What do the RAIDERS need

[idahoraiderfan33]

Oh definitely no hard feelings. I know that you and I just both have a great passion for our teams and football in general. While our debates might get a bit heated (mostly my fault) I always know at the end of them that you and I have great respect for one another and our respected teams.

And like you said it is the off season so what else are we to discuss? Now nothing really happens until July when Camps start up. This is the worst time of year for the NFL. Need Brady to go do something stupid again.
And also I will point out that my boy DeVontae Booker took my favorite RB of all times number with the number 20 (Good ol Barry Sanders).

It's all good man.. We both get pretty fired up at times, but never cross that line into name calling.. I see that as a sign of weakness btw, it means people can't hang while in a heated debate.. You don't have that problem..
Here are some great rivalry's in sports.. Oakland Vs Denver etc and Idaho Vs Cd.. Legendary!!

Anyways, it's the offseason and all we can do is pump our teams up till they CLASH in that prime time game!!
It makes the pressure to WIN that much better.. Besides there's always something to talk about when it comes to the AFCW..

And pretty cool that Booker got ya number.. Not only did you get the guy you wanted, but he took number 20 as well.. As for us?? We have a new 33 in the house!! You guys will meet him soon enough..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

For the record.. I think the AFCW is wide open with 4 pretty evenly matched teams fighting for it!!
Now i pick my RAIDERS to WIN it, and as the offseason moves along i will give my reasons why i think that..
If anybody thinks im wrong?? Then by all means let's talk about why im wrong..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So Mack edges out Von Miller in PFFs top 101.. Hmmmmm
All Pro DE/LB.. Crazy how times are changing.. Mack Attack is still a puppy that will have MORE help this year..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So Mack edges out Von Miller in PFFs top 101.. Hmmmmm
All Pro DE/LB.. Crazy how times are changing.. Mack Attack is still a puppy that will have MORE help this year..

So Mack Attack was put on the NFL MVP watch list.. Not bad for a player entering his 3rd year..

What do you think about that??

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So Mack Attack was put on the NFL MVP watch list.. Not bad for a player entering his 3rd year..

What do you think about that??

You out there cd?? And if so, thoughts on this??

 

[cdumler7]

You out there cd?? And if so, thoughts on this??

Hey sorry I'm pretty hit and miss for the next couple of weeks of whether I am here. We are in the final stretches for our golf team and getting ready for State Golf. We are ranked 2nd in the state so pushing hard to see if we can be State Champions which has never happened for this town at least in the sport of Golf.

Anyway my thoughts on this are Khalil Mack is a great player. I can see why they would put him on the list but obviously it would take an out of this world season to have a defensive player win it. JJ Watt put up one of the best seasons I have ever seen from a defensive player I think 2 or 3 seasons ago and he still didn't win it. So while it is nice to see his name on the list I give it about a .00005% chance of actually happening.

As for him being ranked over Miller on PFF. Like I said he is a great player so no real problem with it. I do think that Miller is a bigger impact player though as he does effect the passing game more than Mack. Mack is the more all around player but Miller is the better pass rusher. And with the passing game being king I would rather have the pass rusher than the all-around guy. Another part of this is the fact that with Miller the Broncos have yet to miss the playoffs. While Mack has yet to elevate his team to playoffs. So at this point I can't see how anybody could argue that Mack has been the better more impactful player of the two.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Hey sorry I'm pretty hit and miss for the next couple of weeks of whether I am here. We are in the final stretches for our golf team and getting ready for State Golf. We are ranked 2nd in the state so pushing hard to see if we can be State Champions which has never happened for this town at least in the sport of Golf.

Anyway my thoughts on this are Khalil Mack is a great player. I can see why they would put him on the list but obviously it would take an out of this world season to have a defensive player win it. JJ Watt put up one of the best seasons I have ever seen from a defensive player I think 2 or 3 seasons ago and he still didn't win it. So while it is nice to see his name on the list I give it about a .00005% chance of actually happening.

As for him being ranked over Miller on PFF. Like I said he is a great player so no real problem with it. I do think that Miller is a bigger impact player though as he does effect the passing game more than Mack. Mack is the more all around player but Miller is the better pass rusher. And with the passing game being king I would rather have the pass rusher than the all-around guy. Another part of this is the fact that with Miller the Broncos have yet to miss the playoffs. While Mack has yet to elevate his team to playoffs. So at this point I can't see how anybody could argue that Mack has been the better more impactful player of the two.

No problem dude.. Go win that championship!! Rank number 2 in the state is pretty dang good for any sport..
I assume it's Colorado where you have that Rank?? Impressive, a lot of Golfing people in that State..

