Royals take the series from the Tigers, again

[ImSmartherThanYou]

Pujols career is not over.. his foot injury limited him... last year was a decent yr.. not by his standards.. but it was a legit year...

I would not bet against Pujols coming back and hitting 30+ hr 2 or 3 more times and hitting around .300... The whole.. "the guy is finished" argument after one down season is just stupid... Anyone that wants to believe Verlander can't have more great seasons, or Pujols will never be a great hitter again can play in my fantasy league next year.

I didn't say he was finished, but his prime is clearly over. His down years are still career years for most guys, but he won't be the same.

And it all happened around the age Cabrera is now. So let's not pretend that Cabrera is a safe bet to stay the best hitter in baseball for another 4-5 years. I'd say it's more likely he stays elite than fall apart the way Pujols has, but it's no sure thing either.

 

[MiamiVice]

There really aren't many. Seriously, go look. Maybe a handful, if that. I had this same discussion when defending Brett Gardner as the Yankees' leadoff hitter. Jackson is a better hitter than Gardner, and Gardner was 5th in MLB in leadoff OBP when I was having the discussion (back in July I believe).

Jackson is no franchise player, but guys like him don't grow on trees like you seem to be suggesting here. And he's still developing.

Not saying they grow on trees.. just saying I would not open the wallet and over pay for him.. the Tigers have another guy that can lead off... Iglesias could be a future leadoff hitter... look at his OBP... I am just saying to over pay for him is not money well spent... If its the only hole you have on your team keeping you from contending.. you spend the money... but if you can replace him with a cheaper option and put the money in a better spot.. I do it...

 

[MiamiVice]

"He's fast and he's a CF. He's gotta lead off." - Jim Leyland, Dusty Baker, and every other mindless manager stuck in the 1980s.

My favorite Leylandism... he plays second base... so he should hit 2nd LOL..

 

[MiamiVice]

I didn't say he was finished, but his prime is clearly over. His down years are still career years for most guys, but he won't be the same.

And it all happened around the age Cabrera is now. So let's not pretend that Cabrera is a safe bet to stay the best hitter in baseball for another 4-5 years. I'd say it's more likely he stays elite than fall apart the way Pujols has, but it's no sure thing either.

Its not about being the best hitter for 4-5 years... its about building a team with guys you trust to hit when it counts... and score runs... There are not many guys I take when I need a score than Pujols or Miggy... that is why they get paid what they do.. and that is what you sign them to long term contracts for... If they lead the league in stats its great.. but you look at options as a whole for the lineup/money spent/ risk... and some guys are just worth the risk... I am sorry.. but I would rather have a 33 yr old Prince Fielder in my lineup than 85% of other options in 4 years... or a 35 yr old miggy... Like I said.. its not always about stats... its about risk reward...

I love Billy Beanes approach to building a team.. but he shows that building a team bases on stats may work in the reg season.. but come playoff time and in condensed series... Overall physical talent wins more times than not.

 

[StanMarsh51]

Its not about being the best hitter for 4-5 years... its about building a team with guys you trust to hit when it counts... and score runs... There are not many guys I take when I need a score than Pujols or Miggy... that is why they get paid what they do.. and that is what you sign them to long term contracts for... If they lead the league in stats its great.. but you look at options as a whole for the lineup/money spent/ risk... and some guys are just worth the risk... I am sorry.. but I would rather have a 33 yr old Prince Fielder in my lineup than 85% of other options in 4 years... or a 35 yr old miggy... Like I said.. its not always about stats... its about risk reward...

I love Billy Beanes approach to building a team.. but he shows that building a team bases on stats may work in the reg season.. but come playoff time and in condensed series... Overall physical talent wins more times than not.

I'd say it's more of a crapshoot in the playoffs than actually 'building for the playoffs'...it's who gets hot at the right time, many of which we can't predict.

 

[_Xer0_]

i like Jackson but he is not a good leadoff hitter.

if he knew how to bunt and get out of the batters box fast he would be great in that spot, but he sucks at doing both of those things.

id like to see Iglesias at leadoff but he hacks out of the strikezone too often.

 

[MiamiVice]

i like Jackson but he is not a good leadoff hitter.

if he knew how to bunt and get out of the batters box fast he would be great in that spot, but he sucks at doing both of those things.

id like to see Iglesias at leadoff but he hacks out of the strikezone too often.

Jackson is an above average lead off hitter... I believe Iglesias will be one day also...

Just curious.. how many lead off bunts do you see to start the game? OBP is what matters.. not bunting... who cares if your leadoff guy can bunt.. bunting is actually more of a skill a 2 hole hitter should have to move a runner over...

 

[MiamiVice]

I'd say it's more of a crapshoot in the playoffs than actually 'building for the playoffs'...it's who gets hot at the right time, many of which we can't predict.

