Russell Wilson is starting a pretty impressive list

[cwood]

Cant believe a thread about Russell Wilson is being used for Packer fans to cry like babies. Get over it. I hate how the 05 Super Bowl went down for the Hawks and that was the SUPER BOWL but you get over it because NO ONE cares.

Packer fans are Wilson fans by default. The fail mary is just fun because so many people try to defend a terrible call for some strange reason. Love Wilson. Think the call is fun to talk about. Glad you're so obviously over the 05 Super Bowl.

 

[Tacoma_canuck]

please, tell me you can read....I said Foles and Tannihill have exceeded expectations....no where did I say they were better than RW....

Foles is playing better than RW though....

Look I understand how your look at this...no different than I am looking at Alex Smith right now and can't believe how dumb the 9ers were to part with him after 12 games still....the homer glasses are still on even if they are the fades that darken only when outside...

RW is a good QB...just putting him up with Brady (will never be better than), Brees, Romo, guys who have proven over a longer time that they have done it is sorta pointless....thats like saying after Cam Newtons rookie year he is the best QB ever in the NFL...sort of dumb actually

He is a very good QB so far and "potentially" him, Foles, Tannihill, RGIII, Newton ALL have it to be great...be very lucky to see 50 percent of them actually become great...who was the big QB the Vikings had that everyone thought was going to be the best QB of all time because he could even run goal line at 275, then right out of football, it could happen to any of these guys.

Well, look, it looks like this thread is COMPLETELY all over the board in topics so I am done out of my mind blowing up....let the fail mary go, crap, or not, keep arguing about it, they are waiting for you to finish to decide if it gets reversed or not.

I'm tired of hearing how great these "kids" are. They may or may not become great but who the hell knows. I love what I've seen so far in RW but even he knows and says often, he has a long way to go and a lot to learn. That's another thing I admire in him. He isn't getting ahead of himself. Who Seattle has beaten since the beginning of last year has to do with the total team and all the other stuff is useless hyperbole. Regardless of all the NFL and ESPN hype, QB's do not play against each other. WRs, RBs, O-Line, Defense, ST players, etc.etc. Last time I checked, one QB does not equal 53 guys.

 

[WizardHawk]

No I have and when Okaug(spelling) and that other guy was out he looked like crap.... when they are back he just sat back there and picked the Saints apart.... And OP was going over his list from the entire two years of his career his OLine had only been depleted for a series of about 5 games.

Um, they didn't lose during that time did they? He got the plays he needed to when we needed it despite having the worst line in football ahead of him in several games. THE WORST IN FOOTBALL. I mean really. Your bias is showing here.

SF had less injuries and ended up with Kaepernick looking like a deer in headlights. I could go on, but then you have your mind made up so why?

I will say that what you should have noticed is when Wilson was getting knocked down more than every other QB in the league during that span he didn't panic and make mistakes. He didn't force plays and throw picks. He took what was there and threw it away when there wasn't anything and that is all you can ask of someone in that position. He has a ton of poise for someone so young in the league. If you choose not to see that then so be it.

 

[WizardHawk]

Then you guys should stop counting your home win streak and start putting a * next to it.

Um, no. It's a fact that Wilson is undefeated at home. Fact, not opinion. Yours is an opinion. Just like Wisconsin STILL lost to ASU. No amount of whining over it will change it. It only makes you look like a baby to keep up on it.

 

[David_son]

I gave a fucking chart based on the actual pressures and sacks recorded from every game. It has Washington ranked #12 and Seattle #32 in pass blocking.

Those are real numbers. I don't blame you from running away from an argument based on reality when your argument is not supported by reality. It's quite predictable.

Sorry didnt realize till now but I ment to say the opposite. Seattles line is better then the Redskins I was meaning to not agree with what you said.

 

[David_son]

Um, they didn't lose during that time did they? He got the plays he needed to when we needed it despite having the worst line in football ahead of him in several games. THE WORST IN FOOTBALL. I mean really. Your bias is showing here.