Now as for Mack?? I think you under selling him as a pass rusher.. Mack had the Sack lead heading into the last game of the year, and Watt beat him out playing that weak Jags OL..
Mack's pass rush game really took off once Edwards started playing the other side.. Sort of like what Miller has in Ware.. Mack's pass rush game should really take off this year, with a healthy Edwards in his second year, along with Irvin, Calhoun etc.. I take nothing from Von Miller dude is great, but he has a lot of help in Ware, Wolf, etc..
Mack has his help this year and some..

 

[cdumler7]

No problem dude.. Go win that championship!! Rank number 2 in the state is pretty dang good for any sport..
I assume it's Colorado where you have that Rank?? Impressive, a lot of Golfing people in that State..

Now as for Mack?? I think you under selling him as a pass rusher.. Mack had the Sack lead heading into the last game of the year, and Watt beat him out playing that weak Jags OL..
Mack's pass rush game really took off once Edwards started playing the other side.. Sort of like what Miller has in Ware.. Mack's pass rush game should really take off this year, with a healthy Edwards in his second year, along with Irvin, Calhoun etc.. I take nothing from Von Miller dude is great, but he has a lot of help in Ware, Wolf, etc..
Mack has his help this year and some..

I'm actually from Kansas right now. It definitely would be more impressive in Colorado. The nice thing is for our team is that we have a bunch of really good golfers that I have worked with through a summer golf program coming up so thankfully our team should be good for a very long time.

Anyway understand when I say Mack is not as good of a pass rusher that isn't trying to take away from Mack's ability. My opinion is that Von Miller is the best pass rusher in the league. Sacks are great but they don't tell the entire story of a pass rusher. Take Ezekiel Ansah of the Lions. He had 14.5 sacks this past season. 6 of those 14.5 sacks were just clean-up plays where a QB scrambled because of pressure from another player and just happened to run into Ansah. 3 of them he was unblocked. So just goes to show that a player can have great sack numbers but not exactly be the best pass rusher.

I look at total pressures, sacks, and hits to really see the impact a guy made on the pass rush and well nobody really comes close to Von Miller on those numbers. Again that doesn't mean that Mack isn't a great pass rusher.

I would also say something that can't be measured is that of what do they do in the biggest moments of the game or in the biggest games of the year? Well those are when Miller seems to shine. He made some ridiculous game changing plays especially in the playoffs when we needed him to be a star. So far while Mack has put up good numbers it still hasn't lead to wins for the team.

And you can say that it is the talent around Miller but he is doubled almost every single play. Heck when he went down with injury a couple of years ago they compared the games he played in compared to the games he missed and offenses averaged over 100 yards more per game and close to 10 more points per game when he wasn't in the game. He alone can impact a game for more than a touchdown difference.

Also if you want to look at sack numbers really for Mack it boils down to either he was really really good or just didn't do anything. Almost half the games this past year he didn't have a sack. Also his 5 sacks against the Broncos was against our 3rd string RT. I would hope that he could dominate like that against our terrible RT. Almost everybody that year did. Mack wasn't the only one to have a career game against him.

Again remember this is not me saying Mack is not a great pass rusher. This is just me saying that Miller is the better of the two when both of them are probably top-5 guys in the league when it comes to getting after the QB. I just think Miller does it more and at more critical moments of the game when we absolutely have to have it.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

I'm actually from Kansas right now. It definitely would be more impressive in Colorado. The nice thing is for our team is that we have a bunch of really good golfers that I have worked with through a summer golf program coming up so thankfully our team should be good for a very long time.

Anyway understand when I say Mack is not as good of a pass rusher that isn't trying to take away from Mack's ability. My opinion is that Von Miller is the best pass rusher in the league. Sacks are great but they don't tell the entire story of a pass rusher. Take Ezekiel Ansah of the Lions. He had 14.5 sacks this past season. 6 of those 14.5 sacks were just clean-up plays where a QB scrambled because of pressure from another player and just happened to run into Ansah. 3 of them he was unblocked. So just goes to show that a player can have great sack numbers but not exactly be the best pass rusher.

I look at total pressures, sacks, and hits to really see the impact a guy made on the pass rush and well nobody really comes close to Von Miller on those numbers. Again that doesn't mean that Mack isn't a great pass rusher.

I would also say something that can't be measured is that of what do they do in the biggest moments of the game or in the biggest games of the year? Well those are when Miller seems to shine. He made some ridiculous game changing plays especially in the playoffs when we needed him to be a star. So far while Mack has put up good numbers it still hasn't lead to wins for the team.

