What do the RAIDERS need

[cdumler7]

Also Idaho just go check out the Broncos page on this site. None of us were pounding the table for Washington. WE talked about a ton of RB's that we wanted and his name did not come up. So this isn't coming out of left field just because you guys drafted him. This is coming from months of watching this kid compared to others and arriving at this conclusion. You can also see that many of us pounded the table for Booker. Clear back in January we talked about him being our favorite RB in the entire draft (knew we had no shot at Elliot). So not like I just became a Booker fan after the Broncos drafted him. Same with Lynch. I've been pounding the table for months for this kid. Very rare that guys that I have really really liked for the Broncos have actually been drafted by them.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Again not saying he wont' be a success. What I am saying is he was drafted earlier than what I thought he would be. And like I said I watched a ton of his games. I love the kid but he does have some weaknesses to his game.

And no he is not the best Safety prospect I have seen come into this league in a while. Jalen Ramsey is one of the few prospects I have watched that I had to stop because it was making me so sad that we stood no chance to get him. Not sure I have been that blown away by a prospect before. The kid is special. I would be absolutely shocked if he is not a top-5 safety after his rookie year. Eric Berry was not quite to that level but he definitely looked deserving of a top-5 pick with his play. Earl Thomas was another that I just loved coming out of Texas. I hated so much that the Seahawks used the 1st round pick we traded them for the one guy I really wanted in that draft. He was a super star in college and did the same in the pros. Those are just 3 recent names that I have watched a ton of college tape that I thought would be incredible in the pros.

Lous Riddick broke down the tape and pretty much said why Ramsey will not live up to the hype.. And then said why Joseph is the BEST DB in the draft.. Im not impressed with Ramsey at all, i mean he's ok but he's no Joseph at the S spot that's for sure.. If both are healthy Joseph will out play him at S.. No doubt in my mind..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Like I've said before 2 people can look at the same thing and arrive at 2 completely different thoughts. When I watched Washington I saw a guy who struggled to hit the holes when they shrunk down. He doesn't have great vision. His superior athleticism worked in college in a spread system that allowed for huge holes to open up. Those shrink in the pros which is why I said those smaller speed style backs are very hard to judge on how they will do in the NFL because speed alone cannot win in the NFL. Vision becomes the most important trait a RB needs going into the Pros and that is very difficult to judge because most of the time they are running through giant holes in college.

Struggle to hit hole?? Lol he was popping what, 6.0 per pop.. Cmon man.. Washington will be better than Booker Book it assuming they both stay healthy..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Also Idaho just go check out the Broncos page on this site. None of us were pounding the table for Washington. WE talked about a ton of RB's that we wanted and his name did not come up. So this isn't coming out of left field just because you guys drafted him. This is coming from months of watching this kid compared to others and arriving at this conclusion. You can also see that many of us pounded the table for Booker. Clear back in January we talked about him being our favorite RB in the entire draft (knew we had no shot at Elliot). So not like I just became a Booker fan after the Broncos drafted him. Same with Lynch. I've been pounding the table for months for this kid. Very rare that guys that I have really really liked for the Broncos have actually been drafted by them.

We are fans cd, not GMs with highly rated drafts.. We could of had Booker if we wanted too but passed.. Washington is the guy we wanted..

 

[DJ Fieri]

I'm ot sure why we got the worst grade in the AFC West. It wasn't a great draft but a solid one imo.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

I'm ot sure why we got the worst grade in the AFC West. It wasn't a great draft but a solid one imo.

It depends who gave the grades out.. Kiper gave us the best one..

 

[cdumler7]

We are fans cd, not GMs with highly rated drafts.. We could of had Booker if we wanted too but passed.. Washington is the guy we wanted..

I agree we are not GM's. I will say that I do communicate almost daily with actual NFL scouts and people who have worked in the NFL. So a lot of what I do say comes from people much much smarter about the NFL than me. I have worked to get to know this game and to do that it always means talk to people much smarter than yourself in the field. Obviously these people don't agree on everything and obviously you have already listed people that really love Joseph and his potential. Like I've said Idaho I love the kid too. I wanted him on the Broncos. You are taking this completely wrong. Just because I don't think he is going to be as good as you are saying he is going to be doesn't mean I don't like the kid. I also do think many times when it comes to the Raiders you do go full homer and many on here agree with me on that that you struggle to ever see anything wrong with the Raiders and anything they do. There are always going to be differing opinions on players...

