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NBA OFF TOPIC THREAD

Stakesarehigh

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Not saying the Browns should do it,

But that is exactly what most Laker fans were saying about the prospect of trading Ball, Ingram, etc for a proven star.

If Rodgers can get the Browns a Super Bowl it is worth it.

Because chances are Baker won’t.

Most “good young QBs” don’t ever get 1.

Not even remotely the same.

There are multiple examples of teams winning or making super bowls with average to just above average qbs.

There is one example of a no superstars team winning it all. The 04 Pistons. And maybe..... maybe Ingram is on par or could be with any of their top 4 guys.

Plus you don't get just Lebron there... but another star because he's there.
 

Stakesarehigh

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Plus it isn't just Baker for Rodgers. It's Baker AND two first round picks AND a defensive starter.

I mean wtf lol
 

trojanfan12

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Not even remotely the same.

There are multiple examples of teams winning or making super bowls with average to just above average qbs.

Defense and a running game can win Super Bowls. I mean, Trent Dilfer is a super bowl winning QB.

The Ravens with Joe Flacco. When Denver won theirs with Peyton Manning, they darn near won in spite of him, not because of him. Seattle's Super Bowl win was more about The Legion of Boom and Beast Mode than about Russell Wilson. That's just off the top of my head.

If Baker doesn't improve even at all over last year...he is good enough for the Browns to win a super bowl.
 

Stakesarehigh

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Defense and a running game can win Super Bowls. I mean, Trent Dilfer is a super bowl winning QB.

The Ravens with Joe Flacco. When Denver won theirs with Peyton Manning, they darn near won in spite of him, not because of him. Seattle's Super Bowl win was more about The Legion of Boom and Beast Mode than about Russell Wilson. That's just off the top of my head.

If Baker doesn't improve even at all over last year...he is good enough for the Browns to win a super bowl.

This

Plus if the Browns went for it and missed that would destroy what they've built. The stigma would take decades to shake off. Better to go with what they've done and miss then trade for Rodgers and miss. That's too big of a risk
 

tlance

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Not even remotely the same.

There are multiple examples of teams winning or making super bowls with average to just above average qbs.

There is one example of a no superstars team winning it all. The 04 Pistons. And maybe..... maybe Ingram is on par or could be with any of their top 4 guys.

Plus you don't get just Lebron there... but another star because he's there.

Again, not saying the Browns should do it.

But if Rodgers wins a Super Bowl then any price is worth it.

And if Rodgers goes to say, Denver or another AFC team, the Browns window to win gets a lot more narrow.

Once you pay guys like Mayfield and Chubb, it is much harder to put quality pieces around them. While there are plenty of examples of average QBs winning, there are many more of average QBs not winning.
 
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Stakesarehigh

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Again, not saying the Browns should do it.

But if Rodgers wins a Super Bowl then any price is worth it.

And if Rodgers goes to say, Denver or another AFC team, the Browns window to win gets a lot more narrow.

Once you pay guys like Mayfield and Chubb, it is much harder to put quality pieces around them. While there are plenty of examples of average QBs winning, there are many more of average QBs not winning.

They will have to lose one of Landry or OBJ and have Njoku coming off for Chubbs raise
 

Stakesarehigh

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Basically the above wipes roughly 22 million off the books as well as having to go cheap to replace Jadeveon (who has a strange cap hit for next year also)
 

Wamu

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Panthers DT DaQuan Jones is spot-on with his thoughts of Tebow and the Jags.

This Tebow deal shows that personal relationships go further at this level then actual ability
 

trojanfan12

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Panthers DT DaQuan Jones is spot-on with his thoughts of Tebow and the Jags.

This Tebow deal shows that personal relationships go further at this level then actual ability

Yes and no.

I saw a couple of former players saying that pretty much every coach has a player that is a "pet something" (forget the exact word). It's basically a player that a coach is very familiar with and trusts. So that coach will bring that player with him to different teams and will try to keep him around.

I forget which coach he mentioned, but Bucky Brooks said that later in his career he was one of those players. Said he had a coach who brought him to 1 stop for a couple of years and then when that coach went to Seattle he brought him there as a scout.

I doubt Tebow makes the 53 man roster. It's seems more likely that at some point before that he will "retire as a player" and then we'll hear that he's being retained in some other capacity.
 

Wamu

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Yes and no.

I saw a couple of former players saying that pretty much every coach has a player that is a "pet something" (forget the exact word). It's basically a player that a coach is very familiar with and trusts. So that coach will bring that player with him to different teams and will try to keep him around.

I forget which coach he mentioned, but Bucky Brooks said that later in his career he was one of those players. Said he had a coach who brought him to 1 stop for a couple of years and then when that coach went to Seattle he brought him there as a scout.

I doubt Tebow makes the 53 man roster. It's seems more likely that at some point before that he will "retire as a player" and then we'll hear that he's being retained in some other capacity.

Well he ain't a QB that's for sure. And he had his chance to try playing TE about 10 years ago. I hope he makes the team & is the most expensive cheerleader in league history.


:cheer2:
 

trojanfan12

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Well he ain't a QB that's for sure. And he had his chance to try playing TE about 10 years ago. I hope he makes the team & is the most expensive cheerleader in league history.


:cheer2:

I agree that he had his shot. But, he's still young enough for 1 last try. Right now, he's a guy on a 90 man roster that will be trimmed to 53. That's not a problem because he's not taking a roster spot from anyone. Can't say I'd be any different if I were in Tebow's shoes.