And you can say that it is the talent around Miller but he is doubled almost every single play. Heck when he went down with injury a couple of years ago they compared the games he played in compared to the games he missed and offenses averaged over 100 yards more per game and close to 10 more points per game when he wasn't in the game. He alone can impact a game for more than a touchdown difference.

Also if you want to look at sack numbers really for Mack it boils down to either he was really really good or just didn't do anything. Almost half the games this past year he didn't have a sack. Also his 5 sacks against the Broncos was against our 3rd string RT. I would hope that he could dominate like that against our terrible RT. Almost everybody that year did. Mack wasn't the only one to have a career game against him.

Again remember this is not me saying Mack is not a great pass rusher. This is just me saying that Miller is the better of the two when both of them are probably top-5 guys in the league when it comes to getting after the QB. I just think Miller does it more and at more critical moments of the game when we absolutely have to have it.

I always thought you were from Colorado for some reason.. Regardless, impressive being second at State no matter what State you live in..

Anyways, Mack's game is all about pressure, and not only sacks.. Sacks are the glory stat for D players, but that don't make players a complete player either.. Mack is always pressuring the QB, and being held on most plays on top of it, but again, all elite pass rushers need a guy on the other side to take some pressure off said player..
Edwards did that for us till he got hurt and cost Mack the sack tittle.. I would say Mack will have around 20 sacks this year if healthy all year long, to go along with the best rush D game he has..
And as far as showing up for the big games?? This will be his 3rd year, and his team is much better, so he will play in bigger games.. You can't compare the games Mack and Miller have played in.. We were rebuilding, while you guys had PM and a super team around him.. But in the monster game we played in against each other in Denver, i would say Mack showed up big time.. That's not a knock either, just saying he can play in the big game.. He will show it big time this year.. I predict D Player of the year..

 

[cdumler7]

I always thought you were from Colorado for some reason.. Regardless, impressive being second at State no matter what State you live in..

Anyways, Mack's game is all about pressure, and not only sacks.. Sacks are the glory stat for D players, but that don't make players a complete player either.. Mack is always pressuring the QB, and being held on most plays on top of it, but again, all elite pass rushers need a guy on the other side to take some pressure off said player..
Edwards did that for us till he got hurt and cost Mack the sack tittle.. I would say Mack will have around 20 sacks this year if healthy all year long, to go along with the best rush D game he has..
And as far as showing up for the big games?? This will be his 3rd year, and his team is much better, so he will play in bigger games.. You can't compare the games Mack and Miller have played in.. We were rebuilding, while you guys had PM and a super team around him.. But in the monster game we played in against each other in Denver, i would say Mack showed up big time.. That's not a knock either, just saying he can play in the big game.. He will show it big time this year.. I predict D Player of the year..

Again just because I say Miller is better doesn't mean that Mack isn't a great pass rusher. Miller though on a per snap basis there was nobody better in the league at applying pressure. Heck the article you reference on PFF says exactly the same thing that Miller is the better pass rusher of the two while Mack is the better all around player by a hair.

As for the whole "you guys had PM" well that wasn't always true during the Von Miller career. His first year we were coming off a 4-12 season (which is the reason we could pick 2nd in the draft to get a guy like Miller) and were working on rebuilding the team. We had just hired a whole new coaching staff and FO. So we were the very definition of rebuilding and guess what we made the playoffs with Tim Tebow starting most of the season. Throw in then this past season where the Broncos had some of the worst QB play in the entire league and again made the playoffs. So when Manning wasn't playing at a HOF level it was our defense that won games for us. So can't use the excuse of "Well we were rebuilding."

And I guess we will see how Mack does this upcoming season. If I were a betting man I would go Aaron Donald. Man was I screaming at the tv for the Broncos to trade up for this guy. He has proven me right becoming I think the best defensive player in the entire league.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Again just because I say Miller is better doesn't mean that Mack isn't a great pass rusher. Miller though on a per snap basis there was nobody better in the league at applying pressure. Heck the article you reference on PFF says exactly the same thing that Miller is the better pass rusher of the two while Mack is the better all around player by a hair.

As for the whole "you guys had PM" well that wasn't always true during the Von Miller career. His first year we were coming off a 4-12 season (which is the reason we could pick 2nd in the draft to get a guy like Miller) and were working on rebuilding the team. We had just hired a whole new coaching staff and FO. So we were the very definition of rebuilding and guess what we made the playoffs with Tim Tebow starting most of the season. Throw in then this past season where the Broncos had some of the worst QB play in the entire league and again made the playoffs. So when Manning wasn't playing at a HOF level it was our defense that won games for us. So can't use the excuse of "Well we were rebuilding."