SF had less injuries and ended up with Kaepernick looking like a deer in headlights. I could go on, but then you have your mind made up so why?

I will say that what you should have noticed is when Wilson was getting knocked down more than every other QB in the league during that span he didn't panic and make mistakes. He didn't force plays and throw picks. He took what was there and threw it away when there wasn't anything and that is all you can ask of someone in that position. He has a ton of poise for someone so young in the league. If you choose not to see that then so be it.

I guess I should have edited instead of just adding another post again saying he played like crap was not an accurate statement but I think even homer fans can see that when the line is Healthy RW play is improved by a significant amount. I guess that can be said about all QBs. My point is that you can tell how good the line can be compared to other lines and if you put Rodgers behind that line all passing records would probably fall.


I wasnt bringing Kapernick into the discussion but since you did the injuries for the 49ers were a little different they mainly had them at skill positions and Kap played like crap for a 3 game time i have no reason to say he didnt.

 

[JDM]

You CAN catch a ball with one hand. But under these circumstances, Tate could not have had any kind of control over the ball for several reasons I have mentioned above. It's apparent you are not reading many of my points that fully back up my argument, so think what you want. I'm done with you.

He did, though. The entire time. He didn't have complete control long after making the catch, but in essence the standard once he got the first hand on it and it stuck is the same as a fumble and recovery. Else the worst they can call it is a simultaneous catch and even that would have been generous to Green Bay here. The second the ball touches Tate's hand first, it has to move relative to his hand for it be possibly be anything but him catching it.

 

[David_son]

I gave a fucking chart based on the actual pressures and sacks recorded from every game. It has Washington ranked #12 and Seattle #32 in pass blocking.

Those are real numbers. I don't blame you from running away from an argument based on reality when your argument is not supported by reality. It's quite predictable.

NFL Stats: by Team Category

Washington line has given up more sacks and QB hits

Plus RG3 has had more runs which when tackled dont count as QB hit or Sack. though it is only 2 more.

 

[David_son]

Um, no. It's a fact that Wilson is undefeated at home. Fact, not opinion. Yours is an opinion. Just like Wisconsin STILL lost to ASU. No amount of whining over it will change it. It only makes you look like a baby to keep up on it.

Not a Packers or Seahawks fan so either way it doesnt effect how bad the Bills are... That being said you could just admit that you were kinda given one.


It is useless to argue either way or any of the many blow and terrible calls in the game maybe instead of arguing that there is no way the call could be wrong and be like yeah sure might have been a bad call people will get past it.

 

[WizardHawk]

I guess I should have edited instead of just adding another post again saying he played like crap was not an accurate statement but I think even homer fans can see that when the line is Healthy RW play is improved by a significant amount. I guess that can be said about all QBs. My point is that you can tell how good the line can be compared to other lines and if you put Rodgers behind that line all passing records would probably fall.


I wasnt bringing Kapernick into the discussion but since you did the injuries for the 49ers were a little different they mainly had them at skill positions and Kap played like crap for a 3 game time i have no reason to say he didnt.

I've never claimed, and wouldn't dare claim, that Wilson is better than Rogers. I would only compare him to others two years in and/or where other QB's were near the end of their second season. After all that is fair to do. Of course some other QB's would do well with this same team, but you are giving far too much credit to their line. I would say when healthy they have an above average line, but what about the quality (or lack there of) of the WR corp? Would you put ANY Seahawk WR in the top of the league? And yet somehow Wilson finds enough gaps to get them the ball and rarely puts it anywhere where the other team can get it. He has a great feel for who is hot and spreads the ball around about as well as anyone else in the league.

So yes, his line is part of the story of the team and so is the running of Lynch. They don't throw nearly as much as some other teams and yet when they do ask him to throw he does so about as well as anyone else in the league this year. He has been a wizard at extending broken plays and limits his mistakes. Not sure what more he could do.

Not a Packers or Seahawks fan so either way it doesnt effect how bad the Bills are... That being said you could just admit that you were kinda given one.