Heck look at your 2nd round pick. Some really love Ward a lot and others don't. PFF graded that as one of the worst picks in the entire draft. I disagree with that assessment. I think Ward's best football is ahead of him. That is why the draft is so fascinating in we just don't know. We can watch all the tape in the world on these kids and think we know what they are and their career go in a completely different direction.

 

[cdumler7]

It depends who gave the grades out.. Kiper gave us the best one..

Actually he graded them as the 10th best draft in the NFL.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

I agree we are not GM's. I will say that I do communicate almost daily with actual NFL scouts and people who have worked in the NFL. So a lot of what I do say comes from people much much smarter about the NFL than me. I have worked to get to know this game and to do that it always means talk to people much smarter than yourself in the field. Obviously these people don't agree on everything and obviously you have already listed people that really love Joseph and his potential. Like I've said Idaho I love the kid too. I wanted him on the Broncos. You are taking this completely wrong. Just because I don't think he is going to be as good as you are saying he is going to be doesn't mean I don't like the kid. I also do think many times when it comes to the Raiders you do go full homer and many on here agree with me on that that you struggle to ever see anything wrong with the Raiders and anything they do. There are always going to be differing opinions on players...

Heck look at your 2nd round pick. Some really love Ward a lot and others don't. PFF graded that as one of the worst picks in the entire draft. I disagree with that assessment. I think Ward's best football is ahead of him. That is why the draft is so fascinating in we just don't know. We can watch all the tape in the world on these kids and think we know what they are and their career go in a completely different direction.

But don't you see cd, i see things the same way but im not a rude person to say what i really think.. So i just roll with it.. That's good that you learning the game like that, but got my own eyes and my own judgement of talent.. It's pretty easy to see who could be good and who can't at whatever.. You just see it man..

Now as far as Joseph goes?? It's pretty easy to see he has All Pro skills, anybody can see that.. The only reason he fell was his injury, but we took him anyways, cuz of the major talent he has.. Like i said dude, your team will get to know him pretty good..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Actually he graded them as the 10th best draft in the NFL.

In the ACFW it was the best one according to him.. B+ for us and B- for the rest..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

In the ACFW it was the best one according to him.. B+ for us and B- for the rest..

And this was not a bling type draft for us either.. We are pretty deep now, so we drafting great depth and players that will push our starters and even start over some.. But Joseph was drafted to be the starter..

 

[cdumler7]

In the ACFW it was the best one according to him.. B+ for us and B- for the rest..

Got yah. Yeah you are right he did give them the best mark of the AFC West.

And Idaho I'm not trying to be rude. Sorry if it is coming across that way. You and I just speak in different ways. For your team you are a positive person and there is nothing wrong with that. You hate to say anything negative ever about your team and just always think the best is going to happen. I go back and forth depending on the day of how I feel about things. I try to look for the good but also look for the pitfalls that could happen with anything. Such as the Broncos draft I see the good and the bad with every pick we made. i see why they could fail and why they might be successful.

With Joseph again I like the kid and I see the talent. I think if injuries don't do him in (most compare him to Bob Sanders because they have similar playing styles and body build and Sanders' biggest issue was his hard hitting aggressive style broke down his body quickly) he should be at worst a solid starter for you guys with potential to be a star.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Got yah. Yeah you are right he did give them the best mark of the AFC West.

And Idaho I'm not trying to be rude. Sorry if it is coming across that way. You and I just speak in different ways. For your team you are a positive person and there is nothing wrong with that. You hate to say anything negative ever about your team and just always think the best is going to happen. I go back and forth depending on the day of how I feel about things. I try to look for the good but also look for the pitfalls that could happen with anything. Such as the Broncos draft I see the good and the bad with every pick we made. i see why they could fail and why they might be successful.

With Joseph again I like the kid and I see the talent. I think if injuries don't do him in (most compare him to Bob Sanders because they have similar playing styles and body build and Sanders' biggest issue was his hard hitting aggressive style broke down his body quickly) he should be at worst a solid starter for you guys with potential to be a star.

The only open spot on our team was S and we drafted Karl Joseph a beast Rookie S!! So our draft didn't really have any bling to it.. But people that know the game and not just the hype part of the game understand what the RAIDERS did, and gave them the high marks.. Trench warfare dude.. Jihad, Calhoun, Alexander!!
Well, i guess we did draft some bling in Conner Cook and Deandre Washington!!