And I guess we will see how Mack does this upcoming season. If I were a betting man I would go Aaron Donald. Man was I screaming at the tv for the Broncos to trade up for this guy. He has proven me right becoming I think the best defensive player in the entire league.

What all this comes down to cd, is who has the better team around them.. And up to this year Von Miller has..
I mean Miller has been playing with the top pass rushing and secondary D in the league..
Having a TOP rated secondary was buying Miller that extra second or two to get to the QB!! And not to mention Ware crashing the other side of the line, with great push up the middle from Malik and Wolfe..
All the while being backed by PM, DT, Sanders, a RUN game etc..
Mack on the other hand didn't have that, but a young rebuilding team around him, and even then the guy was just a BEAST player that was second in the league in sacks!! Some fluke game against the WEAK Jags OL is the only reason why Watt took the sack total from Mack..
Mack now has an improved team around him, with pass rushers coming from everywhere Along with a secondary.. You think that will help his game out?? You know it will..
Mack made history by being voted All Pro at 2 spots, if that don't say BEST D player in the league nothing does..
Again, Von Miller is a great player, but he is no Mack Attack..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So Conner Cook getting good reviews for rookie camp.. When it's all said and done, he will be the best QB from his draft class imo.. In time the bidding will start at a first round pick..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So Conner Cook getting good reviews for rookie camp.. When it's all said and done, he will be the best QB from his draft class imo.. In time the bidding will start at a first round pick..

So Cook looks outstanding so they say, and VERY humble!! Smh how this dude with franchise tools fell to us in the 4th round..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So Cook looks outstanding so they say, and VERY humble!! Smh how this dude with franchise tools fell to us in the 4th round..

I was NOT scouting QBs leading up to this draft, cuz we have Carr!! But dang, after looking at his game what a freakin steal this dude can be for us.. Pro Ready!!

 

[cdumler7]

I was NOT scouting QBs leading up to this draft, cuz we have Carr!! But dang, after looking at his game what a freakin steal this dude can be for us.. Pro Ready!!

So have you watched any of the other QB's to know how he looks compared to them? I watched pretty much all the top QB's in this draft knowing the Broncos would take one. With Cook it all depends which game you watch of his. He has some games where he looks really good and makes some passes that leaving you going "Wow!" and then other games where all you can say is "What an idiot!" Of all the top QB's he was definitely the most inconsistent of the group. The others had a bad game here or there but with Cook it was just about every other game of whether it was good or bad. His good is easily top-3 in this class. His bad games though easily should have had him undrafted. So depends how you want to view him.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So have you watched any of the other QB's to know how he looks compared to them? I watched pretty much all the top QB's in this draft knowing the Broncos would take one. With Cook it all depends which game you watch of his. He has some games where he looks really good and makes some passes that leaving you going "Wow!" and then other games where all you can say is "What an idiot!" Of all the top QB's he was definitely the most inconsistent of the group. The others had a bad game here or there but with Cook it was just about every other game of whether it was good or bad. His good is easily top-3 in this class. His bad games though easily should have had him undrafted. So depends how you want to view him.

I have seen enough of the others to safely say Cook is more advanced over them.. Well i would put Goff right there with him.. And as far as bad games go?? They all have bad games cd.. Does he have the tools to be a great player is what we are looking for, the rest you can teach..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So Mack said the RAIDER D can be just as good as Denver's D from last year, with continued growth and the team coming together as a unit..
Well, both teams have a top 5 D player in the league.. Denver has Ware, we have Irvin, MEJ, Aurty and Calhoun to play the other side.. Denver has Wolfe, we have Williams, Jelly, MEJ, Autry and Jihad Ward..
The great thing about MEJ and Aurty they can both play inside and out, Reggie type players!!
Our secondary has Amerson, Smith, Carrie all over 6 foot, along with Hayden and Thorpe..
At S out first round pick Karl Joseph, BallHawk Nelson, Allen and Carrie who also plays S for us.. Not Bad at all..

So yeah, i can see why Mack would say that..
There's no limit how good they can be.. But like Mack said, coming together as a unit is the key..
You better have a good OL when we play YOU!!

 

[cdumler7]

I have seen enough of the others to safely say Cook is more advanced over them.. Well i would put Goff right there with him.. And as far as bad games go?? They all have bad games cd.. Does he have the tools to be a great player is what we are looking for, the rest you can teach..