If he can actually play and makes the 53 man, that's also not a problem either because he will have earned his spot.

However, if he can't play, and Urban keeps him on the 53 man...that will be a problem and he could lose the locker room. I'd hope he's smarter than that.
 

Wamu

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I agree that he had his shot. But, he's still young enough for 1 last try. Right now, he's a guy on a 90 man roster that will be trimmed to 53. That's not a problem because he's not taking a roster spot from anyone. Can't say I'd be any different if I were in Tebow's shoes.

If he can actually play and makes the 53 man, that's also not a problem either because he will have earned his spot.

However, if he can't play, and Urban keeps him on the 53 man...that will be a problem and he could lose the locker room. I'd hope he's smarter than that.

What's weird about this is Meyer's a win at all costs coach. But Tebow won't make any type of major difference. This isn't a football decision, it's a personal decision.

Loyalty to people has backfired on him already. When he kept that POS Zach Smith on his coaching staff because Earl Bruce is that dumbfucks grandpa.

But great point about the possibility of Meyer losing the locker room. That could definitely happen.
 

WiggyRuss

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I get it....but he's also trying to say "I'd deal Carr for Rodgers and he's better than Baker".

I'd deal Carr for Rodgers too if I was him.
I just looked at 3 QB "power rankings" for after the draft- and all of them had Mayfield a head of Carr- but it was pretty close.

Mayfield is younger and has more upside if you ask me. Mayfield had 4 different headcoaches and at least that many different offensive schemes his first 3 years in the league- and came into a team that was 0-16.

his obstacles have been bigger, and once he got a comfortable in the offense he was very good at the end of last year.

I think the VAST majority of GM's would take Baker over Carr in a heart beat.



and just generally- I expect the Browns to be significantly better than the Raiders for the foreseeable future- as I am sure most people do.
 

WiggyRuss

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as for Rodgers-

1. He wants to go to the West coast- not go farther East.
2. The cap situation would be a mess
3. Baker is over a decade younger
4. Baker looked great once he learned the offense, and beat the shit out of the Steelers in a playoff game.

chances of a Rodgers deal happening?

0.0%

I want to see how this team grows too. So much of the talent is young.
 

WiggyRuss

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They will have to lose one of Landry or OBJ and have Njoku coming off for Chubbs raise
OBJ will be gone and they will restructure Jarvis is my guess. Njoku will be gone too--- at certain times he has been good- but at certain times he has been horrible. At least by then they will be able to have found a decent replacement.

I expect Hooper to either restructure or be gone after this year as well.
 

trojanfan12

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What's weird about this is Meyer's a win at all costs coach. But Tebow won't make any type of major difference. This isn't a football decision, it's a personal decision.

Of course it's a personal decision. That what the "pet" thing is about. If he makes the 53 man roster (which would likely be as the 3rd TE) or heck, even if he turns out to be a starting quality TE, it's still a personal decision...it's just one that worked out.

Urban being "win at all costs" is why I think this will ultimately work out just fine. I don't think he'd keep him on the roster if he couldn't help the team.

Heard part of an interview with Urban where he said that his coaches worked Tebow out twice (Meyer said he wasn't there) and that they said he's in incredible shape and was worth a look.

But great point about the possibility of Meyer losing the locker room. That could definitely happen.

Yeah, it depends on if Meyer has a "blind spot" re: Tebow that might lead to him not being objective. If that's the case, then it could be a problem.

If it's not a "blind spot", it should be fine.

Apparently, Hard Knocks is going to be there. That'll be interesting. lol
 

Wamu

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Of course it's a personal decision. That what the "pet" thing is about. If he makes the 53 man roster (which would likely be as the 3rd TE) or heck, even if he turns out to be a starting quality TE, it's still a personal decision...it's just one that worked out.

Urban being "win at all costs" is why I think this will ultimately work out just fine. I don't think he'd keep him on the roster if he couldn't help the team.

Heard part of an interview with Urban where he said that his coaches worked Tebow out twice (Meyer said he wasn't there) and that they said he's in incredible shape and was worth a look.



Yeah, it depends on if Meyer has a "blind spot" re: Tebow that might lead to him not being objective. If that's the case, then it could be a problem.

If it's not a "blind spot", it should be fine.

Apparently, Hard Knocks is going to be there. That'll be interesting. lol

If there's a perfect landing spot of Tebow it's gonna be Jacksonville. I'm sure he's still beloved throughout most of the state due to his spectacular Gators career.

It'll be interesting to see how long it takes Urban to officially announce he's made the team. I just don't see Meyer cutting him.
 

trojanfan12

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If there's a perfect landing spot of Tebow it's gonna be Jacksonville. I'm sure he's still beloved throughout most of the state due to his spectacular Gators career.

It'll be interesting to see how long it takes Urban to officially announce he's made the team. I just don't see Meyer cutting him.

Yep. Agree 100%. Maybe Urban leaves it up to his coaches? That would probably be the smartest thing for him to do.
 

Stakesarehigh

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OBJ will be gone and they will restructure Jarvis is my guess. Njoku will be gone too--- at certain times he has been good- but at certain times he has been horrible. At least by then they will be able to have found a decent replacement.

I expect Hooper to either restructure or be gone after this year as we'll

Hooper would have to take a restructure but the Browns are on the hook for him he's almost all dead cap
 

Wamu

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Yep. Agree 100%. Maybe Urban leaves it up to his coaches? That would probably be the smartest thing for him to do.

I personally wanna see him start under center week one. After all he has NFL experience playing QB and Trevor doesn't.
 
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