No.. I would say pitching is overall better in the playoffs... and guys that had great advanced stats that were getting on base against #4 or #5 pitchers don't perform the way real talent does. When it comes down to it... Pitching changes every situation... if you have great pitching.. which most playoff teams do... you can shut down fringe talent... most teams go with their top 3 or 4 guys in a 7 game series... so you are not seeing the weaker starters and the bullpen depth is usually better by adding the #4 or #5 starter to the pen... Pitching dictates everything in the playoffs. If you have it.. you will move on.

 

[Cleaves2000]

I'd say it's more of a crapshoot in the playoffs than actually 'building for the playoffs'...it's who gets hot at the right time, many of which we can't predict.

.....so true....been saying it all year.....just like hockey also.....usually a hot goalie wins you a cup....

 

[Howie115]

The whole.. "the guy is finished" argument after one down season is just stupid...

Just see David Ortiz, post-2009.

 

[Cleaves2000]

Jackson is an above average lead off hitter... I believe Iglesias will be one day also...

Just curious.. how many lead off bunts do you see to start the game? OBP is what matters.. not bunting... who cares if your leadoff guy can bunt.. bunting is actually more of a skill a 2 hole hitter should have to move a runner over...

Leyland doesnt believe in bunting.....i notice tori is usually the only one to try n bunt for hits.....im usually shocked when the tigers sac bunt

 

[Cleaves2000]

I didn't say he was finished, but his prime is clearly over. His down years are still career years for most guys, but he won't be the same.

And it all happened around the age Cabrera is now. So let's not pretend that Cabrera is a safe bet to stay the best hitter in baseball for another 4-5 years. I'd say it's more likely he stays elite than fall apart the way Pujols has, but it's no sure thing either.

Pujols turned 33 in jan.....miggy turned 30 in april.....thats over 3 yrs between the two.......that means miggy will be pujols age in 2016 season...i said 3-4 pretty good years left in miggy.....if he DH's more, could be longer.

 

[Cleaves2000]

Just see David Ortiz, post-2009.

Also when saying that fielder wont last because hes fat.....ortiz is big and hes still playing at 37

 

[StanMarsh51]

No.. I would say pitching is overall better in the playoffs... and guys that had great advanced stats that were getting on base against #4 or #5 pitchers don't perform the way real talent does. When it comes down to it... Pitching changes every situation... if you have great pitching.. which most playoff teams do... you can shut down fringe talent... most teams go with their top 3 or 4 guys in a 7 game series... so you are not seeing the weaker starters and the bullpen depth is usually better by adding the #4 or #5 starter to the pen... Pitching dictates everything in the playoffs. If you have it.. you will move on.

And a lot of times, that 'dominant' pitching performance comes out of nowhere, hence the crapshoot....I mean, did anyone really expect the likes of Jeff Weaver, Jeff Suppan, Carl Pavano, Sterling Hitchcock after mediocre seasons to become playoff heroes just like that? I think a lot of that happens by luck...these guys get hot at the right time.

 

[MiamiVice]

I think Miggy can stay a top ten offensive player for the next 5-6 yrs... Plenty of guys like him so it... Ortiz is a great example.. and Miggy is a much better hitter than Ortiz with a better skill set to keep him going.

 

[MiamiVice]

And a lot of times, that 'dominant' pitching performance comes out of nowhere, hence the crapshoot....I mean, did anyone really expect the likes of Jeff Weaver, Jeff Suppan, Carl Pavano, Sterling Hitchcock after mediocre seasons to become playoff heroes just like that? I think a lot of that happens by luck...these guys get hot at the right time.

Playoff pitching performances can't really be said to come out of no where.. because scrubs are not starting those games... like I said... its usually a 3 or 4 man rotation.. its not like back end starters are coming up big in the playoffs with regularity.. because they are not starting in the playoffs.

 

[StanMarsh51]

Playoff pitching performances can't really be said to come out of no where.. because scrubs are not starting those games... like I said... its usually a 3 or 4 man rotation.. its not like back end starters are coming up big in the playoffs with regularity.. because they are not starting in the playoffs.

All those guys I just listed had mediocre (or worse) seasons the year they went on their playoff tear. #3 and #4 pitchers tend to be mediocre, even for many good teams, so the fact that guys guys who were deemed mediocre come out of nowhere to dominate certainly points to part of the equation being luck/crapshoot.

Derek Lowe's another guy to add to the list, who after posting a 4.92 ERA and 1.51 WHIP in 2003 + 2004 combined, went 3-0 with a 1.86 ERA in the '04 playoffs when Boston won

 

[MiamiVice]

Seriously.. Derek Lowe having a nice stretch is not surprising... Look at his paycheck from his last few seasons... I think someone thought he was good. Same with the rest... OK.. some guys have rough reg seasons and stick up.. but saying Jered Weaver dominating is surprising? LOL Playoffs tend to bring out the best of people... Motivated talent steps up... Its not like these guys were total scrubs like you are suggesting.

 

[MiamiVice]

stan.. why is it you always try to argue with everything I say... seriously.. you argue that it isn't any harder for a batter to get a hit with a runner on third... now this? Did you play baseball.. or do you just like reading the stats on the back of your baseball card collection?

 

[MiamiVice]

I have never seen stan actually agree with anyone on this site.. not once..