Well I guess to each their own but I have watched probably 10 or more games of every QB in this draft that had that much film (the kid from Ohio State did not have that many games started). Cook like I said it depended which game you watched. His bad games were much worse than the others that I watched. He would bounce the ball 5 yards in front of the WR when it was a 15 yard pass. He would throw into triple coverage on a regular basis. In college he could get away with it a bit more but in the NFL all those passes are picked off. He also struggled to consistently throw on the run. In fact he had the worst QB rating of any of the top-10 guys in this draft when throwing on the run. With today's NFL just seems like you have to be able to throw while moving around in the pocket and not having your feet completely set. He also struggled on passes outside the hashes again having one of the worst QB ratings of the group when throwing outside the hash. Now given he did have the best QB rating of anybody when throwing between the hashes. Just shows he has some major flaws though when throwing the football and struggles to have the power to threaten the outside (had the slowest time of any QB at the combine when throwing for speed showing a possible lack of velocity on his passes).

And also what I mean by bad games is just look at how he closed out his college career. He threw only 3 touchdowns to 4 interceptions over the final 4 games. He had 3 of the 4 games he failed to actually throw a touchdown pass. He had 5 games this year he didn't complete over 50% of his passes. Against the better teams he faced he had much lower stats which is somewhat expected but also shows he really struggles when the competition can actually do something to stop him.

I guess we will see but I was not surprised he dropped like he did. He had probably the most bad film of any QB in this draft (given he probably played more games than most) and there are questions of his character/attitude.

 

[cdumler7]

So Mack said the RAIDER D can be just as good as Denver's D from last year, with continued growth and the team coming together as a unit..
Well, both teams have a top 5 D player in the league.. Denver has Ware, we have Irvin, MEJ, Aurty and Calhoun to play the other side.. Denver has Wolfe, we have Williams, Jelly, MEJ, Autry and Jihad Ward..
The great thing about MEJ and Aurty they can both play inside and out, Reggie type players!!
Our secondary has Amerson, Smith, Carrie all over 6 foot, along with Hayden and Thorpe..
At S out first round pick Karl Joseph, BallHawk Nelson, Allen and Carrie who also plays S for us.. Not Bad at all..

So yeah, i can see why Mack would say that..
There's no limit how good they can be.. But like Mack said, coming together as a unit is the key..
You better have a good OL when we play YOU!!

What do you expect him to say though? I mean every player right now is saying things like this. Brandon Mebane for the Chargers said that the Chargers have more talent on their defense than that of when he played on the Seahawks. Now honestly that is a ridiculous comment but at the same time yeah all teams have high hopes of what their team can be.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Well I guess to each their own but I have watched probably 10 or more games of every QB in this draft that had that much film (the kid from Ohio State did not have that many games started). Cook like I said it depended which game you watched. His bad games were much worse than the others that I watched. He would bounce the ball 5 yards in front of the WR when it was a 15 yard pass. He would throw into triple coverage on a regular basis. In college he could get away with it a bit more but in the NFL all those passes are picked off. He also struggled to consistently throw on the run. In fact he had the worst QB rating of any of the top-10 guys in this draft when throwing on the run. With today's NFL just seems like you have to be able to throw while moving around in the pocket and not having your feet completely set. He also struggled on passes outside the hashes again having one of the worst QB ratings of the group when throwing outside the hash. Now given he did have the best QB rating of anybody when throwing between the hashes. Just shows he has some major flaws though when throwing the football and struggles to have the power to threaten the outside (had the slowest time of any QB at the combine when throwing for speed showing a possible lack of velocity on his passes).

And also what I mean by bad games is just look at how he closed out his college career. He threw only 3 touchdowns to 4 interceptions over the final 4 games. He had 3 of the 4 games he failed to actually throw a touchdown pass. He had 5 games this year he didn't complete over 50% of his passes. Against the better teams he faced he had much lower stats which is somewhat expected but also shows he really struggles when the competition can actually do something to stop him.

I guess we will see but I was not surprised he dropped like he did. He had probably the most bad film of any QB in this draft (given he probably played more games than most) and there are questions of his character/attitude.

cd, here you pimped Cook pretty hard, saying how good he is Pro Ready etc, and now that you guys didn't draft him the guy suddenly can't play?? Cmon man.. Again cd i didn't really look into QBs leading up to the draft, but from what i have seen read etc?? The guy is right there with Goff, the rest are projects..
And mind you i did see plenty of games from Cook as MSU was always on TV but never really in detail..
What this comes down too?? Is Cook better than Lynch?? That remains to be seen, but i can safely say Cook is more advanced at this point in their careers..

And we must remember also cd, Carr is the franchise for the RAIDERS and Cook his back up..
Lynch is the future for you guys..
It was posted everywhere, Cook looks outstanding!! Are we really shocked by that?? 4 year player at a top School playing in a Pro System, and has all the tools to be a good one.. I mean, i would be shocked if he look crappy!!