I have said clearly ever since that game that their should have been an offensive PI on that last play and that alone should have been reason enough to end the game without the TD. But why is it not also a part of the story to talk about the calls that went GB's way as well? Doesn't it cut both ways? How can people tell us to deal with the last play and yet they all won't deal with the rest of the bad calls? It just never ceases to amaze me.

 

[David_son]

I've never claimed, and wouldn't dare claim, that Wilson is better than Rogers. I would only compare him to others two years in and/or where other QB's were near the end of their second season. After all that is fair to do. Of course some other QB's would do well with this same team, but you are giving far too much credit to their line. I would say when healthy they have an above average line, but what about the quality (or lack there of) of the WR corp? Would you put ANY Seahawk WR in the top of the league? And yet somehow Wilson finds enough gaps to get them the ball and rarely puts it anywhere where the other team can get it. He has a great feel for who is hot and spreads the ball around about as well as anyone else in the league.

So yes, his line is part of the story of the team and so is the running of Lynch. They don't throw nearly as much as some other teams and yet when they do ask him to throw he does so about as well as anyone else in the league this year. He has been a wizard at extending broken plays and limits his mistakes. Not sure what more he could do.


I have said clearly ever since that game that their should have been an offensive PI on that last play and that alone should have been reason enough to end the game without the TD. But why is it not also a part of the story to talk about the calls that went GB's way as well? Doesn't it cut both ways? How can people tell us to deal with the last play and yet they all won't deal with the rest of the bad calls? It just never ceases to amaze me.

Oh I will that I believe 4th down play near the goal line a bit questionable. to be fair they did review it and still made the call. I think it comes down to both sides had equal amount of bad calls to help them out so you end up looking at one that decided the game.


And to be fair to Packer Fans the mention of the Music City Miracle still pisses me off and that was like 12 years ago.

 

[BeastHawk]

Here's an interesting angle of the "catch". M.D. Jennings has both hands on it while pulling it into his chest. Tate might have his left hand on it at this point, but hard to tell. Replays show that Tate's right hand never actually touched the ball till they were going to the ground.

Milwaukee Journal Sentinel - Milwaukee, Wis. - Packers-Seahawks Front Pages - Photos - SI.com

Oh yea, and let's not forget why Sam Shields is laying on the ground.

Since you mention that, why not tell everyone about Jennings having both knees planted firmly on Charley Martin's back while he was trying to make that grab.

 

[BeastHawk]

Jennings had the ball first. Not sure what you are talking about..

You should just leave it at that since your knowledge of football amounts to precisely dick! Obviously you don't know that possession doesn't occur until both feet are on the ground in the field of play. So, whether Jennings had two hands or 3 hooves and a tentacle first, it just doesn't matter. Tate had his left hand firmly on the ball and both feet on the ground. Hell he had both hands on the ball before Jennings even touched the ground with his feet. In short; you can't possess the ball while still in the air.

 

[MajorPackersFan]

Since you mention that, why not tell everyone about Jennings having both knees planted firmly on Charley Martin's back while he was trying to make that grab.

WAT? Are looking at the same picture I am? Are you trying to tell me that in the picture I posted, M.D. Jennings has both of his knees planted firmly on Charley Martin's back? Look again....please. No wonder Seahawks fans think it was a catch. They can't even look at a simple picture and see what's really happening.

 

[Mondio]

I have said clearly ever since that game that their should have been an offensive PI on that last play and that alone should have been reason enough to end the game without the TD. But why is it not also a part of the story to talk about the calls that went GB's way as well? Doesn't it cut both ways? How can people tell us to deal with the last play and yet they all won't deal with the rest of the bad calls? It just never ceases to amaze me.

I normally talk about bad calls, just because they were bad calls. I like to think what "could" have been after a loss, i'm a fan. Sue me.

But I normally don't put too much stock in it either, it's just something to talk about. But I do think this one was different. Most times, there are 10-20-40, etc more plays that can change the outcome. This one happened to have happened on the very last play. Nothing else in the entire game needed to change other than the right call to be made.

