Toronto gets hockey team - as does Seattle, Quebec, Las Vegas

[Bloody Brian Burke]

a straight out expansion fee for a new Toronto franchise would probably be 1 bill

I think that might be the floor in terms of a possible expansion fee. Combined with arena in the city or immediate suburbs, this could be a $2 billion proposition by the time everything is said and done.

It's weird, though. There are a lot of transplants from other cities who might latch onto a 2nd Toronto team just purely out of their hatred for anything Leafs, but the Leafs could (and probably will) be god-awful for another 20 years, and if there is a second franchise here I still couldn't see myself changing allegiances.

I suppose if a second team were successful on the ice they could sway the youngsters, but I don't see many Leaf die-hards changing teams.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

and lets be honest ... True North paid that "relocation" fee because the NHL knew they could charge them ... noone in seattle or KC is desperate enough or willing to pay that ... it really is like 2 different leagues/sports when it comes to business

 

[jstewismybastardson]

I think that might be the floor in terms of a possible expansion fee. Combined with arena in the city or immediate suburbs, this could be a $2 billion proposition by the time everything is said and done.

It's weird, though. There are a lot of transplants from other cities who might latch onto a 2nd Toronto team just purely out of their hatred for anything Leafs, but the Leafs could (and probably will) be god-awful for another 20 years, and if there is a second franchise here I still couldn't see myself changing allegiances.

I suppose if a second team were successful on the ice they could sway the youngsters, but I don't see many Leaf die-hards changing teams.

I think the only way MLSE agrees to a second team is if the new team plays out of ACC and they manage everything arena ops related in virtual perpetuity ... that would bring about an expansion fee of around 1 bill

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

and lets be honest ... True North paid that "relocation" fee because the NHL knew they could charge them ... noone in seattle or KC is desperate enough or willing to pay that ... it really is like 2 different leagues/sports when it comes to business

I think KC might (not that I think hockey in KC is a good idea or can work) - that arena has been longing for a tenant for almost a decade now.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

I think KC might (not that I think hockey in KC is a good idea or can work) - that arena has been longing for a tenant for almost a decade now.

Sprint Center was the 8th busiest arena in North America in 2013 ... the mayor doesnt think they need an NHL team

and more importantly ... no one has publically stepped up and said they want to own a team there ... not even a rumoured owner



/Sprint Center Opens 2014 As America's Fourth Busiest Arena. Ranked 14th Busiest Arena In World

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

I think the only way MLSE agrees to a second team is if the new team plays out of ACC and they manage everything arena ops related in virtual perpetuity ... that would bring about an expansion fee of around 1 bill

I don't think any expansion team would agree to that - one of the benefits of owning a team in Toronto is the price gouging. That would be a lot of lost revenue potential (and since MLSE would be charging rent, a lot of costs where there should be revenues).

Also, a new barn could charge something MLSE can't really at the ACC - parking. A suburban arena could charge $30+ for parking for both hockey and other events.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

I don't think any expansion team would agree to that - one of the benefits of owning a team in Toronto is the price gouging. That would be a lot of lost revenue potential (and since MLSE would be charging rent, a lot of costs where there should be revenues).

Also, a new barn could charge something MLSE can't really at the ACC - parking. A suburban arena could charge $30+ for parking for both hockey and other events.

if its the only way to own a second Toronto team ??? ... I think the loopy demand trumps this consideration you bring up ... plus the expansion price would be 1 bill instead of 2 bill

the tickets would still be overpriced ... maybe they split arena related revenue

the point is there wont be a second team in TO unless MLSE gets paid ... why pay them the extortionar ... err ... I mean ... "relocation fee" plus have to build your own building when you can placate them with ongoing revenue and avoid incremental infrastructure costs

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Sprint Center was the 8th busiest arena in North America in 2013 ... the mayor doesnt think they need an NHL team

and more importantly ... no one has publically stepped up and said they want to own a team there ... not even a rumoured owner



/Sprint Center Opens 2014 As America's Fourth Busiest Arena. Ranked 14th Busiest Arena In World

Pollstar measures "busy-ness" based on live entertainment performances and purposely excludes sports, therefore Sprint Center is doing fantastic in the live performance business, but the arenas ahead of them all are all taking the concert revenue in addition to revenues generated from sports tenants.

You're right about a lack of a willing owner, though. It's kind of unsurprising, too, because like I said I simply don't look at KC as a town capable of supporting a NHL team.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

if its the only way to own a second Toronto team ??? ... I think the loopy demand trumps this consideration you bring up ... plus the expansion price would be 1 bill instead of 2 bill

the tickets would still be overpriced ... maybe they split arena related revenue

the point is there wont be a second team in TO unless MLSE gets paid ... why pay them the extortionar ... err ... I mean ... "relocation fee" plus have to build your own building when you can placate them with ongoing revenue and avoid incremental infrastructure costs

Because Toronto needs a secondary NHL-sized entertainment venue and the start-up costs would be worth it in the long run.

I'm under no impression that MLSE wouldn't fight tooth and nail to prevent a second Toronto franchise, and would extor...er...request a sizeable fee for waiving their territorial rights. I just think even with all of that, it's still good business.

 

[Nasty_Magician]

I thought one of the conerns about a 2nd Toronto area team is the potential impact it would have on the Sabres? Leafs will survive no problem but can Buffalo afford to have potential fans poached by a new team?

 

[dash]

I thought one of the conerns about a 2nd Toronto area team is the potential impact it would have on the Sabres? Leafs will survive no problem but can Buffalo afford to have potential fans poached by a new team?

One of my favourite Bossman lines was "If Toronto area fans want to see NHL hockey in person, all they have to do is drive 90 minutes to Buffalo"

 

[jstewismybastardson]

Sekeres to Gallagher in the cesspool: "im not gonna ask you who your sources are because Im not David Pratt"











/how good is that?

 

[forty_three]

And today, that would be his only source of revenue

Wonder if he saw that coming?

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

One of my favourite Bossman lines was "If Toronto area fans want to see NHL hockey in person, all they have to do is drive 90 minutes to Buffalo"

What's funny is since 2000, the Leafs and Sabres have each made the playoffs 6 times. Of those 6 playoffs, both teams have won 5 series. The main difference is that Toronto had a span of 9 years in between playoff appearances. Looks to me that the only point of driving 90 minutes to watch bad hockey in Buffalo as opposed to Toronto is if I have a desire to get carjacked leaving the arena.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Wonder if he saw that coming?

I'm pretty sure there were iPhone advertisements back then

 

[dash]

Looks to me that the only point of driving 90 minutes to watch bad hockey in Buffalo as opposed to Toronto is if I have a desire to get carjacked leaving the arena.

Oh snap.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

is there a number out there on how many Ontarians are Buffalo Sabre season ticket holders ?

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

is there a number out there on how many Ontarians are Buffalo Sabre season ticket holders ?

According to this, 15%. This is commensurate with numbers the Bills release about Canadian ticket holders to their games.

The Sabres also have a deal with Bell to broadcast in Southern Ontario.

 

[blindbaby]

 

[blindbaby]

What's funny is since 2000, the Leafs and Sabres have each made the playoffs 6 times. Of those 6 playoffs, both teams have won 5 series. The main difference is that Toronto had a span of 9 years in between playoff appearances. Looks to me that the only point of driving 90 minutes to watch bad hockey in Buffalo as opposed to Toronto is if I have a desire to get carjacked leaving the arena.