no the D does not deserve time to set. The rule clearly states that once the officials are set the ball can be snapped. You're mixing up the ineligible rule with player substitution rule.

 

[NEPatsfan]

Look he broke the rules and was fined. What else do you need to hear??? Take it to the Supreme Court if you feel slighted. I challenge you to do so and if you win I'll gladly apologize!

If the league felt it necessary to adjust the rules they would but with headsets they probably told BB go ahead and blow your brains out. Filming signals and whatever else he was doing won't help you today...proof is in his championship success 0 titles since.

Sure, but not the rule you think he broke and are hanging on about.

Why would should it be taken to the Surpreme Court? Under what USC violation? Would you care for a lesson in the USC? I would be glad to school you on that subject too.

Actually the rule to add the defensive teams to helmet audio was already in the works and was going to be put in place regardless of the "spygate" situation.

0 titles is your evidence? So how do you explain all the other teams that haven't won in that same time frame? Pats have been to 2 more SB's since then losing by being short a couple of plays, (Credit to the NYG).

In that same time frame they have been to, including this coming weekend, 6 additional AFC Championship games, so that means 3 games from 3 more SB appearances.

How about those Dolphins?

 

[NEPatsfan]

Bro another pats fan on here said anyone who defends BB is insane but I'm nuts? Please give it up what's next you going to defend Hitler? He had lots of propaganda too...

See this is why most see you as an idiot on the subject. I'm not defending BB so much as pointing out what you think to be what happened is factually incorrect, along with pointing out your beliefs are only based in your hatred of all things Patriots.

 

[NEPatsfan]

What does any of this have to do with the ineligible play? The problem with that play is that the D doesn't have enough time on a quick snap to set because they have to identify who is actually eligible. It's a slight of hand compared to the fake spike as the refs are not involved to help slow the D's ability to cover the receivers. Funny but if this was done by the Fins pats fans would be calling us out on it...

As per some of the other examples agreed some were slimy but they were not involving the refs holding up the D's ability to make a play...

Actually they had plenty of time, as reported 7 seconds, 10 seconds, and 7 seconds respectfully.

How much time are you suggesting they get? The play clock is only 25 seconds and at the point those 7-10 seconds began to tick off was already down under 20-15 seconds.

Are you suggesting the defense should have so much time that the offense is forced to take a delay of game. That would be an actual rule violation, unlike the whining version you are crying about.

 

[NEPatsfan]

Way to "take it for the team"

Seemed like only like the right thing to do. Wonder if I'll get a SB ring should the Pats actually win the SB?

 

[NEPatsfan]

What do you not understand. The D should have the ability to know who's eligible or not with enough time before the balls snapped or its a huge advantage. Should everyone's D burn their time outs immediately until they have no more left? What is your solution then because if you say go into base zone D then you are effectively telling us that teams may have to play the game that way..every game which is ridiculous.

They were afforeded the alloted amount of time as described in the NFL rule book edtion 2014 season.

So if I understand you correctly the Patriots should give the opposing team more than what the rules say they are alloted?

 

[TheRobotDevil]

Seemed like only like the right thing to do. Wonder if I'll get a SB ring should the Pats actually win the SB?

It wouldn't bother you that it's tarnished? This is what I don't get they've list so much dignity. But I guess that's a part of the new nfl

 

[NEPatsfan]

The raiders used to be awful with abusing rules they've come a long way over the years. One could say the Patriots have set claim to that throne now
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Not really, they just suck so bad no one nationally notices when they abuse the rules.

As for this topic, it's not about abusing the rules, it's about playing by them.

 

[NEPatsfan]

The defense doesn't have the right to slow down the offense either. The question is what is a reasonable time? 5 seconds, 10 seconds, 30 seconds? Raise their hand when they're ready?

Teddy Bruschi had a comment on this on TV but I can't find it but he basically said it's on the defensive players too to be able to be aware and respond to these types of changes in a reasonable time. That's part of the game.

If the defense is not prepared then it does become a question of calling a time out or something. Teams do that often enough on both sides of the ball.

BINGO!

How much time should be alloted the defense to get set? The play clock is only 25 seconds, in this case they got 7-10 seconds after the player notified the official and the official announced it over the PA.

 

[NEPatsfan]

It wouldn't bother you that it's tarnished? This is what I don't get they've list so much dignity. But I guess that's a part of the new nfl

Nothing to worry about since the average person knows it wouldn't be.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

Nothing to worry about since the average pats fan blindly thinks it wouldn't be.

 

[FlyerFinFan]

The defense doesn't have the right to slow down the offense either. The question is what is a reasonable time? 5 seconds, 10 seconds, 30 seconds? Raise their hand when they're ready?

Teddy Bruschi had a comment on this on TV but I can't find it but he basically said it's on the defensive players too to be able to be aware and respond to these types of changes in a reasonable time. That's part of the game.

If the defense is not prepared then it does become a question of calling a time out or something. Teams do that often enough on both sides of the ball.

I agree that the D can't slow down the O just as they can't with a no huddle but when it involves the refs stepping in the D should have enough time to understand who's eligible and call their D. If not every team in the league will do this every play to everyone else's D. D's will have to stay in a zone as its not possible for one guy to run fast enough across a formation to the correct player. Basically the refs will slow down the play in these instances. Oh except in ******** world his league would work that way unless it was against his D of course haha!