And there were missed calls both ways. I remember some roughing the passer's and nullified int's on some BS calls too that game, all which "could" have changed the game. But that last one, it DID change the outcome of the game and there was nothing else that could have affected it.

anyway, that was a long time ago. I''m just hoping our team doesn't totally collapse this year, because they looked like they did last week.

BTW, Wilson is doing exactly what I thought he would in the NFL. He does have a luxury of playing behind a pretty decent OL, and have a good RB and defense to back him up as well, but that doesn't take away that he is smart, he has a good arm, he can make a mistake and learn quickly and he's very athletic. I think if you take any of those other pieces away, it will affect the team, as it would any team. I also think he's talented enough to cover up a lot of deficiencies should they arise as well, he just hasn't had to prove that yet. You're lucky to have him.

 

[cwood]

You should just leave it at that since your knowledge of football amounts to precisely dick! Obviously you don't know that possession doesn't occur until both feet are on the ground in the field of play. So, whether Jennings had two hands or 3 hooves and a tentacle first, it just doesn't matter. Tate had his left hand firmly on the ball and both feet on the ground. Hell he had both hands on the ball before Jennings even touched the ground with his feet. In short; you can't possess the ball while still in the air.

Lol, but that has nothing to do with how the rule works in reality. Possession goes to the player who establishes control first, and control can be established before touching the ground. Who hit the ground first or the fact that Tate established control before they hit the ground are irrelevant. Jennings had control of the ball before Tate and should have been given the interception.

 

[Smart]

NFL Stats: by Team Category

Washington line has given up more sacks and QB hits

And yet Seattle is pressured more (as my chart shows). Which means that (gasp) Russell is more elusive than 2013 RG3.

So again, all you are doing is proving my point. A healthy RG3 is a great, top eight quarterback. A healthy RG3 on the Seahawks is probably leading a 10-2 or 11-1 team. But when you say that 2013 RG3 is as good as Russell and that he is brought down by his supporting cast, you are dead and indefensibly wrong. And when your argument bringing down Russell is "his offensive line is too good" when he has the WORST passing protecting in in the NFL, you look stupid.

 

[JDM]

Lol, but that has nothing to do with how the rule works in reality. Possession goes to the player who establishes control first, and control can be established before touching the ground. Who hit the ground first or the fact that Tate established control before they hit the ground are irrelevant. Jennings had control of the ball before Tate and should have been given the interception.

No, he didn't. That's not even in the ballpark of reality.

 

[gohusk]

NFL Stats: by Team Category

Washington line has given up more sacks and QB hits

Plus RG3 has had more runs which when tackled dont count as QB hit or Sack. though it is only 2 more.

Stop making excuses. Griffin's playing poorly. His instincts are telling him one thing but his knee is telling him something else so he's going to have to re-learn the position if he's going to make it. Wilson has played in pro-style offenses since college so he doesn't have to make those adjustments.

 

[STBR 27]

Lol, but that has nothing to do with how the rule works in reality. Possession goes to the player who establishes control first, and control can be established before touching the ground. Who hit the ground first or the fact that Tate established control before they hit the ground are irrelevant. Jennings had control of the ball before Tate and should have been given the interception.

I love how GB fans are still butthurt over a week 3 game that ended up meaning nothing in the grand scheme of things last year and at times have compared this game to what happened to the Seahawks in the SB, because week 3 games are equal to the SB.

That said, if Tate doesn't stop the ball from moving forward with his left hand, it hits Jennings in the facemask and probably falls incomplete because he was not going to close his hands/arms fast enough to make the catch. Tate's left hand never leaves the ball all the way to the ground, so the only call that could be made is a simultaneous catch, which goes to the offense and is a TD. The correct call was made.

The push off is not questionable, it should have been called, but wasn't and many "should have been called" incidents happen all the time. There were many other bad calls in that game that benefited or hurt both teams and TBH it would be best to just forget this game ever happened and move on.