And don't trip dude about being rude or not, it bothers me not.. But it does bother me if im rude..

 

[cdumler7]

The only open spot on our team was S and we drafted Karl Joseph a beast Rookie S!! So our draft didn't really have any bling to it.. But people that know the game and not just the hype part of the game understand what the RAIDERS did, and gave them the high marks.. Trench warfare dude.. Jihad, Calhoun, Alexander!!
Well, i guess we did draft some bling in Conner Cook and Deandre Washington!!

And don't trip dude about being rude or not, it bothers me not.. But it does bother me if im rude..

So my question then is anybody who didn't think the Raiders did good in the draft have no clue what they are talking about? Just seems that you lean towards only people who agree with you and discount those who don't. I think the Raiders had a decent draft but I don't think it isn't without some criticism just like every draft of every team. Now obviously none of us know how these kids will produce as there are always those who don't produce in college who do great in the NFL and those who did great in college who stink it up in the pros. I'm just saying it is hard to have this conversation with you when it just seems like the only opinion that matters is the ones that agree with you on how great and awesome the Raiders are and how they cannot do wrong.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So my question then is anybody who didn't think the Raiders did good in the draft have no clue what they are talking about? Just seems that you lean towards only people who agree with you and discount those who don't. I think the Raiders had a decent draft but I don't think it isn't without some criticism just like every draft of every team. Now obviously none of us know how these kids will produce as there are always those who don't produce in college who do great in the NFL and those who did great in college who stink it up in the pros. I'm just saying it is hard to have this conversation with you when it just seems like the only opinion that matters is the ones that agree with you on how great and awesome the Raiders are and how they cannot do wrong.

This is a two way street we walking on cd.. I think we both push what we believe, and neither backs down from those POVs.. That's what makes these debates great man!! My positive energy Vs you dude..

Now of course dude NOT everything is good with the RAIDERS!! We hit and miss just like everybody else..
But i don't dwell on the miss, i move on from that look forward to the next good thing..
Now will all our draft picks pan out?? I have no idea dude.. But im not going to be doom and gloom over it either..

 

[cdumler7]

This is a two way street we walking on cd.. I think we both push what we believe, and neither backs down from those POVs.. That's what makes these debates great man!! My positive energy Vs you dude..

Now of course dude NOT everything is good with the RAIDERS!! We hit and miss just like everybody else..
But i don't dwell on the miss, i move on from that look forward to the next good thing..
Now will all our draft picks pan out?? I have no idea dude.. But im not going to be doom and gloom over it either..

What I mean here though Idaho is that until proven otherwise all you seem to see is the good. Which hey again not a bad quality to have. I wish I probably did it more. Just when it comes to actually evaluating a player when all you can see is the good and nothing seems wrong with them then to me it would be hard to really trust your judgment on a player. Such as Karl Joseph while yes there are lots and lots of great qualities to like he is not perfect. None of these players are. So the fact that any even small critique I have of him you just seem to dismiss again makes it hard to actually have a discussion about these players.

For the Broncos I can go through every pick and pick out something I don't like about them and why i can see them struggle
Paxton Lynch--No experience in a pro style offense. People question some of his ability to learn quickly with his 18 on the Wonderlic
Adam Gotsis--Very raw player only having played 4 actual years of football coming from Australia. Coming off an injury that could hamper his ability to be ready for the year.
Justin Simmons--Now this one I can't find anything wrong. Probably my favorite safety in the entire draft. Ok just kidding. Just a bit on the skinny side. Can he handle the grind of the NFL?
Booker--Injury history and fumbling issues in college
McGovern--can sometimes have slow feet which is not good in a ZBS.
Andy Jonovich--Not the classic bruiser of a FB that we saw in the old days.
Will Parks--More of an in the box safety. Honestly don't know much about this kid
Riley Dixon--Probably my least favorite pick the Broncos made. I thought there were punters that were better than him that ended up going undrafted.

Now I can easily list off the good qualities they have too and why they will succeed. I guess to me this is how you have a good conversation about these players when you are willing to admit they have flaws and can see the good and the bad in them.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

What I mean here though Idaho is that until proven otherwise all you seem to see is the good. Which hey again not a bad quality to have. I wish I probably did it more. Just when it comes to actually evaluating a player when all you can see is the good and nothing seems wrong with them then to me it would be hard to really trust your judgment on a player. Such as Karl Joseph while yes there are lots and lots of great qualities to like he is not perfect. None of these players are. So the fact that any even small critique I have of him you just seem to dismiss again makes it hard to actually have a discussion about these players.

For the Broncos I can go through every pick and pick out something I don't like about them and why i can see them struggle
Paxton Lynch--No experience in a pro style offense. People question some of his ability to learn quickly with his 18 on the Wonderlic
Adam Gotsis--Very raw player only having played 4 actual years of football coming from Australia. Coming off an injury that could hamper his ability to be ready for the year.
Justin Simmons--Now this one I can't find anything wrong. Probably my favorite safety in the entire draft. Ok just kidding. Just a bit on the skinny side. Can he handle the grind of the NFL?
Booker--Injury history and fumbling issues in college
McGovern--can sometimes have slow feet which is not good in a ZBS.
Andy Jonovich--Not the classic bruiser of a FB that we saw in the old days.
Will Parks--More of an in the box safety. Honestly don't know much about this kid
Riley Dixon--Probably my least favorite pick the Broncos made. I thought there were punters that were better than him that ended up going undrafted.

Now I can easily list off the good qualities they have too and why they will succeed. I guess to me this is how you have a good conversation about these players when you are willing to admit they have flaws and can see the good and the bad in them.

Is this what you want to hear from me??
Karl Joseph- Badazz S but had a major injury
Jihad Ward- Super potential but raw
Shillique Calhoun- Monster edge rusher but weak against the run
Conner Cook- Franchise tools, but a tool bag
Deandre Washington- Beast RB but the knock on him is his size
Cory James- Looks good, a do it all player, but don't know enough about him
Vadal Alexander- 6-6 329 and ALL SEC Everything

Every player drafted has a knock against him, everyone..
But that's not why they get drafted, they get drafted cuz of the good and NOT the bad.. You can teach the bad out of players, but the good you are born with..

 

[cdumler7]

Is this what you want to hear from me??
Karl Joseph- Badazz S but had a major injury
Jihad Ward- Super potential but raw
Shillique Calhoun- Monster edge rusher but weak against the run
Conner Cook- Franchise tools, but a tool bag
Deandre Washington- Beast RB but the knock on him is his size
Cory James- Looks good, a do it all player, but don't know enough about him
Vadal Alexander- 6-6 329 and ALL SEC Everything

Every player drafted has a knock against him, everyone..
But that's not why they get drafted, they get drafted cuz of the good and NOT the bad.. You can teach the bad out of players, but the good you are born with..

Well some of the bad you can teach out of them. I don't think you can coach the being a jerk out of Cook. That is just a personality trait that has happened throughout his life.

What I am saying is there is a reason that all of your players didn't go 1st overall. There are reasons all of these players dropped to where they are because like you said they do have negatives about them. It just seems if I have brought up any negative about your players you have completely shot it down and pretty much acted like I have no clue what I am talking about. Or those who have written anything negative about the Raiders just don't understand what they are doing. Well there is a reason that the Raiders haven't had a winning season since what 2002. They have made a lot of bad decisions for a very long time. Yes things look to be on the way up and they look like a promising team but that doesn't mean everything they do is perfect and it doesn't mean that everybody who disagrees with what the Raiders have done don't know what they are talking about.

I've asked this question of you before but your FA class...You keep saying they are perfect fits but most of them come from complete opposite schemes...So how are they actual scheme fits? Many of them have not played in a scheme like that of Raiders so you can't say they are great fits because we just don't know. Doesn't mean they can't play in the Raiders scheme but it does mean most of their success has come playing in a different way than how they will play with the Raiders unless the Raiders are planning on changing schemes on the offensive and defensive side of the ball. I promise you I'm not trying to be mean with these questions just trying to show plenty of people have looked deeper into all of these things and have come to the same conclusion or question I have of "Why?" Why these players?

 

[TheRobotDevil]

Of course you are going to disagree with me when debating our players.. Washington is a 3 down RB dude..
We have a pro bowl RB starting for us, but Washington will steal some of his carries.. And like i said, would not be shocked if he starts at some point in the season.. Reggie loves Washington..

Im hearing a lot of comparisons between Washington and Megget. If thats the case i'll be thrilled. Megget was very under rated. And as clutch as clutch got.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

gotta like the YAC and how he operates in space